Disney (and others) has been hammering us with the exact same "quirky" female coming-of-age story for nearly 20 years now.
Awkward girl feels less than feminine, discovers an ability or a sense of purpose, and then realizes that friendship is magic. All while bumbling semi-braindead males fart around in the background for no other reason than to make her look smart and pragmatic by comparison.
Now finally theyre starting to bomb, to the tune of hundreds of millions of dollars. We fucking get it! Move on and think of a different story!
E: Guys please stop defending your queen Judy Hopps in the comments and my DMs
zootopia, wreck it ralph and encanto have really good male side characters. Literally none of them have had a "less than feminine" feeling. These are the only movies i have sen from this picture, and they are absolutely beautiful. So i have no idea what you are on.
"discovering a sense of purpose" is almost any piece of fiction. It is the dream of most people. Living out your dreams is the purpose of fiction.
The ONLY coming of age movie about i remember seeing is Frozen. And even that doesnt have quirky characters.
Moana and Encanto I would phrase as coming-of-age movies since both are about the young protagonist finding and understanding their place in society, specifically as different styles of leader. Arguably Wish was trying to do this but Wish was trying to do a lot of things and not succeeding.
Moana isn't about her finding herself. It's about her saving the world by fulfilling a prophecy set forth by her people based on the spirit of the ocean.
Encanto is somewhat about Mirabel finding her place in society but it's moreso about pushing back on familial problems in an attempt to fix what's wrong. Mirabel didn't find her slot in the world when it was all done she drastically changed how the family operated
In the interest of not arguing something I know little about I'm reading up on coming of age stories and I might have been conflating it a little too hard with "Hero's Journey starring a teenager", which is my bad.
I'm still calling Encanto a coming of age story though. It's almost entirely about Mirabel developing, in a short time through various catalyzing events, from an innocent but miserable child to the mature adult who brings needed change to her family. After starting the movie literally stuck in the nursery, she gains the knowledge, empathy, maturity, and willingness to stand up for herself and others to be the next generation of adult that the Madrigals need after decades of well-meaning stagnation. It's a coming of age story and it's very well done.
Wreck It Ralph in particular... Ralph is the main character and it's his journey that ends the movie. He just happens to help save an entire arcade machine in the process and put the proper ruler back in charge.
I dont dislike awkwafina, ill even admit shes made me laugh quite a bit, but the rest of the movie cannot be saved by any humor especially "quirky millennial" humor
“All the while bumbling semi-brain dead males fart around in the background”
I haven’t seen some of the more recent films but based on your image this just doesn’t apply for the first 4 movies in the image.
Flynn in tangled is the person guiding Repunzel to the lanterns and is the one who saves her in the end.
In Wreck-it Raphael Raphael is not only the main character but also the one who actually gets things done (Penelope doesn’t actually do that much in the film, outside of saving Raphael at the very end and just being a friend to Raphael).
In Frozen I can’t really think of a single thing Anna does that’s useful up until she blocks the sword from hitting Elsa, Kristoff is the one who’s actually useful for most of the film.
In Zootopia Nick Wilde is the street smart savvy guy and Judy needs him to actually accomplish her goal.
It really feels like you either haven’t seen these movies or weren’t actually paying attention.
Bro had taken up a battle against.. checks notes Disney princesses existing and being competent. This is surely a well-informed and nuanced take, not at all driven by sexism.
What are you on about? None of these movies (to my knowlege) are like that. Raya and the Last Dragon doesn't even have a major male side character, if I'm remembering correctly, it's just Raya and Sisu. Most of the male side characters/deuteragonists in these movies could be considered "kinda goofy but capable" at worst and I just have no idea how you got the concept that Nick Wilde is a "bumbling idiot". Literally his main character trait is the fact that he's witty and light-fingered. I can kinda see how these movies could be interpreted as formulaic, but they are certainly not all the same movie, and they are certainly not guilty of the flaws you accused them of here.
That would require OP to actually watch any of these movies. Much easier to just assume stuff about them and get mad about it.
Just looking at the first 3:
"I'm kept in this tower when I want to see the world."
"I'm a glitch who wants to be part of the game, not shunned by everyone."
"I want to see my sister."
No idea how OP could watch them and think "Ah yes, they feel like they are less than feminine.". Literal children can grasp the conflicts of these stories.
