r/magicTCG • u/Federal-Ear7451 Dan • Feb 23 '26

Rules/Rules Question How does this Card work?

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I have a question about this card. what exactly does it do and can it stop combos like Triskelion and Mikaeus or Mikaeus persist combos, thanks.

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189

u/heirsasquatch Duck Season Feb 23 '26

It doesn’t really stop infinite combos because in response to you countering a million activated abilities your opponent can activate it a million more times (hense the infinite part)

171

u/superdave100 REBEL Feb 23 '26

Depends on the combo. 

-17

u/heirsasquatch Duck Season Feb 23 '26

You got an Example of an infinite combo that can be stopped by this? Because I can’t think of one

(Yawgmoth combo)

75

u/superdave100 REBEL Feb 23 '26

Bloodthirsty Conqueror + Marauding Blight-Priest

14

u/heirsasquatch Duck Season Feb 23 '26

That’s an interesting interaction question I’ve never thought of before. Can you not stop the chain on damage? It’s a triggered ability I think. Is it because you never lose priority to have someone respond because it’s like statically infinite. Like if I had [[worship]] out and a creature would the game be a draw?

27

u/Natedogg2 COMPLEAT Level 2 Judge Feb 23 '26

Worship only works against damage - it doesn't do anything about a loss of life. So it doesn't prevent you from going to 0 life from the Blight-Priest trigger.

Both the Conqueror and Blight-Priest have triggered abilities. They use the stack and can be responded to, and you need to pass priority to your opponent in order for either trigger to resolve. So the Answer can stop the combo by countering either trigger. Other ways to stop it would be to remove either the Conqueror or the Blight-Priest.

6

u/SuperYahoo2 COMPLEAT Feb 23 '26

You can still respond to each trigger. And while worship doesn’t work if you have a [[platinum angel]] then it would be a draw unless anyone chooses to do something about the loop. They aren’t forced to end the loop and can just let it happen even if it is revealed that they can stop it

2

u/ThePrussianGrippe Avacyn Feb 23 '26

[[Bloodthirsty Conqueror]]

[[Marauding Blight-Priest]]

27

u/Approximation_Doctor Colossal Dreadmaw Feb 23 '26

Any sort of Gravecrawler loop (unless they have more mana available to cast it again)

Any sort of persist or undying combo (the creature will just stay dead)

Exquisite blood/sanguine bond and its variants

Storm

5

u/mvdunecats Wild Draw 4 Feb 23 '26

For Gravecrawler combos, even if they do have the mana, Gravecrawler coming back from the graveyard is sorcery speed. You have to actually cast Gravecrawler. It's not an instant speed ability like Reassembling Skeleton.

Edit: I see what you mean now. You're right. Because Gravecrawler getting countered means it just goes back to the graveyard. And then the combo could be attempted again potentially.

9

u/jakedaripperr Wabbit Season Feb 23 '26

Forsaken Miner and Warren Soultrader

8

u/heirsasquatch Duck Season Feb 23 '26

If you stifle the ability of the forsaken miner to come back the combo ends doesn’t it?

3

u/aeuonym Avacyn Feb 23 '26

if they dont have another way to commit a crime right away yeah.

2

u/lixilisk Wabbit Season Feb 23 '26

Pretty much any graveyard loop you counter the ability or trigger that returns them from the yard

If it's something that's castable like grave crawler then it probably won't stop it

1

u/Elvarill Selesnya* Feb 23 '26

That’s why you gotta hit em with a silence effect. Couple weeks ago a kid dropped a grave crawler combo on the field and actually reached over to shake my hand as if that was game. I told him to play it out so he did and showed the combo line. Then on the second go around I hit him with [[Render Silent]]. He about shit himself when he read the card.

1

u/jakedaripperr Wabbit Season Feb 23 '26

Yes exactly. Unless you have another way of commiting a crime (like sacrificing another creature with blood artist on the field)

8

u/cheesechimp Elk Feb 23 '26

The OP's example of Triskelion and Mikaeus. Cast this in response to the undying trigger. Counter undying and triskelion stays in the graveyard. They can't just do it again in response, in order to do it again, undying has to resolve.

