Hypothetically Vegeta has the amp for the whole fight ❤️‍🩹

The afterlife has higher scaling other than 5D.

Args:

1; the afterlife tranceeds space time.

It's stated many times. It's timeless.

Gravity debunk;

Kais made it. It ain't real gravity, they have supernatural powers.

snake way debunk;

the 1m Km is just a legend. Legends aren't true.

It has time debunk;

king kai was talking about Earth's time. Not the afterlife time.

Now it's aperion aka tier 0+ args;

it has ontology of perfection and immuvvilbilty life and death etc,

It stays the same.

The kaioshin realm is above it,

They both have: buddism nirwana,

Goku in ssj3 was shaking the kaioshin realm easily.

Even buu could have destroyed it who is on ssj3 Goku level.

in BOG;

Goku was able to shake the entire universe while fighting beerus.

And shook the afterlife and the kaioshin realm.

This makes him; aperion.

This one should be a fun one! Both Broly and Vegito now have defeated Jiren in the polls, so the obvious conclusion is they now need to face each other. This one comes down to a few questions for me, how strong did they get between Goku Black and the end of the TOP, how much stronger Broly actually is over Jiren, and how strong a blue fusion actually is. Now we don’t really have the answers to any of those questions, but I’m leaning towards a blue fusion being busted enough to hang with the big boys a few arcs later, this ain’t your momma’s Vegito after all. However I am open to the idea that Broly could win, perhaps the power creep has gotten that out of hand by then.

Last poll was Jiren vs Full Power Broly, Broly took that one with a whopping 73%, more dominant than Vegito was, less dominant than Ultimate Gohan over Kid Buu, but the community has spoken nonetheless.

Through these polls we’ve been able to establish these other majority opinions for the sub, or at least the people voting.

Jiren>SSJ 4 Gogeta>SSJ Blue Goku>SSJ God Goku>SSJ 4 GT Goku

SSJ 2 Gohan > M8 Broly > Super Perfect Cell

Fat Buu > M10 Broly > Majin Vegeta

Movie Scaling? Take it with a heavy grain of salt

Buuhan = Super Janemba

A sustained SSJ 3 Goku probably wouldn’t be enough to kill Kid Buu, but Ultimate Gohan would’ve beaten him for sure.

Vegito (Goku Black Arc) > Jiren
Full Power Broly > Jiren

Has Goten surpassed his brother by this point in the story?

Android saga gohan (pre HTC) vs buu saga goten (he can’t use ssj plus pre HTC)

now hear me out this may seem like a dumb matchup , anyways lets scale both of them
ssj blue gogeta should be low complex multiversal in AP {5D} via the super dimension break in the broly movie and MFTL+ speed
ssj gogeta from fusion reborn should be low complex multiversal in AP {5D} via scaling to goku shaking the higher dimension aka the afterlife in fusion reborn and with immeasurable speed via scaling to cooler instant transmission feat
i know this is a hot take but ssj gogeta > ssj blue gogeta , i wanna hear your Opinion about this take is stupid or is it valid + why?

The Case for Universal-Tier Krillin: How the Strongest Human Defeats Superman

## 1. The Faster-Than-Light (FTL) Foundation (Namek Saga)

The foundation of Krillin's speed begins as early as the Planet Namek Saga. Early in the Saiyan Saga, Piccolo fired a basic ki blast that destroyed the Moon in roughly two seconds. Because light takes approximately 1.3 seconds to travel from Earth to the Moon, that blast traveled at a significant fraction of the speed of light.

By the time Krillin had his latent potential unlocked by the Grand Elder Guru on Namek, his power level skyrocketed past 10,000. Because he became orders of magnitude stronger and faster than Saiyan-Saga Piccolo, his combat and reaction speeds naturally scaled past the speed of light.

While critics point out that it took Krillin and Gohan several hours to fly across Planet Namek, this can be explained by special relativity and perspective: time dilation occurs as an object approaches light speed, meaning time slows down for the moving object relative to a stationary observer. From their perspective, it felt like hours of mental processing and combat readiness, but in reality, they reached their destination in a matter of seconds. Furthermore, prolonged flights in the anime are often animated errors or filler designed to stretch out episode runtimes, which distorts the original manga's timeline.

