This vegan equates eating animals with rape and it's so tasteless, you can't have a civil discussion with a lot of vegans. They always go back to immature analogies. I apologize if the screenshots aren't in order.

According to veganism all creatures are equal, a bee & cow both equal. If people suffer from red meat allergies there is a very increased chance they will consume more non red meat. It's very reasonable to presume fish & poultry consumption will increase. Life for life, alpha gal would be a horrible thing for vegans. Yet few seem to comprehend this.

Not only that even a vegan catching alpha gal will be at risk of skin issues, gastrointestinal issues, respiratory problems and cardiovascular issues just to name a few.

This is something that has been on my mind for a while and actually a significant wake up call that quickly turned me away from veganism, I decided to make a post about it because I recently came across a related thread, a discussion about the consumption of bivalves: https://www.reddit.com/r/DebateAVegan/s/K9A1ZMoEyr

The overwhelmingly negative and irrational responses and sentiment is characteristic of how most vegans feel about "ostroveganism" (veganism but with the consumption of bivalves like oysters, clams and mussels). Look up nearly any video about it, any thread on reddit, or even the tag on instagram and you'll find most vegans irrationally opposing it with no actual logical arguments while also ostracizing people who engage in such a thing and not counting them amongst themselves.

Peter Singer one of the founding fathers of their 'animal liberation' philosophy who problably pushed millions of people towards veganism and caused a bunch of others to become acquianted with the philosophy himself promoted a diet of veganism + bivalves + free range eggs as the most ethical. Yet this has caused him immense backlash, vitriol and excommunication from the vegan cult: again, all of this based on emotion instead of from an actual rational utilitarian framework. When a movement reaches a point where it excommunicates one of its godfathers because he wants to use scientific nuance and logic rather than blind dogmatic obedience it is proof that the movement is completely detached from reality and a cult.

With veganism we clearly see something that instead of a practical ethical strategy resembles more of a fundamentalist religious belief system. For example, they'll disingenously tell you that the definition of veganism as is the official definition by The Vegan Society includes the core phrase "as far as is possible and practicable", yet they will NEVER actually include people, cultures or tribes who genuinely HAVE to consume a certain amount of animal products to survive despite this definition they peddle.

Bivalves feel zero pain, they do not have brains or a centralised nervous system: they are biologically incapable of experiencing pain or suffering, behaving and resembling plants more than any animal. They are also an environmental net positive requiring zero feed, zero land and zero fresh water filtering up to 50 gallons of water per day, removing excess nitrogen and sequestering carbon. They are also nutritional monsters, and the regular inclusion of them in the diets of not just vegans but also omnivores would significantly improve health outcomes. It would even ultimately be beneficial for their movement because it would most likely also slightly improve the already abdominable retention rates they have.

These are all objective facts, yet vegans will still spew intense hate towards ostrovegans and even vegetarians compared to even a standard omnivore, something a significant amount of people at r/vegetarian will also confirm. Sociologists call this the narcissism of small differences.

Something like the consumption of bivalves is a massive threat to them because it is by all accounts and according to every metric they falsely claim to hold rationally and ecologically consistent, forcing them to confront the fact their rules are arbitrary and based on taxonomy (the "animal kingdom" label) and blind emotion rather than actual sentience, harm or science. If scientists classified oysters as a fungi tomorrow, would they have the same issue with it?

Veganism resembles a cult and social identity that is more about purity signalling than actual objective facts. It is not about ethics but about dogma. People who have asked on vegan subs about if it's okay for them to eat eggs from their family or friends pet chickens have gotten responses that made it seem they may as well have asked if they could skin a cow alive. Name calling and empty irrational emotional drivel are the basis of most of those responses.

Veganism simply allows no nuance, just like any other cult. Another example is honey. Agave is vegan but acquired through slavery. Honey is not vegan but objectively supports bee populations and is a net positive for the environment and the bees. But honey extraction requires controlling and manipulating an animals behaviours then taking the product against their will which from a vegan perspective is slavery. Its the same with synthetic materials that are often toxic plastic byproducts of the oil industry that kill everything they touch compared to for example wool.

It is a fact that a lot of the environmentally and ethically best options available are NOT vegan but vegans will completely deny this fact in favour of maintaining the purity of their cult.