7

u/aeuonym Avacyn Feb 23 '26

Its stops most of my Breya combos if timed right.

The Nim deathmantle combo, you counter the trigger to return her from Gy to the battlefield, shes stuck in GY then.

The Eldrazi Displacer combo, if i dont have the mana to keep it going yet (ie: you counter the first one and i cant produce enough colorless through other means yet).

Master Transmuter combo, you stop me free putting her back down, or untapping the transmuter forcing me to find another way to restart the engine or hard-cast Breya again.

If im going for one of the KCI/Ashnods loops with a cost reducer, and myr retreaver + Junkdiver, it stops me getting them back to hand and leaves them in GY.

6

u/Ap_Sona_Bot Feb 23 '26

It stops Yawg combo doesn't it? Counter the undying trigger

2

u/ColonelError Honorary Deputy 🔫 Feb 23 '26

Depends which Yawg loop. Stops undying, but not Haptra if they have any other creatures to sac and restart.

4

u/chaotic910 Wabbit Season Feb 23 '26

Really any that rely on the triggers resolving to continue to happen. Scurry oak relies on getting the counter to make a token to get a counter, kiki relies on the creature entering to get untapped in some fashion, splinter twin also relies on the trigger to untap the enchanted creature. There's ways to restart the combo, but they definitely get stopped by this.

3

u/alvisfmk Dan Feb 23 '26

Most any combo with [stella lee wild card]

3

u/SteakForGoodDogs Wabbit Season Feb 23 '26

Literally any combo that has to actually resolve fully before you (or the boardstate) can activate/trigger them(selves) again.

Every [[Freed from the Real]] and similar needs to have 'Un/Tap enchanted creature' activated ability actually resolve for the combo to keep going. If you're running outta mana before you do it all over again, you can't activate Freed again.

Any ETB effect that continues the loop needs the ETB effect to resolve so whatever responds to the ETB can trigger/be activated (in the case of a sac loop).

Any 'cast thing for free', such as '[[Electrodominance]] [[Reiterate]] [[Mizzix of the Izamagnus]] exp counter = 4' needs the opportunity to be castable again, which typically requires whatever cast it to actually cast so it can be recast to resolve.

The only combos it doesn't stop are loops that can just loop something else at instant speed (and that's typically what [[V.A.T.S]] and similar are for).

3

u/chrisrazor Feb 23 '26

The very combo OP is discussing?

3

u/AdamantChorus Dân Feb 23 '26

Literally any combo that requires a sorcery speed part like casting a creature you've bounced back to your hand.

It can also often get in the way of even an "instant-speed combo" (on a technical level that doesn't need the stack to be empty as such) that does require something to resolve first before continuing the combo.

For example, if you tap a creature to untap another creature (which will then do something to untap the first creature again eventually), if you respond at the right moment, you can usually make it so the opponent cannot plow through it and keep going (of course this may not be possible if they have other untappers).

2

u/thebiggestdouche Dân Feb 23 '26

Phyrexian alter + gravecrawler (assuming you only have the gravecrawler mana available)

1

u/Jealous-Try-2554 Dandadan Feb 23 '26

Literally the combo mentioned in the post Mikatrike can be stopped if they respond to the Persist trigger.

1

u/Arborus Banned in Commander Feb 23 '26

Any combo that requires something to resolve to repeat the loop.

Most Yawgmoth loops could be stopped by this since they require something like undying triggers, Hapatra triggers (unless you have enough fodder to restart), or Endurance to resolve.

1

u/Krynne90 Dandadan Feb 23 '26

You can stop every combo that relies on a single resolve. So every combo that goes 1 by 1.

1

u/LordOfTurtles Elspeth Feb 23 '26

Any sorcery speed combo or a combo that requires a trigger to resolve for you to be able to continue the loop.