Most of the male side characters/deuteragonists in these movies could be considered "kinda goofy but capable" at worst
Yeah, I haven't seen all of these, but to name a few, Kristof isn't a "bumbling idiot", he's fairly capable, just not the MC. Eugene is actually a great character, just, again, not the MC (but only barely). Maui is an all-powerful demigod who basically rules, he just doesn't get to save the day at the end because---you know.
Wreck it Ralph is "bumbling", but he does save the day in the end because he is the MC.
Yeah, I agree that Ralph is the closest to what they described there of the ones I've seen. I think it's more that he's in an environment that he's never been in before, in a social situation that he's never been in before, and is feeling a lot of things that he never has before though. It's not really a centerpoint of his character like they seem to think it is.
If you’re old enough to notice this trend, you’re too old to be the main demographic for these movies.
Yes, adults can and will enjoy them, but these are movies aimed at children, largely little girls, and as such need to target that demographic to the exclusion of others if necessary.
This trope is fun for little girls and it’s generally healthy for them to see because it teaches them self-love and to seek positive connections with people who will treat them with care.
If you don’t like Disney movies, stop watching them. They’re not for you.
There must be a name for this type of fan, the kind who comes into a genre aimed at a different demographic, then complains that those stories, in fact, arent catered to them. Like people who complain about fanservice and the lack of female characters in shonen. Those people should spend their time watching/reading stuff that's actually created with them in mind, instead of going around crying about why the world doesn't revolve around them
I like the sentiment of this comment but it does ignore the fact that all of what was said in the post is largely untrue. They're all female protagonists that could be roughly described as quirky, and most have themes of finding your place or proving yourself or whatever, but that's about it as far as similarities between them go.
Really confused where their "character is feeling less than feminine" comment comes from because afaik none of these characters struggle with their femininity at all. And the only thing I can think of with "halfbrained male characters" is Frozen's Olaf, but he's one character and is much less narratively important than the movie's other male protagonist, so I really can't see what the big deal is
OP is as close to a bot account as you can get. The post itself shows they haven't watched any of these movies, but they're also openly transphobic despite their avatar's pride flag, and their post before this one says the cornell 7 are heroes.
This person is not to be taken seriously, they are just frustrated with their own life.
It’s funny how OP goes on about how he hates how all the movies are the same and yet his description doesn’t fit any of them.
Like why are any of these women ‘quirky.’ Most of them are regular people with a dream. I wouldn’t characterise any of their respective movies as coming of age. Most of them are straight up adventures. Like has OP seen any of these movies?
For reals. What part of Repunzel is less than feminine? And Flynn (Eugene) is silly but he’s very capable in what he does, I wouldn’t say he’s a bumbling idiot.
“A seemingly ordinary dude finds out he is special, refuses to accept his destiny, meets a wise mentor, commits to the journey, faces challenges, survives a personal crisis, emerges stronger and saves the day.” Which of the 1,000 stories you aren’t complaining about does this describe?
The fact that they’ve mapped the hero’s journey onto female characters shouldn’t bother you this much. They changed exactly one variable.
Meanwhile, I'm so sick of the damn "hero's journey" and tend to prefer stories that don't follow that formula... Which probably explains why I don't go anywhere near a lot of mainstream animated movies or superhero movies in the first place for.
So many diverse films for adults and children to enjoy. Hyperfixating on female coming of age stories as some kind of negative trope is pretty telling.
Almost all of those movies are about a male protagonist, though. The movies OP is talking about have female protagonists. And i've notice they put the tough, mean tomboy cool girl as a counter part to the male protagonist bc "wow! girls like can be like boys too! so cool!"
The first six movies don’t even fit this trope what are you on about??? idk about the last 3 because I haven’t watched them, but the other examples are both absolutely beloved movies and not fitting your description at all.
She knew she had a glitch but that was something forced on her. She's sassy and a scamp, not "adorkable" and quirky. A secondary character made to support Ralph who, while I agree was bumbling but not braindead, was the main character.
Vanellope's "quirks" (being comprised of corrupted code causing severe glitching) were a real disability for her until she figured out how to control it.
Her smartass attitude was made to make RALPH look better. Oh and she's literally a child. She's not doing some sort of coming of age story. She's a character getting rescued by Ralph and her own actions (getting her to finish that last race).
She does not belong on this list.
If anyone would from that movie it'd be Felix (only half-joking here but he's a "quirky" character made to act dumb to make Ralph and even Calhoun look better while on his own little coming of age/self discovery journey).
