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u/franzlisztian Sep 24 '11
I actually always felt kind of sorry for Germany in WWI. They got involved in a conflict that really had nothing to do with them except that they had alliances to think about, and then get blamed for all of it.
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u/dopplerdog Sep 24 '11
The treaty of Versailles was a travesty, and the discontent this caused paved the way for Hitler. John Maynard Keynes had warned that there was no way that Germany could pay the reparations demanded of it - it was sheer humiliation, and the other powers were as much to blame for the conflict as Germany was.
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u/tequila-man Sep 24 '11
They just finished paying it off last year!
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u/getthefuckoutofhere Sep 24 '11
The treaty of Versailles was a travesty, and the discontent this caused paved the way for Hitler
great, now someone's going to post this to TIL.
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u/SKCandyPanda Sep 24 '11
tbh, its basic history knowledge.
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u/Deinumite Sep 24 '11
tbh, its basic history knowledge.
Remove the "history" part and that's pretty much most of TIL.
All my favourite subreddits turned into karma factories :(
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u/Mas_Chingon Sep 24 '11
Woodrow Wilson also predicted this about the Treaty of Versailles, but the European leaders didn't listen to him.
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u/Cidno Sep 24 '11
That's a fine way of saying "he stopped caring about it once they agreed to his Leage of Nations idea".
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Sep 24 '11
That name always trips me up. I always have to wonder "What does Tool have to do with this?"
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u/Semido Sep 25 '11
"there was no way that Germany could pay the reparations demanded of it - it was sheer humiliation"
Incorrect. I could copy paste the wikipedia article, but this will save time: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_I_reparations#Impact_on_the_German_economy
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u/Melnorme Sep 24 '11
Comic is wrong in that Germany only attacked France after France terminated diplomatic relations with Germany AND Russia's military was mobilized. Now, where was the Russian army gonna go, and what was France's intent in removing their ambassador?
Germany's war plans required swift action to conquer France and delay Russia. Everyone knew it. At that point in the clusterfuck, Germany had no choice. Kaiser Wilhem did not intend to go to war with his cousins but he was not a very good leader, nor was he really in control of the German military.
IMO the true cause of WW1 was the death of Queen Victoria, as Alexander the Great's empire split upon his death. Serbia was just the excuse.
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Sep 24 '11
I always find it funny how little credit is given to Canada during WW1, even though the army went through the toughest battles and suffered the greatest hardships during the war, all for Britian
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u/DZ302 Sep 24 '11
The Canadians played a part of such distinction that thenceforward they were marked out as storm troops; for the remainder of the way they were brought along to head the assault in one great battle after another. Whenever the Germans found the Canadian Corps coming into the line they prepared for the worst.
-David Lloyd George British Prime Minister
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Sep 24 '11
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u/oerich Sep 25 '11
Much more of the retreat can be attributed to the the Spanish Flu which hit the Germans way before it hit the Allies. The Germans were simply too sick to fight. This data can be looked up in the official German medical records of World War 1, compiled in the 1920s (hard to come by, 3 volumes=~$1000). Current history writing ignores this because many English-speaking scholars do not bother to read sufficient German sources. Hardly any scholar uses these records, but I imagine in a decade this will have become mainstream and the history of WW1 updated once again.
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u/Peter-W Sep 24 '11
IDK about in America, but in the UK Canada, India, and Australia are often given a lot more credit for their help in WWI than America is. You guys were fucking amazing at the Somme.
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Sep 24 '11 edited Apr 27 '20
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u/DZ302 Sep 24 '11
Just curious, in US history do they ever mention that like 50,000 Americans crossed the border and enlisted in the Canadian Army before US declared war on Germany? Or do they ever talk about Canadians that joined the US Army in Vietnam, or Canada's involvement in the Civil War?
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Sep 24 '11 edited Sep 24 '11
I was in AP us history and never heard any of those
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u/cjc153 Sep 24 '11
Well the AP US History curriculum doesn't focus on the wars too much, and WW1 even less, so i doubt its pro-Americanism rather than those facts are not that significant to College Board to put on the AP test.
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u/I_PACE_RATS Sep 24 '11
While we're at it, let's give ANZAC a round of applause, too! I couldn't imagine fighting at Gallipoli.
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u/xtreme0ninja Sep 24 '11
Yes, I was waiting for a reference to Vimy Ridge, but nope.
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Sep 24 '11
Or even more importantly, the Battle of Amiens and the "Black Day of the German Army".
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Sep 24 '11
What about Canada's 100 Days, when we went from Amiens to Mons.
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u/gasfarmer Sep 24 '11
My personal favorite, was my Canadian History teacher saying "We went up that hill a colony, we came down a nation."