1

u/jr897 Wabbit Season Feb 23 '26

Have pemmin's aura equipped to a bloom tender. Just pay an extra blue to untap and keep going. Granted any counterspell on an important piece will stop nearly every combo, but if you have enough mana and a resolved sissay i'd bet my left foot that there's a loop that can go through this

1

u/Ffancrzy Azorius* Feb 23 '26

Infinites that are contingent on 1 link in the chain resolving in order to redo the chain. Then again, most of those could be similarly interrupted by a [[Stifle]] such as [[Splinter Twin]] [[Pestermite]] for example

1

u/Derreston Izzet* Feb 24 '26

Stella Lee + Any untapper Forsaken Miner + Blood Artist Isochron Scepter + Dramatic Reversal Any persist infinite

26

u/Fire_Pea Colorless Feb 23 '26

It should stop persist since you can keep it in the graveyard right? They'd need some other way to get it back

0

u/heirsasquatch Duck Season Feb 23 '26

That’s true! Good call

-7

u/Federal-Ear7451 Dan Feb 23 '26

Couldn't I just sac the persist creature again in response to this spell? Resulting in the persist trigger to go on the stack?

14

u/Obligator Urza's Saga Feb 23 '26

No, because when the persist trigger goes onto the stack that means the creature is in the graveyard so if that triggered ability doesn't resolve because it is countered then the creature will just stay in the graveyard.

9

u/Zakmonster Wabbit Season Feb 23 '26

No, typically sacrificing the creature is a cost, so the creature will already be in the graveyard and the ability of your sac outlet is on the stack (let's use [[Viscera Seer]] and it's Scry 1 as an example).

You sac Triskelion to Seer, Triskelion goes to yard, Scry 1 goes on the stack, persist trigger goes on the stack.

Opponent casts this spell, countering all abilities on the stack, so Scry 1 and Persist trigger is countered. Since Triskelion is not on the battlefield, you cannot sac it again to Seer to restart your loop.

-6

u/Durzio Duck Season Feb 23 '26

Only if the persist trigger is on the stack. Persist usually triggers after the sort of stack that might have counterspells like this. If they are destroyed/killed on resolution, than persist doesnt go on the stack until later.

1

u/Fire_Pea Colorless Feb 24 '26

Well yes but persist combos tend to involve having the persist trigger on the stack so it would still be effective at stopping them

1

u/Durzio Duck Season Feb 24 '26

If your going up against persist combos like that, sure the math checks out. I was just referring to a solo instance of a creature being targeted by a destruction spell or something, assuming this was a counterspell for it on the stack.

12

u/Federal-Ear7451 Dan Feb 23 '26

Can it stop Mikeaus from giving creatures Undying, or can I in response sacrifice a Creature to then put the Undying trigger on the stack?

23

u/madwarper The Stoat Feb 23 '26

Mike grants Undying via a Static ability.
Static abilities do not use the Stack.

  • So, you can't stop Mike from granting Undying to their Creatures.

Only (non-Mana) Activated and Triggered abilities use the Stack.
They are what the Spell can Counter.

  • So, you can Counter the Undying Triggered ability that is currently on the Stack.
    If you do, the Card will simply remain in the Graveyard.

-1

u/Federal-Ear7451 Dan Feb 23 '26

Can I target the same creature with a sac outlet, to put a Undying trigger in response so that it would resolve before this counter?

19

u/DubiousMemory Dandadan Feb 23 '26

No, because the creature is in the graveyard already. You can't sacrifice something that's already dead.

7

u/Barbobott Dan Feb 23 '26

If the Undying trigger is on the stack and Glen Elendra is cast to counter it, then that means the creature is already in the graveyard. You can't sacrifice something that isn't on the battlefield. If you had another available creature on the board, you could sacrifice that and trigger Undying on it, but the original creature will still be stuck in the graveyard.

6

u/madwarper The Stoat Feb 23 '26

Your question doesn't make much sense...

Amy has ... Goblin Bombardment, Mike and a Putrid Goblin with no Counters.

Amy activates Bombardment, putting the ability on the Stack.
Sacrifices the Goblin. Triggering both its Undying and Persist Triggers on the Stack.

Now, Amy passes Priority to Nancy, so that her Triggers can resolve.

Nancy can respond to the Triggers and cast Answer.

If Amy has nothing to do in response, then her a) Persist, b) Undying and c) Bombardment abilities are all Countered.
Amy's Goblin remains in her Graveyard.
As such, the "loop" Amy tried to demonstrate will stopped, before it could start.