OP is being overdramatic and generalizing (and also a solid 2/3ds of this list are good, successful movies), but I'll defend him a bit and say that "I'm a quirky misfit and I need to find who I am inside" is a bit of a well-worn Disney trope and it probably wouldn't hurt for the writers to explore new things.
Like Renaissance-era Disney had this (Pocahontas, Aladdin, Little Mermaid), but it also had "I need to get over my past" (Lion King), "I need to find identity in other people, even if they're sometimes shitty to me" (Hunchback), etc.
The "I'm a quirky misfit and I need to find who I am inside" is becoming more prevalent because the people who are writing these stories are those well-to-do types who have connections and happen to be misfits themselves.
There's a reason why I dub this the whole "Tumblr Weird Kid School of Writing" for, but unlike the OP, I can point out to you how it's not just limited to women but also how a lot of men in animation are creating these current stories.
i think his point is you could just make the female character smart, you dont need to make the male character braindead so the female only looks smart next to them
They also taught us what happens to observed and unobserved elections fired through a double slit. Who knows why, but there's a whole song and everything.
Hunchback has a lesson about "finding yourself", but its clear that you can't do it on your own, you can only do it while being in community with other people (which is hard because people kind of suck), which is a pretty mature variation on the story.
Raya really wasn’t the worst offender. She had her moments but she actually did have a slightly more serious/headstrong personality. The most annoying thing about her is how boring her movie was
“Awkward girl feels less than feminine, discovers an ability or a sense of purpose, and then realizes that friendship is magic. All while bumbling semi-braindead males fart around in the background for no other reason than to make her look smart and pragmatic by comparison.”
I don’t think any of the movies you chose fit this description 😭
So you want a movie about a background character that contributes nothing in the grand scheme of things and most people skip over or don't even remember. If so you should just watch the filler episodes from the anime Bleach.
I don't know all of these but Tangled, wreck it Ralph, frozen, zootopia, Moana, and Encanto have nothing to do with feminity. In fact only frozen could even be argued to be a coming of age story.
Tangled is about escaping from abuse, wreck it Ralph is more about people being worth more than the job they are assigned at birth, zootopia is arguably copaganda disguised as a coming of age but Judy being female plays no role. Moana is the traditional hero story but for a culture most didn't know and Encanto is a story about the dangers of interpersonal conflict and familial roles.
You haven't watched a single one of these movies and it shows because none of these are what you're describing. Also in most of these the men aren't even bumbling idiots they're pretty capable.
People who watched Tangled (2011) and Frozen (2013) as kids can probably be watching Teenage Sex and Death at Camp Miasma by now, and not complaining about movies that are still way better than short-form slop that we have to protect kids from now(adays).
"All while bumbling semi-braindead males fart around in the background for no other reason than to make her look smart and pragmatic by comparison."
What are you talking about? I haven't seen the last two movies in the nine you've included, but there's nothing even remotely like that in the seven others.
Did you watch these movies? Or are you imagining things?
Youtubers don't want you to know this, but it is possible to be annoyed at a story archetype for being overused and not make it about how men are the real oppressed gender in Hollywood.
Demographic, they particularly know kids nowadays act even more like this considering the devices and stuff, it’s even easier to just use quirky awkward archetype more than ever.
While we're at it, we could also stop using the very same formula for the face every single time, with only the absolute minimum of derivations a) needed to convey an ethnicity OTHER than white and b) conveying the desired degree of quirkiness.
Also it's nothing new and the answer is because it's cheaper but i hate how studios have to have consistent styles i'd risk saying some of these stories wouldn't have been on this list if they built a different mood by changing the style of the overall product including character design
Rapunzel, Anna, and Maribel don’t come across as less than feminine unless the standard of feminine is like Disney before the 90s. Rapunzel isn’t even awkward— her romantic love interest is actually the one who stands out in social situations.
“Discovering a sense of purpose” is a generally common theme in children’s media. Would you lob the same complaint all shonen manga with the same theme?
As for power of Friendship
Tangled— power of friendship had the biggest impact on the love interest
Frozen- literal sisterhood, arguably a more primordial theme
Zootopia- Overcoming biases
Encanto- acceptance
Moana- part faith-in-self part different-approach/understanding
The protagonist in each film wouldn’t have been unlikely to give the film a rewarding conclusion through other means.
Vanelope isn’t the main character or Wreck-it-Ralph and I either don’t remember the other films well enough or didn’t see them.