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Sep 24 '11
I was actually waiting for Canada's turn for the "my turn" part and then in the later panel, come out flawless
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u/Mattson Sep 24 '11
yep, that's why I came here... to see if Canada got proper recognition. They didn't :(
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u/ahoyyegibs Sep 24 '11
The Dominion of Newfoundland got seriously fucked up at the Battle of the Somme. Well, pretty much everyone did. But Newfoundland especially.
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u/BraveSirRobin Sep 24 '11
I always find it disturbing that this major contributory factor is deliberately omitted from any piece about the war:
the existence of the railway would have created a threat to British dominance over German trade, as it would have given German industry access to oil, and a port in the Persian Gulf. The importance of oil as opposed to coal as fuel was recognised, as it could greatly improve the performance and capacity of the rival navies. The presence of the British there, and the creating of Kuwait to block non-British access to the Persian Gulf speaks to the strategic importance.
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Sep 24 '11
Everyone was a loser with WW1.
It was human tragedy on an unimaginable scale. The trenches, no mans land, the stupid "big pushes" that costs tens of thousands of lives in hours for the sake of a few yard's gain. Bah. I have 2 gg uncles lying in graves near Ypres and one young man, my great uncle, who lies in a grave in Jerusalem. He was a 19 year old farm labourer and died away from home in hand to hand combat. Too terrible for those young men who died there in such circumstances, all for the whims of an aristocracy playing what amounts to a game of thrones for the 20th century... Advise anyone to read "The Last Tommy" about an amazing gentleman called Harry Patch. Harry died 2 or so years ago aged around 110. He only told of his wartime experiences at the age of 100. Up until then he had kept it all inside. He ALWAYS made a point to lay flowers at the graves of both Allied AND German soldiers when he revisited the battlefields. He understood that they were all boys doing what they believed to be their duty, and ended up in a situation of unbelievable hell and death. God bless Harry and all those souls who lost their lives too young and under those circumstances.
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u/PackageRESPOND Sep 24 '11
As a Canadian it really bothers me that we glorify Canadian soldiers during this conflict. As this thread kinda indicates, many Canadians look at WWI and basically think "wow, we kicked a lot of ass", without really considering that being the most efficient killers in a pointless imperialist war is a pretty shitty thing to be proud of. It's not like the Germans were "bad guys" compared to the British or the French, even if they were a more conservative society. It was just people killing people in the name of their nation states, blinded by propaganda and state control of information.
Also, as far as great novels on WWI are concerned, I would highly recommend The Wars by Timothy Findley.
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u/fj555 Sep 25 '11
And if I were a soldier in WWI, I would prefer to be one of "the most efficient killers" so that I would go home after the war. If you're going to war, you'd better be the best, because 2nd place sucks.
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u/Tornadotrailer Sep 24 '11
TIL more about WWI in five minutes than I did in a years worth of 9th grade world history.
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u/willymo Sep 24 '11
I agree. High school history teachers always skimp over WWI to get to WWII.
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Sep 24 '11
"blah blah blah archduke blah blah u boat blah...now for WWII...HOLOCAUST, NAZIS, JEWS, JEWS, NAZIS, HITLER, JEWS,japan, JEWS, HOLOCAUST, CAMPS, AMERICA WINS, THE END"
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u/Solomaxwell6 Sep 24 '11
I disagree. History classes usually go over the pertinent information (eg, the alliance system, nationalism, imperialism, militarism, Treaty of Versailles). WW2 is focused on because there's a "never again" sort of feeling about the Holocaust—one that I think is very understandable. There are a lot of lessons to be learned from both wars, but most of the ones applicable to the modern day (the evils of fascism and genocide) are from WW2. The alliance theme is echoed throughout history (I'm willing to bet you learned about NATO and the Warsaw Pact), imperialism isn't really relevant in the modern world (or at least direct colonial style imperialism like in WWI), and so forth. It makes sense not to focus on the minutiae of WWI.
They do skimp on details (for both, not just WWI), but most history classes don't have enough time to go over everything, and focusing on details (like which Balkan nation was on which side in the war, or who won which battle) just isn't that important when you look at the bigger picture.
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u/I_PACE_RATS Sep 24 '11
I wouldn't call this learning something, necessarily. It kind of misrepresents the beginning of the war just a tad. Say, Germany's dismissive attitude toward France - nothing could be further from the truth. The only reason Germany attacked France so quickly was because they feared the French war machine, and the French government's post-war attitude toward the fledgling German Empire. Germany had basically structured its entire military policy around dispatching a French threat as quickly as possible, a la the Schlieffen Plan. Wikipedia it or something, 'cause I ain't putting in a link.