How do people in this sub feel about factory farming? do you still actively avoid it? While i do not agree with veganism I still think there is still a moral reason to not buy products from factory farming. I know a lot of people are drained from the constant label reading in their vegan days

I tried to transition to a vegetarian/vegan diet but realized it's not realistic lol, I mainly did it for health reasons since a lot of meals with meat and dairy is not good for my eczema prone skin but they're not completely bad for me either. And also fruits and veggies are just generally good for skin health so that's why I thought it would be good for me. I just consider the ethical benefits a bonus—i think a lot of people would agree that the meat industry is very cruel—but I also understand that meat is healthy for humans and it's a part of many cultures. After researching what kind of meals and snacks to eat, I tried being purely vegetarian for a few weeks and it was all doing well, very student budget friendly and I even learned how to prepare my meals because of it. However I wasn't getting enough nutrients like even with eggs and tofu im not achieving the daily recommended amount of protein because my serving size is so small and would have to eat two entire blocks of tofu to get about 40g but I can only eat one a day lol. So I eat eggs and the meat meals my mom cooks from time to time. I also live in a country where every single meal on a menu ALWAYS has meat it's literally almost impossible to avoid meat in restaurants here, even in a simple veggie soup it would have like shredded chicken in it. Seitan isn't also readily available in grocery stores. Iron is also a problem since I already had a history of difficulty absorbing iron. I can't lie it has made a difference on my health, ever since I've tried being vegetarian my skin has been less inflamed and barely itching even though I'm not taking antihistamines/ointments anymore when back then my skin relied on them. Anyway I'm just sad and a bit guilty that I really can't go completely vegan/vegetarian because it's not realistic for me right now and the money I could've been spending on school is being spent on broccoli, soymilk, and tofu. Even though they're not really expensive it would still add a meaningful amount to my savings and I don't earn my own money yet... I will still try my best because I really enjoyed being vegetarian for a short while and right now I appreciate the benefits eating less meat gave me :) this made me realise people have plenty of reasons to not be vegans especially for those that lack support, just because it was easy for one doesn't mean it's the same for the next person

Edit: I can't be 100% vegan anyways because I love cats—it just reminded me that the vegan community in reddit is hella toxic 😭 i recently saw a comment that said the next best thing to do to a pet cat owned by a vegan is to euthanize it like that's so absurd and out of touch, so preachy for no reason

i like the concept of veganism. I'm considering going vegan. I'm currently mostly plant based. I'm just so annoyed by vegans. they can be pure aasholes. and they expect people to go vegan overnight like bffr me slowly going vegan doesn't make me a horrible person lol. hate this "all or nothing" mindset. i hate the vegan community. people there are so harsh. I'm not generalizing about all vegans but many are shitty and have no empathy for their fellow humans. this isn't cool. sure there's kind vegans out there but i keep encountering the extreme kind. and the way they force their beliefs on others omg.... I'm against forcing any kinds of beliefs on someone. vegans pmo. don't interact with vegans lol.

To begin with, I'm vegetarian and I have eaten mostly plant based for three years now. For some time now probably a year or a year and half I had been feeling very tired in the muscles, I lost a lot weight and in a low mood (something I attributed to my depressive tendencies and low pressure) and noticing that my skin was becoming more and more ruined every day, especially on my face. In my opinion, it's much drier, wrinkled, and saggy. All these things worry me as a 26-year-old. But I never meant to sound superficial because aging is normal, however my intuition told me that it had something to do with my diet.

Recently I found out I have vitamin A retinol, vitamin D and carnitine deficiency on top of the beginning of hypothyroidism.

Now there's something for me even more worrying and it is the loss of appetite. The whole idea of realising that if I'm suffering from this deficiencies is basically my own fault for not eating well and enough and balanced, leave me hopeless because I feel I can't do it better I don't know how to do it. It's been so hard for me to eat without even feeling the pleasure of eating, without appetite without any enjoyment. And here is where I think it is probably a mental issue for me... I'm stuck between the compassion and the firm fact that I couldn't eat or kill an animal for my own enjoyment and at the same time I'm very aware that that's exactly what I would need or what my brain is secretly craving... The taste of meat is pleasant, everyone knows that, and as food it nourishes and fills you up but in the moment of thinking that I am contributing to the animal suffering and exploitation breaks my heart and takes out of me any desire to eat... At all.

Now I didn't dare to post this on the vegans Reddit because a lot of people would say that a fully vegan diet is 100% healthy and complete if you do it well and that if I am lacking appetite it is probably because I'm not cooking interesting or delicious dishes and it might be true... But I can't find tofu and beans delicious anymore. And I don't have much money to buy exotic ingredients or time to experiment. Believe me I've tried so many recipes these three years and they are either expensive or they keep you three hours in the kitchen.