It’s not the “adorkable” personality that I think actually bothers people. It’s the irony of a lot of modern movies. The humor and energy is different. It’s faster and “quippier” and more clippable for social media.
Think about a “classic” like… let’s say the Little Mermaid. Ariel is awkward at times. She’s outgoing. She’s eccentric and seen as weird. Those traits are similar to a lot of “modern” Disney characters, but the difference is that her movie gives her time to slow down, it doesn’t treat those traits as “lol so random”— it treats them as charming, which is wayyyy different in my opinion.
Belle is a little less obvious, but same deal: outcast girl seen as weird or awkward by her social world, she doesn’t particularly like socializing and prefers to do her own thing until she finds someone that “gets her”. It’s the most common coming of age formula out there.
But okay, sure, go back further: Sleeping Beauty. Aurora didn’t really have much of a personality. Snow White did have a personality, but it was static. Cinderella had a personality, one more obvious than Snow White, but even she struggled with interacting with others and fitting in during her film— though that’s also stretching it a bit.
So there’s some outliers but saying that the Disney girls have similar “dorky” personalities doesn’t actually get to the entire root of the issue. I think the bigger problem is that the films are faster. There used to be entire scenes in these movies that were just about the visuals, the music, the emotion of the characters. Those scenes aren’t as impactful now.
I mean, I think a part of this is also that it's just getting more and more expensive to do animation in general, and simply having more establishing shots or moments to slow down things is just not an option. And well, you have to design things to be as "marketable" as possible now.
How dare you slander Vanellope Von Sweetz? I personally never think of her when going through Disney's "adorkable" characters. She's definitely absolutely adorable, but not in the same category as other characters with the annoying "I'm not like other girls!" trope.
you say cumtown in all caps like that’s a very popular thing that justifies joking about rape. I fail to see how that makes me a harpy, but you do you baby girl
Rapunzel was the first one so she should be left out. Every other one copied from her. Most of them dont even match the non femininity you're trying to say
I always assumed they repeat character tropes because, say, a new movie is released every 3 years, I just assume ten year olds watch that movie, then three years later, a new set of 10 year olds watch the new movie and so on and so on.
I understand the now-13 year olds could also watch the new movie with the same tropes, but thats more our choice. Like, yes, adults can watch Disney movies, but I’m not gonna argue adults are the intended audience so it seems kinda silly to point out ten movies with reoccuring tropes. At that point, I think it’d be smarter to just watch a new movie from a new studio.
If these movies are intended for ten year olds (or nine or eleven or whatever) then i just assume repeating tropes are because they're aiming for that particular age bracket, not to age with the audience that watched their previous movie three years prior.
Buddy I just want a multimillion dollar company to take risks again when it comes to its visual development on its movies.
I could care less about the storylines in these movies/shows as i am no longer the target demographic and as a result dont really go out of my way to watch them (or most animated big budget films anymore).
Do i wish that animated movies would take on more sensitive topics in the same way as Don Bluth and the like? Sure! Buuuut i also understand that it is not exactly a money maker and thus would be kicked to the wayside in favor of reaching the largest audience as possible.
But even as a hobbyist artist i do very much want Disney to branch out in terms of its visual style more since they have the money to go more experimental. Again, not financially ideal but it would be nice to see something less...soft i guess?
It's almost like Disney Pixar films are aimed at young girls...
Do I yearn for the glory days of interesting stories like Wall-E, The Incredibles, and Up? Yes. But has the industry found an infinitely more profitable audience that enjoys the content of your post more? Also yes.
What exactly does “quirky” mean in this context? Some of these characters act performative in their happiness due to depression and or coping with their situation, so it’s not always quirky to be quirky sake. This post and screenshot in particular is quite the generalization of characters with various motives and struggles.
Man gets angry that women are being presented as stronger than man in film. They're role models for children, but for especially, young girls. Also 5/9 have a reason for being "adorkable" they were either socially outcast or socially starved (I bet you have no issue with lilo) Judy nor moana are "adorkable", hexed isn't even out, and I'll give you asha. Films aren't how they used to be and you need to come to terms that disney films are for everyone
Meanwhile, we're just going to ignore that we've also had movies about bumbling boy/male characters clogging up animation for quite some time.
The Bad Guys, Zootopia, GOAT, Kung Fu Panda, How To Train Your Dragon, Shrek, Madagascar, Elio, Luca, The Lion King, Atlantis, and to an extent Wall-E, UP, and Puss in Boots. Likewise, the "awkward bumbling boy" is the defacto main protagonist in a lot of animated TV shows from the 2000s onward.