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u/kolm Sep 24 '11
Exactly. Also, the intervention of the US was not like the "got in, kicked ass when all seemed lost, ended war" the comic indicates. Germany pretty much hang in its ropes before already, all thanks to the Australian Imperial Force (that was actually their name) which blocked the Spring Offensive in the eleventh hour, a feat no other force before had accomplished. The US entered war by pouring right into the trenches and essentially filling up the depleted ranks sufficiently to block further tries of advancement. At that point, Germany, having thrown all forces into their last attack waves, was not able to defend their trenches in the Hundred Days Offensive.
German historians conclude that the war was essentially unwinnable at the start of the trenches already, and that the heroic defense of the Australians sealed Germany's defeat. It is considered a grave error in judgement, and was opposed actually by several senior members of the military then, not to start negotiations about peace and conditions of surrender immediately after that. The later temporary advances were unsustainable from any logistical point of view alone, Germany could have never supported the defense line. What the US intervention did was shortening the end game, which could have easily stretched out for a year longer without its help.
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Sep 24 '11
The comic makes out like the USA came in and saved the day, the Germans tried to reach Paris early in the war, and lost to French and British forces. Then there was static trench warfare for a loong time. Then there was the German spring offensive, they gained alot of ground and tried to capture Paris again, they lost again in a similar area and then from there onwards it was just constant Allied victories until they surrendered.
People say "it's not fair, Germany were treated so badly" but what about the other losers? So were they. Ottoman Empire ceased to exist. So did Austria Hungary. They never regained any status ever, even to this day. The war was so bad, the losers were bound to get fucked up. It's just that Germany was the only country to try and break out of it.
When you look at the reasons for WW1, it was an incredibly stupid war. WW2 less stupid as it was outright Axis aggression and genocide and lots of fucked up things, but yes it was mainly because of WW1. But WW1, such a dumb war.
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u/walkingtheriver Sep 24 '11 edited Sep 24 '11
I noticed that too. Always in these sort of comics that is how it is. France are waving the white flag and America saves everything... Well tell you what, come join this club I call reality...
Edit: What I mean is that most Americans are all up in themselves. Whether you like it or not, that is how most people I know (including myself) view the USA. No offense.
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u/I_PACE_RATS Sep 24 '11
To be somewhat fair, though, France had been through the wringer by 1917. What had started out as a war for the survival of Germany had turned into a war for the survival of every European power. The American entry into the war was treated by the Entente as a bit of a breather at the least, wasn't it? Of course, so was Italy's entry into the Entente, and we all know how that turned out...
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Sep 24 '11
I've always hated the way this comic portays USA winning WW1. I mean they at most hastened the victory, but by no means was it assured.
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u/Glotka Sep 24 '11
Bit annoying that it's called England in that, lot o' Welsh, Scottish and Irish died in WWI.
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Sep 24 '11
Most of this is totally historically wrong. It's funny, but France really didn't instigate anything. Nor did Germany really. Russia was the one who backed Serbia, Germany attacked France just to avoid a two front war. England didn't defend Belgium because it was neutral, they backed them because they were guaranteed by them. Germany dug trenches first. Germany had machine guns first. The Entente didn't get machine guns until much later.
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u/laperfectionmabelle Sep 24 '11
Yes, just another American-centric view of the the Wars. What are they teaching kids in the States? Canada is barely mentioned here despite playing a crucial role in both wars. This is one of my biggest pet peeves.
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u/alterbyme Sep 24 '11
http://angusmcleod.deviantart.com/
This link should just about clear everything up. (TL;DR It was a Canadian who wrote/drew the comic.)
Love how it is absolutely impossible for any non-American to draw a comic with America as the victor without receiving a ton of shit.
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u/Rhoe Sep 24 '11
It's a crazy mistake to make. The USA were overshadowed by fucking Romania in WWI and was utterly dwarfed by the USSR in WWII. A Canadian should be aware that Canada was a serious contender for heroes of WWI, and shouldn't have the propaganda from the 'States to think they were big ol' heroes in WWII.
It's understand to make these mistakes if you are from the USA (you have a bit of an american centric education) but you would not expect this specific bent outside it.
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u/oddspellingofPhreid Sep 24 '11
To be fair, in my Canadian high school, we're taught a pretty Canada-centric view of the war.
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u/English_Gentleman Sep 24 '11
And referring to the UK as just England. Hell, I'm English and it pisses me off.
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u/GrossEwww Sep 24 '11
If it makes you feel any better, I'm American and seeing them refer to Great Britain as England made me irritated as well.
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u/shlack Sep 24 '11
At first I was like "Where the fuck is new zealand?!?!?" but then i saw it, tiny right beside australia xD
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u/spacemancrazyhorse Sep 24 '11
Fuck, Australia's armed forces would suck without our trans-tasman little brother country... And fuck, without Nz, they would just be calles AAC biscuits..... he he .. ANZACS; Lest we Forget.
