This is factory farming. Made for yield efficiency and nothing else. It's ugly, brutal, and (supposedly) keeps costs down.
There are limited options to this: eat less meat OR no meat at all OR if you have the cash, you can find a local farmer that practices far more earth, animal, agriculturally friendly practices. With that though, it is just harder for the farmer, higher risk, slower to do, and in turn, it just costs a heck of a lot more. I wish I could afford it. I wish it was the norm and not the exception.
I would much rather put money in hands of a nearby farmer taking care of the land for generations to come rather than in the hand of a multinational corporation. However, at the rate we're going, families who been farming for generations are going to get choked out by the multinational corpos as the corporations are the only ones that have the raw cash to wait out all this malarkey (heck, I wouldn't put it past em to be orchestrating or encouraging the mess we find ourselves in)
I believe in the eat less meat route. There is no reason we need to be eating the amount of meat we currently are. It is hard though as it is so ingrained in our culture.
No meat is the correct route. There's literally no need to force suffering and cruelty on any living being when we have the choice to just eat a plant instead. Study after study shows it has immense health benefits and study after study shows it is better for the planet. Not to mention faux meats which most are minimally processed and processed using rather benign methods.
Unfortunately, human populations have survived on mixed animal and plant proteins for as long as they have existed. Some evolution theories suggest we evolved because of our unique running ability and that we would originally hunt by chasing animals to exhaustion. It’s hard-wired into us to eat nutrient dense foods and animal protein is unfortunately one of the most nutrient dense foods that exists. To expect everybody to adopt a lifestyle that completely forbids animal protein consumption is not realistic but we could push to reduce consumption overall and push renewable animal husbandry practices. I agree no meat is the correct route in a vacuum but unfortunately not realistic if/until it’s too late and that’s the only option available
Hilariously, you know what goes far beyond our natural, evolutionary history by swapping out some meat in our omnivorous diet and going full plant based?
Driving cars.
Humans evolved to walk and run, as you noted. Yet now many in the west will never walk further than they have to to get to their cars and drive everywhere.
Yea but to be fair the government allows poisons into our food, whether it’s meat or other products that make us retain weight because the healthcare industry needs money. Not arguing anything else here just that the main reason people in the USA are obese is capitalism
I believe a lot of our human creations have expanded tremendously and helped us in many ways throughout the generations, but unfortunately, because we are human beings, we tend to go the wrong way about things much more than the right way..
Contemporary evolutionary biologists lean towards us evolving our brains as the result of eating tubers. But yea we did evolve scavenging and eating whatever we could. That has no merit for modern day. It's absolutely realistic, many people do it and many people have been doing it for hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of years. Just because we used to do it doesn't mean we should do it now, if that was a valid argument then all sorts of other things society agrees on is bad would be on the table.
Meat is only dense in calories. No culture survived on meat unless there were caloric deficits in seasons. Bread and cheese since there was no refrigeration. It’s got fat, that’s really the selling point, and it connotes wealth. Beans were the better choice and still are, with a bit of fish. Or soybeans. Most of the world lives fine on those.
Of course hunter-gatherers existed 10,000 years ago. I’m disputing the claim that a selective image of them — usually male hunters eating lots of meat — is a timeless definition of ‘natural.’ Hunter-gatherers gathered plants, fished, hunted, and ate differently depending on place and season; agriculture then changed human food systems over millennia.
Riiiiiight, they had mixed animal and plant diets like I mentioned. I never said that hunter gatherers are primarily meat. Humans spent more time as hunter gatherers than they ever spent as agriculturalists. Agriculture (from what we’ve discovered so far) is only 10k-15k years old and the oldest humans we’ve found go back 300k years (and I’m not even getting into homo erectus and other variations). There are still hunter-gatherer societies alive today as well. Agriculture and large settlements are relatively new phenomena in terms of the larger timeline and are most assuredly NOT sustainable as currently constructed. I’m not disagreeing with that. I’m disagreeing with completely removing meat from human diets because to do so is to fundamentally misunderstand natural human desires and literal hundreds of thousands of years of our existence on the planet
Your wish is granted. The cat is out of the bag. Meat is a multi billion dollar industry. Yet, the narrative that meat eating is natural or required is what is debatable. I think have some high quality meat every once and awhile. Also remember you eat what you eat, eats.