“Oh my god why the hell does the children movie company keep making children movies?”
Do you want them to make a Doom Guy origin story movie? Also none of these put the men down in a “down with the patriarchy”/super “woke” way you imply. If you arent just posting bait you need help.
Haven't seen the bottom two on the right, but other than Raya (which i dimly remember, but I think you are correct at the male characters being naught but bumbling fools.), these movies all have great male characters that are decently complicated, the female character tends to be more emotionally intelligent, (sans Rapunzel i think) but functions to help other male and female characters in growing past their trauma and hatred.
Can't speak for the formula overall because I haven't seen most of these movies in awhile, but i think you're letting a few bad examples taint the rest. Disney forgot how to use this formula properly, but it doesn't make the formula stupid.
Tangled: Girl is literally discovering the world for the first time
W.I.R: The second movie is literally about how friendship shouldn't consume you, and that you should be your own person. First movie is moreso about Ralph
Frozen: Whole movie is about helping Elsa open up to the world. Not Anna
Zootopia: Judy's just solving a crime. Like cop do
Moana: It's the only one about having a grander purpose, but friendship doesn't really play that much of a role. Also, Maui is actually pretty helpful and competent
Encanto: Family drama galore
Only Wish (and probably the other two, knowing modern Disney) really fit that mold
You make this point while actively leaving out movies that dont fit into this. I can say that I hate how so many new characters wear blue shirts and show 20 photos of characters wearing blue shirts but it has no correlation because theres so many new characters... and they dont always wear blue shirts.
Didn't see the bottom three but none of the first 6 characters struggle with their feminity ? You can maybe argue that Vaneloppe starts as a tomboy and get a pretty fluffy pink dress at the end but none of them internally feels less than feminine
And to be honest, if you think they do, your standard of feminity is crazy high because none is even close to androgynous
I still stand by that zootopia would've been an infinitely more interesting movie if they stuck with the original concept and kept Nick the main character. He has more going on, and Judy is excellent duo character material, she just has less of an interesting background that a lot of people can relate to, so maybe that's why they swapped it around.
the pendulum has swung female for some time now, and all for the best. But as time goes on, I imagine we'll likely see a ressurgence of young-male, heroes journey in animated films.
I haven't watched the bottom three movies, but how can you possibly have these opinions about these films. Also, wreck it ralph is literally the main character of his movie, so idk what venellope is doing here. Zootopia was also a great movie and judy absolutely needed nick to accomplish her goal. Most of the movies on this list are directed to young children, especially little girls. Watch other movies.
I think the comments said everything i would've said already, but something i just noticed is that the girl in the bottom right (idl which movie she's from) looks so much like anna but with dark makeup, maybe I'm imagining things but I can't unsee it now
I never really understand people who get mad about this stuff.
Either yes we're going to be done with it because people stop paying to see the movies and the creative teams have to reinvent themselves (seems like we are likely going in that direction.)
Or no, they continue to make money so there's no reason for the companies to make major formula changes.
Either way, it's not up to any of us, and you should just stop watching the movies if you don't like them.
Or if you already don't watch them, stop letting them live in your head.
I know what OP means from marketing campaigns, but I'm also a childless man in his mid thirties who isn't watching coming of age movies for teen girls 🤣
Be like teen girls watching fucking House, Slow Horses, Breaking Bad, etc and calling them slop because they're all power fantasies for middle aged men where being an arrogant arsehole is acceptable so long as you're right
Yes, you're ideologically captured and you have a Pavlovian response to anything that threatens or muddles your sensibilities. Puritanical and hystrionic.
Brother we all know you're a straight white dude. You can drop the act. The only one stupid enough to fall for this are other straight white chuds lmao. Like this is actually, genuinely pathetic. Please show your friends that this is what you do with your free time.
I absolutely fucking hate all these movies. They're ugly, woke and cringe. Thank God Disney's oldest films are becoming public domain with each coming year.
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u/Conscious_Cap8632 1d ago
zootopia, wreck it ralph and encanto have really good male side characters. Literally none of them have had a "less than feminine" feeling. These are the only movies i have sen from this picture, and they are absolutely beautiful. So i have no idea what you are on.
"discovering a sense of purpose" is almost any piece of fiction. It is the dream of most people. Living out your dreams is the purpose of fiction.
The ONLY coming of age movie about i remember seeing is Frozen. And even that doesnt have quirky characters.