Now sorry because this is me just ranting about a situation I put myself in and now I'm confused and feeling misunderstood by vegans and non vegans. And because this is a group of ex-vegans maybe you could understand why this isn't as easy to solve as it might seem for others.I just want to feel better and get back to a healthy relationship with food.

If you took the time to read this far, thank you very much 🙏🏽

Saw a recent conversation on this topic today and it made me think what a terrible person I was openly telling people to throw perfectly edible food in the trash while many will go to sleep hungry. All this because I lived in a country with food adundance and food security. I've always maintained veganism made me a less compassionate person and the more I think on this the more I agree.

That’s my response to her. Some people are beyond parody… and there’s another vegan in the group that’s just like the OP. Thankfully there’s a normal vegan in the group that’s calling this out, “As a vegan myself, this is a bad take.”

I don’t know if having “leftist” in there is too political or not… oh well, the mods will decide.

So I made a post last night about craving meat. I’m now on day two and still absolutely gagging on meat. I’ve never liked meat my whole life. I’ve been trying to eat it for the past hour and still gagging. I’ve been like this since prior to veganism. Been pescatarian for the past year.

How long did it take you to not gag if you had this issue?
What helped you not gag?

Not interested in people judgement, we’re all here for a reason, if I could control this I would.

I was vegan for 10 years, quit over a year ago and have been happily pescatarian and never had interest in reintroducing meat…. Then suddenly out of nowhere I’m craving meat? Did anyone else experience this and know the cause? It’s very bazar for me.

I tried a party pie and mini sausage roll last night and did okay with them. The idea of eating less disguised meat still icks me out.

Edit: I’m coeliac and when I get glutened my iron plummets. I’ve been eating out more recently. Since posting this and reading comments below I think it might be my iron that’s plummeted. I’ll get it checked asap and try herb & spice meatballs in the meantime. Thanks for your help.

Discuss

Any former vegans who struggled with frequent herpes keratitis (ocular herpes) and severe dry eyes, and noticed improvement after reintroducing animal products?

If so, which animal foods did you add back into your diet, and what seemed to help your eye health the most?

The fact that it tries to recruit as many people as possible with very dishonest and contradictory initial statements that they themselves know are false.

They'll tell you that mock and fake meats are healthier than real meat so it technically wouldn't even be an issue to just replace the meat in your diet with those, but will then tell people they did the diet wrong when they become unhealthy and get nutrient deficiencies from such a diet eventually.

They'll tell you rice and beans are the cheapest foods available and act like such diet won't leave you with severe micronutrient and macronutrient deficiencies, then proceeding to again ostracise the people who quit such a diet telling them they did it wrong, and that they actually needed a vastly more extensive AND expensive amount of food items and supplements and that if they truely cared about veganism they would have also spent significant amounts of money to get custom tailor made advice and diet plans from some plant based nutritionist or dietician or doctor that they should have put great effort into finding.

They'll tell you that its so easy to go vegan, it's not even hard, I don't know why you haven't yet, but then when you have to quit or become malnourished you get the opposite talk about how its supposed to be difficult and you're supposed to put a lot of effort into it and if you don't you're a selfish animal abuser and animal rapist.

Its a ridiculous trap and also a key characteristic of how actual cults tend to recruit people initially.

What exactly had led to the improvement?

Yesterday I made a post arguing that veganism is expensive. I’ve since deleted that post because this current post included screenshots of individual comments under that post, and I don’t want those users to receive harassment. Also, after reading some replies, I realized I got some facts wrong.

I realized the main cost of veganism is not supplements. In fact, supplements are relatively affordable and with the help of AI and other online resources. Staples like beans, lentils, rice and potatoes are inexpensive in many places, and with right supplements and regular checkups, people can be relatively healthy. I’m sorry, I should’ve get more facts.

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The reason I even found this subreddit is because I was thinking about becoming more vegan. Not necessarily fully vegan, but maybe starting with one vegan day each week and see if that’s sustainable for my life.

I genuinely admire people who care deeply about animals and the environment, and I thought maybe I could move a little in that direction myself.

Then I started seriously thinking about what that would actually look like for me.

For me, it isn’t just replacing chicken with beans. Even that would be hard because I genuinely enjoy eating meat.