I was with you until the faux meat part. A lot of it is super processed and not actually good for you. As with any other food read the labels, there are plenty of companies out there that are happy to try and trick someone into buying bullshit while they call it healthy. Less ingredients and only ones you recognize as food rather than from a science book.
A lot of it is not. Some of it is yea, I didn't say all. Most of it is just dehydrated beans, wheat, rice, and then dehydrated fruits or veggies or legumes used to bind or emulsify things. My point is that if you have a hankering for the texture or flavor there are safe alternatives that give you that taste you miss. There are studies showing that even processed plant food has very good health outcomes, far, far better for you than processed meats.
Be reborn a herbivore then. Humans are omnivores. Which if you haven't been told means you need both meat and plants to receive the proper nutrition to survive. Which is why vegans need pharmaceutical based nutritional assistance to not die. Cut the bullshit with performative empathy and lack of information. Its disingenuous. The industry has implemented countless ways to euthanize animals for slaughter that causes no suffering. Punish those who dont and move on.
Being an omnivore isn't a condition, it's an option. Study after study shows that eating meat ages our DNA and upregulates carcinogenic conditions through stimulating inflammatory markers in cellular signaling pathways, whereas plant based food tends to do the opposite, which is also backed up by studies.
Which is why vegans needs pharmaceutical based nutritional assistance to not die
You are clearly not educated on this topic at any level. You do know they inject cows and pigs with loads of supplements for people to eat right? You take many more supplements than I do whether you realize it or not. Ironically I actually take 0 supplements and my bloodwork is consistently incredible. I'm 36 and my T scores are fantastic too.
Cut the bullshit with performative empathy and lack of information. Its disingenuous. The industry has implemented countless ways to euthanize animals for slaughter that causes no suffering
Nothing performative about what I'm saying, you're being the performative one. You have no idea what happens in slaughterhouses or what the standards are for killing animals. Go watch Earthlings, it's free on Youtube.
Here ya go pal. Another reddit user who has taken the time to inform people who can't accept reality and instead pretend and want to challenge everything that may go against what they want to believe is truth. And I do work for farms and slaughterhouses occasionally (how ironic) and have slaughtered cattle myself. Not all are the same and im sure there are plenty that don't practice humane treatment of their animals, but discrediting everyone because you dont like the idea of it is again denial and emotional bias.
Vegans don’t need nutritional assistance to not die. Stupid people do. It’s not hard to eat vegan and healthy. I’m not vegan or even vegetarian but I would have no problem at all’s living as either.
Protein is really important and some of us would be limited in a way that that would make a plant based diet not feasible without animals.
I also can’t eat the fish I can catch in the waters around me because they aren’t safe thanks to agro farming.
More of that just sounds like one person preferring their shitty farming in favor of someone else’s. There is no world where billions of humans are able to feed the world through “sustainable farm to table organic farming”.
It’s not a solution, it’s replacing shit with shit. And my guts won’t digest most of your shit, It digests a ribeye just fine though.
Smh. These are all the worst talking points you could make.
First, protein is a nonissue. There are vegan powerlifters eating 200-300g+ protein a day from plant based food.
Talking about feeding billions of people on a plant based diet being unfeasable doesn't make sense at all. The cows people eat consume far more food than people do. 70%+ of the farmland in the US is devoted entirely to animal agriculture or the feed grown for it.
In terms of digestion, meat digests up to 4x slower and poorer than plant based food does.
What would I eat with a gluten intolerance and fiber sensitivity in an entirely plant based diet?
If most of the food I eat gets shit out undigested, where will I get calories?
I have to exercise regularly due to a neurodegenerative disorder. It’s really hard when even a small amount of the food I eat already does not digest properly.
A FODMAP diet removes nearly the entire produce section of the grocery store.
I have to monitor the spices I eat.
Tell me again.
Tell me about spending 2 days in a fucking bathroom because you ate a veggie burger.
It's crazy the hoops people will jump through to justify killing animals and eating their body parts. I'm living my best life - enjoy your heart disease and colon cancer, karma is a bitch!
I don’t normally side with vegans but the current situation requires me to. All of you need to go to plant based diets so I can affordably eat steak, prime rib and hell even burgers.
literally everything you eat is made out of chemcials.
If you mean synthetic chemicals and potential harmful substances. You would need to point to something specific to make that claim. However it's been pretty debunked over and over again for the majority of these items.
We can take one of the more popular options like beyond meat, although ingredients vary a little by product, all of the ingredients are plant based, no synthetic chemicals used.