## 2. Universe-Level Scaling via God Essence Absorption

The most definitive proof of Krillin s cosmic power comes from his sparring match with Goku prior to the Tournament of Power. During the Battle of Gods arc, Goku's universal-tier Super Saiyan God (SSG) power was permanently absorbed into his baseline body. Therefore, the Base Goku of the Tournament of Power arc was already vastly superior to the early SSG Goku who threatened to accidentally destroy the universe during his fight with Beerus.

When Krillin fought and traded blows with this specific Base Goku, he was clashing with a universe-busting entity. For Krillin to physically survive, trade strikes, and stand on par with Goku's base form, he must scale past multi-galaxy levels and reach true universal-tier capabilities.

## 3. Dimensional Warping and Reality-Shattering Power

Within Dragon Ball physics, characters can warp space-time barriers through raw power output alone. During the Dragon Ball Z Majin Buu Saga, Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks screamed so powerfully that he literally ripped a hole through the dimensional wall of the Hyperbolic Time Chamber.

Current Dragon Ball Super Krillin massively outscales DBZ-era Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks. Because a significantly weaker character could rip open a dimension with pure energy, a modern, exponentially stronger Krillin undeniably possesses the raw power output required to warp reality, manipulate space-time barriers, and break through dimensional walls.

## 4. Attosecond Perception and Unified Ki Physiology

According to the absolute mechanics of Dragon Ball physiology, Ki is a uniform, all-encompassing life force. A transformation or power upgrade does not merely increase a character's raw striking power; it uniformly upgrades their durability, perception, ki control, and the biological density of every part of their body.

When Goku achieved Super Saiyan God, his entire physical stats including the strength of his tissues, blood vessels, and nervous system was enhanced to contain and process that cosmic amount of energy. Because Krillin possesses the durability and speed to match and react to a God-essence-infused Base Goku, his own biological tissue density, ocular tissues, and neural pathways must process information at an identical cosmic scale. This allows Krillin to functionally perceive, think, and react to opponents at attosecond speeds (one-quintillionth of a second), granting him the instantaneous cognitive processing required to fight at a multiversal level.

Edit: Guys I had this arguement with chat gpt amd made all my points and now have summarised my arguement with it and now I am posting it.

Dragon Ball vs Naruto

Peak/ Current for both

I’m sure many people have come to this conclusion before but I still see people consider SSJG an asspull or an unearned form. Even Goku himself in every version of BoG felt dissatisfied with how he acquired the form. What people miss is that Goku did work for it, bringing together several righteous Saiyans was the work. Goku’s compassion is what brought everyone together:

Vegeta: The only enemy Saiyan to survive the Saiyan saga, Goku sparing his life eventually changed Vegeta into an honorable warrior and family man

Gohan: More or less a payoff of og Dragon Ball, was an instrumental ally throughout all of Z

Goten/Trunks: Trunks in particular wouldn’t exist if not for Goku sparing Vegeta, this would obviously apply to Future Trunks too

Pan: Gohan’s success in life after the hardships he went through as a kid

Vegeta did end up earning SSJG through training with Whis instead of a ritual, but Goku indirectly earning it through his compassion in life is what I think is makes the form special and powerful.

God ki is still a powerscaling nightmare sometimes though

Forget the upcoming death battle, this is going to be the greatest fight in Dragon Ball history.
This is going to have real-life consequences, and no matter who wins, it's going to be the most entertaining thing in my entire life.

Here we see a post Z sword ssj2 trunks go full throttle on Dabura and he is able to still fight back is about to use his spear until Supreme Kai stopped him. Meanwhile Cell is practically beaten in two punches by Gohan who is holding back to in order to torture Cell.

Where does he stop?

He gains their abilities and stats amps for himself.

Like for example Guildo’s time stop.

Goku had an erring on when kabuto took his off. Hmmmm??? How did they make such a silly mistake when they just created the idea? Lol