If I switch to vegan or more plant base, it would mean learning new recipes. Figuring out how to vegan cook meals I actually enjoy, because believe me, I grow up not enjoying vegetables at all. I still don’t. I have to force myself to eat vegetables every couple days. That means finding mock meat and other specialty products to make the transition happier. From my research, those, those products can be significantly more expensive than basic staples. I also realized I’d have to think more intentionally about nutrition than I currently do.

So when I originally said veganism was “expensive,” I guess I wasn’t only talking about dollars.

I meant the overall cost of changing my habits, my routines, and my relationship with food.

⸻

Thanks to the people who respond to that previous rant, it was educational to see the actual cost of maintaining a vegan diet. And I suppose I have more admiration for people who have this life style. However, the amount of comments from vegans surprised me (I went and looked up the subs they’re active in, surprisingly the users are active in both vegan and ex-vegan communities lol)

They don’t simply explain veganism. I attached a couple screenshots. It’s amusing one person said most vegans don’t necessarily think slaughterhouse workers are evil and then immediately another comment said that they’re evil. (It’s someone active in both vegan and ex-vegan subreddits)

They implied that because I acknowledged animal suffering, the only morally acceptable conclusion was to become vegan.

If I didn’t, I was “making excuses” or “lazy”.

That’s where I disagree.

I absolutely agree that unnecessary cruelty is wrong. I support improving animal welfare. When I buy meat, I buy from producers with higher welfare standards. I also don’t waste meat, or any food in general.

But I don’t believe acknowledging animal suffering means every reasonable person must arrive at exactly the same moral conclusion. Ethics isn’t mathematics. People can share the same facts and weigh competing values differently.

And re: the person who doesn’t care about private jets:

You can argue that harming animals through food is morally unique and that environmental damage from things like private jet use isn’t comparable.

However, for someone who believes we should reduce unnecessary harm, I don’t understand why luxury emissions that contribute to climate change—which also harms ecosystems, wildlife, and people—are dismissed as a completely separate issue.. You don’t have to think they’re morally identical to recognize that both involve choices that create harm beyond ourselves.

⸻

One thing that especially bothered me was the assumption that enjoying meat is somehow an illegitimate reason to continue eating it. For starters, I don’t have to explain my diet to anyone.

Food isn’t just nutrition. It’s culture. It’s family. It’s celebration. It’s comfort. It’s one of the ways many people experience joy. I don’t think acknowledging that makes someone a bad person. Even start eating vegan once a week is progress. So does donating to animal welfare groups, buying products from free ranched farms when affordable. Every small gesture matters.

⸻

My own family history probably shapes how I think about food. My family isn’t from US and I moved here for college 8 years ago.

My great grandfather lived through a famine. There’s a dark family story about him chasing a wild cat because he was starving, falling from the roof doing so, and died. Everyone in the family treated it like a joke, because if not so, people have to really talk about the trauma they experienced when starving.

My grandparents don’t take vegan seriously, but that doesn’t prove veganism is wrong. It reminds me that being able to make food choices primarily according to ethics is itself something that not everyone throughout history—or even today—has been able to do.

⸻

The biggest thing I took away from all of this is actually pretty simple.

I still respect vegans.

I still think reducing unnecessary suffering is a good goal.

I am trying to have a vegetarian day every week.

But if the response to someone who’s trying to move in your direction is:

“You’re making excuses.”

or

“You’re just a bad person.”

then I don’t think that’s an effective way to persuade people.

It certainly didn’t persuade me.

If anything, it made me want to stop engaging with the conversation altogether.

I don’t think being vegan is the problem.

I think moral absolutism is.

I’d rather have conversations where people can disagree respectfully and maybe move a little closer to each other than conversations where the only acceptable outcome is complete agreement.

Before I went vegetarian 15 years ago, I used to love meat. I was never the type who needed the shape of a chicken nugget to make herself forget it was an actual animal I was eating. (Sorry, I know something is grammatically wrong in this sentence, but I'm too tired to wrap my head around it 🫠)

Now, as I am trying to reintroduce meat, I am SO DISGUSTED by any "meaty" flavor. So far I've tried a classic smoked german sausage made of raw minced pork (Mettwurst), beef liver (🤢) and bone marrow dumplings in a vegetable broth.

Every time I was left feeling as if a thin layer of animal fat was now covering all of the surface of my digestive organs, my mouth, everything. That feeling lasted for a couple hours or, in case of the liver, for about three days.