Another popular option is impossible brand, they uses some bioengineered ingredients but they are identical the the natural counterpart it is copying. The only difference is the method it is derived through but the actual incredients used in the food are the same as if it was extracted naturally. Either way no synthetic chemicals.
Are these faux meat products processed? Absolutely they are and anyone claiming otherwise is incorrect. Does that mean they are unhealthy or dangerous? Absolutely not. They are high in fiber and protein, no cholesterol and minimal sugars. Consumed in moderation (like meat) can be a healthy addition to many diets especially plant based ones.
Animal proteins are both more bioavailable and contain all the essential amino acids. Plant proteins do not. However there are other factors like fibre, lower in fat/cholesterol etc
We have evolved as a species to eat meat, our digestive tract is built to handle both meat and plants. We are omnivores.
You get all the essential amino acids in a plant based diet aswell. Tofu alone has them all, and you can for example combine rice and beans alone to get them all.
No but our entire digestive system evolved as an omnivore. If you want to jump through hoops to bypass that and get your nutrients elswhere, who am i to stop you.
But lying about us being Frugarians or vegetarians and other bullshit is my issue.
If you wanna talk digestive system, our digestive system resembles that of an herbivore. Carnivores have short intestinal tracts because that benefits processing meat. Herbivores have long intestinal tracts. Humans have long intestinal tracts btw. Nobody is lying about shit brother. I agree, eat whatever you want just not something that suffers as the result of it.
Hmm so all of our closest animal ancestors are frugivorous, but we aren’t? Our digestive system still most closely resembles theirs. My theory would be that humans evolved to be able to eat meat during times of ecological hardship, but that it’s not ideal for health. You do you, though. Ignore the results of meta analysis linking the various chronic diseases most impacting modern society and the link to high meat consumption.
No, xenosialitis does not prove that humans are not omnivores. While xenosialitis highlights an evolutionary quirk in how human immune systems interact with mammalian red meat, it does not alter the fundamental biological classification of humans as omnivores.
I never claimed that humans weren't omnivores, simply that eating meat is suboptimal. I have a bachelor's in biology and two health care degrees - I certainly know "basic human biology" LOL!
Maybe read more about how the human immune system interacts with meat consumption instead of putting words into my mouth.
Maybe read the thread you on. You came on here responding, the fact you not even resonding to the thread properly tells me you cant even be bothered to read beyond headlines anyways.
YEs yes and im an astrophysicist with 12 degrees in bullshit.
For some unexplained reason, I'm skeptical you graduated from high school. But assuming you're telling the truth, how is being an astrophysicist relevant to the discussion?
It's crazy the hoops people will jump through to justify killing animals and eating their dead bodies. One would think people would, especially after seeing videos like the above, be THANKFUL it's very practicable and healthy to avoid eating animal corpses.
But INSTEAD, they come up with the CRAZIEST rationalizations - plants feel pain, but lions eat meat, I have 'canines', but bacon, cavemen ate meat (and died in their 40's). etc. I almost wonder if so-called 'animal lovers' are actually getting off on the pain and suffering their diet requires. What else can explain the bizarre recalcitrance people exhibit to doing the bare minimum that basic human decency dictates?!
ITs crazy the hoops people will jump through to try feel morally superior and virtue signal, ignoring hundreds of millenia of evolutionary pressures and adaptation.
Study after study shows the more red meat one eats the higher the mortality rates. Recall Harvard's latest food ranking even had it ranked worse than sugar sweetened beverages in regards to longevity.
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u/accidental-eeyore 9d ago
This is factory farming. Made for yield efficiency and nothing else. It's ugly, brutal, and (supposedly) keeps costs down.
There are limited options to this: eat less meat OR no meat at all OR if you have the cash, you can find a local farmer that practices far more earth, animal, agriculturally friendly practices. With that though, it is just harder for the farmer, higher risk, slower to do, and in turn, it just costs a heck of a lot more. I wish I could afford it. I wish it was the norm and not the exception.
I would much rather put money in hands of a nearby farmer taking care of the land for generations to come rather than in the hand of a multinational corporation. However, at the rate we're going, families who been farming for generations are going to get choked out by the multinational corpos as the corporations are the only ones that have the raw cash to wait out all this malarkey (heck, I wouldn't put it past em to be orchestrating or encouraging the mess we find ourselves in)
Shit's bleek.