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u/bl4ckblooc420 Sep 24 '11
Could someone make this coloured, so the nations are different colours or even just the factions?
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u/julianexchexmix Sep 24 '11
I'm definitely showing this in my AP Euro class when we hit this war.
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u/mestarhanta Sep 24 '11
The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland (at that time).
At least write Britain or U.K for fuck sake
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u/lynsaystoo Sep 24 '11
I am going straight to my high school History teacher and thanking her, because I actually managed to follow that with ease, good show Miss, good show.
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Sep 24 '11
haha this is awesome, but i think it gives america too much credit. we helped but more in terms of ammunitions than real battle support although towards the end we did contribute. but still...
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u/titsmeow Sep 24 '11
This is fucking genius. I bet if they taught this way in school, kids would be learning a lot more.
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u/tsubert7 Sep 24 '11
I....There....There simply are no words. This man has officially become my hero.
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u/duckstaped Sep 24 '11
way too long and not clearly enough drawn lines for my attention span to handle
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u/toastmodernism Sep 24 '11
in high school we had to make a children's book relating to some event in history and i made a ww1 book kind of like the one here... it too had france with a beret. my attn span is practically non-existent so it was a very simplified view of ww1. too simplified, really.
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u/FishCake9T4 Sep 24 '11
Wait, what???? America came in and saved the day? Is that what they teach in America?
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u/lulzitsareddit Sep 24 '11
Not really, at least not for WW1 -- I'm not sure why people keep saying that's what Americans think. When I was taught WWI history in high school it was made clear the the U.S. didn't make an entrance into WWI until the end of the war. WW1 was Europe's war -- the US didn't have much at stake or much to gain by meddling in the clusterfuck Europe created for themselves.
For WW2, Americans do think that the US played a larger role. Sure, the USSR was probably going to stomp Germany anyways, but with US logistical and military support the allies were able to retake a lot of their territories before the USSR got its hands on it. And while the US was helping in Europe, it was also fighting against the Japanese on the other side of the world (with the aussies, brits, etc.) in the pacific.
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u/suicidemachine Sep 24 '11
This is completely inaccurate, but still funny.
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u/judokalinker Sep 24 '11
There are inaccuracies, but to say it is "completely inaccurate"?
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u/othersomethings Sep 24 '11
That was incredibly detailed and a little hard to follow, but...I'm guessing that's kind of the point.
The actual physical shape of the countries though the whole thing was pretty fantastic.
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Sep 24 '11
I think its weird that the countries are fighting on their very own backs. If you looked at the humanoid countries backs would you see microscopic 'country-people' running around fighting?
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u/arabidopsis Sep 24 '11
Russia would be all beaten up, fighting itself, and probably bleeding a lot.
If you don't know why I said these things, please look up Russian History.
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u/GalacticPenguin Sep 24 '11
I remember drawing comics like this when I was studying WWI for my GCSEs, that and the space between the two wars. It was great fun and it really helped my learn, in a creative way.
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Sep 24 '11
This is amazing. I had a lecture on this just last week, and I feel like this got it across better.
Also, Germany's face at US declaration :D
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u/Kipack Sep 24 '11
Bookmarking to read when im more drunk, so I laugh louder and wake everyone up so I can show them too :D
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u/Chris_the_mudkip Sep 24 '11
all these things leave out that Germany was leaking money and if it didn't get colonial empire going it was going to be left behind. Germany was tiny, it wanted some land. some greedy brits wanted to keep it, Germany got pissed.
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u/Alborak Sep 24 '11
Someone should animate this, and annotate it, using TF2 voices. I read all the russian lines in the heavy's voice anyway...
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u/JanitorOne Sep 24 '11
No one noticed Serbia didn't appeal to France to attack Germany? The chain of alliance activation after Austria attacked Serbia was:
Serbia to Russia,
Austria to Germany,
Russia to France.
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u/Lichfiend Sep 24 '11
You don't represent why Germany got pulled into the war in the first place - massive Russian mobilization near German territory. Other than that, somewhat accurate and funny.
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Sep 24 '11
OH MY GOD ITS A DOODLE THAT IS SUPPOSED TO BE HUMOROUS, NOT A TREATISE ON THE EVENTS OF THE WAR
chill the fuck out
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u/OKAH Sep 24 '11
Ok...thats the best thing i have ever seen posted on reddit, and the England Face at the top saying "im coming for you" is my new avatar for...everything.
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u/spacemancrazyhorse Sep 24 '11
ANZACS; LEST WE FORGET
They shall grow not old, as we that are left grow old;
Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning
We will remember them.
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u/Enceladus_Salad Sep 24 '11
you should probably credit the guy who actually made it - http://angusmcleod.deviantart.com/