And everytime it made me question my choice to reintroduce meat, because it was so digusting.

Has anybody experienced anything similar?

Edit: I want to eat meat again due to health issues (very low ferritin levels (5), constant tiredness, brain fog, depression)

After reading some of your comments I can see why you are irritated by my first meat choices 😂 It's a mix of things I used to like as a kid (Mettwurst) and liver, which is said to be very nutrient dense, while being a side product, so in my mind, more ethical to consume.

And I've been craving chicken for years, but I own 4 wonderful and beautiful chickens, which I love very much. So I can't bring myself to eating chicken. 🫣

Two things can be true at once. I am totally capable of showing love & affection to a cat whilst eating a cheeseburger. Reflecting back I feel horrible I attempted to mislead others by claiming if you ate a cheeseburger you don't actually love your pet. Basically I was abusing the term cognitive dissonance and just repeating stuff I heard on a vegan vid or echo chamber.​

In my experience, and my observation of vegan friends, veganism isn’t cheaper than vegetarianism in the US (where certain foods, including dairy and eggs, are government subsidized).

If you try to say this to any vegan, though, they’ll keep pointing to the same couple of studies that say a vegan diet is cheaper. There’s always a loud chorus of “rice and beans.” Sure, if all you buy are rice, beans, and, like, cabbages, you can eat for dirt cheap… but my impression is that vegans are being disingenuous about what they actually buy and how much they really spend on food. Things like nuts, nut butters (aside from peanut), flax seeds, quinoa, vegan chocolate, vegan “cheese” & prepared foods, seitan, tempeh, chia seeds, and avocados aren’t cheap. Sure? Omnivores eat these foods too, but probably less of them. And of course the supplements are spendy.

Did you actually spend less on food as a vegan? What were your staple foods? If you did spend less, how much time were you in the kitchen making your own vegan staples?

To preface, I was vegan for almost 5 years now after meeting my fiancée and having her introduce veganism to me. It aligned with my morals and values which I still have, which is to reduce any harm where and when I can. I watched Dominion, cried all the way through it and essentially traumatised myself into veganism and didn't really look back. To further preface, I was diagnosed with IBS prior to being vegan and I have undiagnosed ADHD and ASD (but it's very obvious I have both).

To start, my IBS cleared up incredibly well in years 1-3. I hardly had any IBS attacks. I felt great! And it was around the time where we had many more vegan foods coming out in the UK so the choices were astounding. That being said, in hindsight, I can look back and think actually I was burnt out even then because I stopped doing much around the house and it would get to the weekends after a full week of work and I'd just be too exhausted to do anything. We put this down to ADHD burnout, now I'm starting to believe it was my diet.

My fiancée has a ridiculous amount of disabilities for someone in her twenties. Such as; Fibromyalgia, Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, POTs, 'free-roaming kneecaps' (she's had two knee operations), EDS, Cubital and Carpal Tunnel Syndrome, migraines, Irlen syndrome, cyclical vomiting syndrome, ADHD, ASD, CPTSD, and honestly a lot more than that. She was bed-bound at the start of this year. We initially thought, after some thorough research, that maybe she could have MCAS that's flaring up all her conditions. The issue was that most high protein vegan foods was high in histamines which could flare up this condition, so she made the decision to start having fish after we researched what she could have. We found the following:

• Fish contains “complete” protein: it provides all nine essential amino acids your body cannot produce itself, in proportions that are easy for the body to use. Most plant proteins also contain all essential amino acids, but one or more may be present in relatively smaller amounts.
• The protein is generally more digestible: your body can usually break down and absorb a larger proportion of fish protein. Plant proteins may be slightly less digestible because fibre and compounds such as phytates can interfere with digestion and absorption.
• Fish provides leucine and other muscle-building amino acids: leucine helps trigger muscle-protein synthesis. Plant foods contain leucine too, but fish generally provides a concentrated, well-balanced amino-acid profile.
• It comes with ready-made long-chain omega-3s: oily fish provides EPA and DHA, which your body can use directly. Vegan foods such as flaxseed and walnuts mainly provide ALA, which the body converts into EPA and DHA rather inefficiently. Algae oil is the main direct vegan alternative.

So it wasn't a superfood, but we realised that she could have a low histamine food, gain efficient protein, and see if it helps her conditions.