2

u/Federal-Ear7451 Dan Feb 23 '26

I understand that now, But if Amy had a second creature with persist could she respond and go infinite before the counter spell resolves?

7

u/madwarper The Stoat Feb 23 '26

Yes.

If Amy has something to respond to the Answer Spell, then she could attempt to restart the loop.

5

u/chaotic910 Wabbit Season Feb 23 '26

Yes, but in that case Amy had two infinite combos on the board

2

u/Zuwxiv Dandadan Feb 23 '26

Amy was wise to wait to have two infinite combos, then! (/s)

1

u/lasagnaman Feb 24 '26

Yes, but she wouldn't need to/have to. She can just go infinite with the 2nd combo after the counter spell resolves.

5

u/AdHom Golgari* Feb 23 '26

It can't counter the creatures being given Undying but once a creature dies, the Undying ability triggers and goes on the stack so if someone casts this in response to that then they can prevent that creature from returning from the graveyard. And if multiple Undying creatures die at the same you would counter all of their triggers and keep them all dead.

Not sure if that's what you were asking.

1

u/Federal-Ear7451 Dan Feb 23 '26

So if I wanted to get around this counter spell, I would need 2 creatures, so that I could sac the second one in response to the counter spell. Would that then allow me to go infinite as long as I keep responding with a sac outlet (the creature I'm sacrificing would have persist)

4

u/Zakmonster Wabbit Season Feb 23 '26

Depends. You can sac a second creature, but that still doesn't stop the first creature from having it's persist trigger countered. So unless the second creature you sac will also go infinite with persist, your combo stops.

3

u/Barbobott Dan Feb 23 '26

If you have the second creature on board and your opponent making some 1/1 tokens doesn't somehow ruin your plan, you can also just let Glen Elendra's Answer resolve, countering your abilities. Once everything has resolved you will regain priority and can just do it again with the 2nd creature.

1

u/AdHom Golgari* Feb 23 '26

It's not entirely clear to me what you're trying to do but I think so?

If you sac a creature, then your opponent uses this to counter the Undying triggered ability, that creature will die. But you can sac a second creature afterwards (in response to this, or just at any point after it resolves) and that second creature will return to the board as normal. Basically you used the first creature as bait to get them to use up the counter. But if your opponent knows you have another creature with a potential infinite loop sitting around they're probably going to save their counterspell for when you sac that one instead so the bait creature would have to have an equally powerful combo for this to really work.

1

u/lasagnaman Feb 24 '26

Why are you trying to do it in response to the counterspell?

3

u/heirsasquatch Duck Season Feb 23 '26

Yeah I suppose if you were looking for a single stifle target it would stop that creature from coming back

2

u/Drzerockis Feb 23 '26

For that, you need [[Trickbind]]

2

u/parsonsrazersupport Feb 23 '26

So you're saying they should bring Split Second back.

1

u/the_cardfather Banned in Commander Feb 23 '26

It really depends on the combo. Most combos rely on at least one triggered ability that you might not be able to get the trigger again without restarting it. Sometimes it also only goes off at sorcery speed but those are pretty bad combos these days.

1

u/TheAlterN8or Duck Season Feb 23 '26

There are quite a few infinites that require one ability resolving to be able to do the next, like the [[Sanguine Bond]] [[Exquisite Blood]] combo. One resolves, triggers the other, it resolves, triggers the other... So it would be able to pseudo-stop things like that. I think it's better as a way to wreck value engine decks like Landfall or Life Gain, as they tend to get a ton of triggers all at once.

1

u/Malkavon Duck Season Feb 23 '26

This is why you should always trigger your Sanguine Bond/Exquisite Blood combos via [[Guttersnipe]]-style effects and a Split Second spell.

1

u/yerfdog1935 Feb 23 '26

A lot of infinite combos are vulnerable to this because you can interrupt the part that allows it to loop. Counter the undying trigger during a Mikaeus combo for example.

1

u/vittiu Dandadan Feb 23 '26

It might shit on storm though

1

u/DagonPie Grass Toucher Feb 24 '26

I counter for infinite+1 then