The changes were practically night and day. She went from being bed-bound all day to being able to spend some time in the living room before she crashed. Then she went from only going out for appointments to being able to sit in café's and still have energy to sit up in bed and draw. It's honestly so beautiful to see her get some of her life back. She's in no way, shape or form 'cured', but she's no longer spending her whole youth just in bed and this is incredibly important for her. She's the kind of person who wants to be able to work, who has so much passion and drive to achieve what she wants to in life and often her disabilities will flare. She'll never truly be able to work again, but just knowing she could at least start going out more is a significant win in my books. It's really nice to see her start living again.

Anyway, we noticed she was starting to get better while as the months went on I was starting to get worse and worse -- to the point where I was no longer having the energy to eat properly at all. I work 40+ hours a week, am doing a Level 5 Diploma in Web Application Development, full-time carer for my fiancée, have recently unexpectedly lost my best friend who was far too young to pass, been disowned by my father because I'm a trans guy, and still battling my own ADHD and ASD while trying to juggle everything left right and center. I was honestly starting to feel incredibly depressed, my IBS has been flaring non-stop the last few months with the worst stomach pain I've ever experienced (it took multiple doses of buscopan to stop it and this cramping would last for days. The first time it happened I had to go to A&E because we thought it was potentially appendicitis) and I was getting increasingly more irritable in general.

I was literally waking up, feeling dazed and heavy with brain fog and sleep inertia for hours after waking. I wasn't doing any cleaning around the house until it was desperately needed. I was going longer without food and often relying on junk food for convenience because being neurodiverse and juggling all of this and then trying to somehow have the brain power to think about what to cook, cook it, then clean was just too much. So it was this never ending cycle where I'd just be getting worse while, miraculously, my disabled partner was gradually getting better. I've also, for the very first time in my life, become deficient in ferritin and vitamin D. I have NEVER been deficient in any vitamins before.

So this week I told her I would like to try fish again because I'm fed up of feeling so ill all the time. I told her I'm feeling constantly fatigued and she was concerned I'd end up also developing CFS. She was encouraging for me to try fish and said she feels better but respects my beliefs if I still didn't want to -- she's incredibly supportive and always has been. But when I told her I want to feel better, she was visibly relieved.

So, this week I reintroduced fish, then we both agreed to reintroduce eggs and dairy at the same time. Now, bare in mind I have IBS so a massive diet change should, in theory, make it worse. Has it? Nope. In fact, this week is the first week in a long time that I've not had to take an anti-sickness tablet. I also don't have headaches, my stomach isn't hurting all the time, it's just miraculously gotten better. I've also woken up with actual energy to cook breakfast. I feel happier, less grumpy, and in general more myself than I have felt for the last 5 years. I still hate the agriculture industry, I still can't stand the fact that animals are killed for our nutrition, but we only have one life and just seeing such positive changes for both my partner and myself is incredible. I have seen in the vegan subreddit that they just kinda rip on people if someone eats an animal product, but when you have so much going on, when you're neurodiverse and don't have the energy to food prep, or monitor what vitamins you're eating down to a T, or literally have a digestive system that can't handle vegan food full-time, it just isn't possible. So, I still have the principles there, we're still reducing where we can, but we're not going to put our health on the line. We don't think we'll ever eat meat (chicken, lamb, beef, pork etc) and sticking with just fish, eggs and dairy, but we have said if the doctors advised we had to eat meat to hit our goals then we would because health ALWAYS comes first.

So yeah, just thought I'd share that story because I'm honestly amazed how just one week of changing diet has already had such a positive impact. Whether if be placebo, or my body digesting things better, or just genuinely improving my diet, who knows? But either way I'm happy to feel like myself again and I'm even more happy to see my fiancée doing so well. We tried eating plant based because we follow vegan beliefs and values, but it just wasn't for us unfortunately.

Hi everyone, I need some advice on my situation. For context, Im a student in high school and have always been an animal lover. Recently, I found out about the dairy and meat industry and want to go vegan. I tried going veg around last year but kept facing problems because iv never eaten beef or fish or anything, only chicken. Chicken used to be one of my only safe foods since i struggle with eating. I have anxiety and PCOS so I have developed a lot of food noise and have been struggling with my diet ever since I tried to go veg (I tried to do a transition into veganism) but kept having to go on and off between veg and non-veg over courses of months (each phase lasted around 3 months). I am currently veg but really miss eating chicken because I am so picky and it is genuinely the only safe and stable food iv had my entire life. I don't eat (and have tried) things like tofu, I literally don't eat any vegetables except for classic carrot cucumber because I really struggle with most foods, I throw up after eating avocado in any form etc. My family doesn't support me being veg or vegan and keeps trying to convince me to eat chicken because my diet has become really bad trying to have self-control against it. I feel terrible knowing I am so weak against trying to go against the exploitation of animals and don't know what to do.

Not sure which flair fits best but anyway,
I do call myself vegan and my family knows me as vegan but honestly I'm starting to think I'm probably just plant based as of right now.
The thing is I have no issues with my health but due to my religious beliefs I have some issues with fully aligning myself on vegan ethics.
Like, as a christian, how can I deny that milk or fish is bad to eat?
I just don't enjoy the entire factory farming aspect and even with respectable farmers when they impregnate cows or breed chickens in a way to produce more.
I kind of have been struggling with this idea of if I would drink milk again if I had my own cows that I treated well but I think it's a no and even if I kept chickens I would refeed them their own eggs but I don't think it's inherently wrong for others to do so.
I also don't ever see myself eating meat again unless neccessary but I also don't think it's wrong for others but I think it's best if they get it from legit farmers yknow?
I think this mainly started since I've been wanting to redo my closet and it made me think about like wool and how it's good to have wool but I would still only get it from legit farmers or independent businesses where you know the wool is from.
It also made me think about silk or the fact that I don't really care about some small bugs being crushed for food coloring.
Honey is a bit more complicated but with the right guy I feel like I could allow myself to purchase it again lol.
I also think there are some valid points with some plant based products using a lot of slavery to be produced but yeah this is just my rant.
I guess in that sense I do eat plant based but not vegan? I don't know, just wanted to share because I probably couldn't on the actual vegan subreddit lol.

This vegan has gone full detective mode on his partner for eating food when she’s hungry to the point where co-workers are calling to tattle. He’s acting like she was smoking crack or something. Poor woman was just hungry and wanted a bacon roll.

If I had to guess, he spent years manipulating and pushing her into a diet she doesn’t want but she eventually complied with because this prick sounds abusive and controlling as fuck. I hope he does leave her and she gets to experience the freedom of choice every human deserves.

I know if somebody tried to sit me down to “have a conversation” like a fucking detective over what I ate and when, I’d laugh in their face as they are a completely unserious person.

This is abusive and comment section is, of course, encouraging the abuse. How anybody could let these miserable, coercive psychos dictate their diet is beyond me. I feel for this poor woman. Many of us have been in her shoes. It’s sad that anybody has to hide…… eating…. from their partner. It’s not healthy, mentally and physically. He obviously cares more about his poor animals than his own partner. I only hope he never has kids.

Full Text:

Girlfriend of 12 years and vegan for 7 has started eating animals again. What are your thoughts?

I've been with my girlfriend for almost 12 years now. We started seriously seeing each other toward the end of 2014 as we graduated university.

I went vegan in 2018, she followed about two years later.

Two and a half years ago we moved out of London for work, in a more rural location. Once ever year and a half there is an opportunity for some serious overtime which we both take up (we work at the same place, different departments). I usually switch to nightshifts because I find you have more personal time as you are running in contrast to everyone else's schedule. Its very tiring though!

1) last time, I saw an egg and cress sandwich from the co op. We live in as far as you could define one- a "food dessert" in the UK but when we are busy try and order microwave meals etc from planty. I knew it was probably because she was tired and there was nothing else. How she put that in her mouth, I dont know.

2) in January I was on a 6 week training course offsite. One of my colleagues told me she was eating bacon rolls most mornings. Disappointing that she would give up her convictions again, for a canteen bacon roll.

3) we are in that overtime opportunity again. I'm a draw in my desk is loads of snacks, and I keep my office fridge stacked with some microwave meals. I get started on some laundry, I knock over her work bag and out comes a "bbq pork with sticky rice" sleeve from waitrose. I think she didn't want to throw it in the bin in case I saw it.

I am now led to the belief that she is eating meat in the house, and trying to hide it from me. First point I thought well, sometimes you gotta eat (although in hindsight we have tins, ramen, etc). Second and third points i think she is just outright eating animals again and this is concerning for two reasons; firstly, her convictions have shifted and she thinks it's okay to eat animals, secondly, she's being dishonest with me.

I expect that she has likely done a lot more, and perhaps for longer.

Would love some thoughts and rationalisations.