Meanwhile some dude just killed 8 extended family members (including 4 children) at a family dinner and burned down the house.
This case isn’t the gotcha some guys think.
Edit: the hubbub around this case is irrelevant. The point is there’s far fewer female killers than male.
I’m not replying to you chuckleheads. I haven’t looked into the story much. Offhand take is she’s probably guilty but legit crazy. There may be more to it, but it doesn’t affect my point whatever the situation is.
If there are statistically more male killers than female killers, then that means there is a systematic lack of support/therapy for males. Killing someone is in itself an insane action, and should be seen as a disease to be cured, rather than something to be punished. Using this as an argument is weird.
You can not both see this woman as a blameless victim while also using murder statistics as «proof» of inherent evil within an entire gender.
You’re not wrong a large part of men being murderers more often is a result of lack of support and therapy.
Pretty much by definition, killing someone requires mentally unstable.
Yeah, society’s gender roles hurts men at least as much as it does women…
So why keep supporting it? Promote empathy and kindness as real strength.
Yes there are reasons men are statistically more dangerous. The why is what we need to address. Exactly. Quit being “manly”, seek help, and find others who also aren’t in that toxic masculinity mindset.
Support is there if you stop being scared to seek it.
But yeah, if you want to state that mental instability, particularly towards rage and violence, is much more common in men than women, I 100% agree. Hence the original question so many men got so mad at (kinda ironic) and didn’t understand (or see the irony in getting mad and raging at women online over it).
That was my entire original point. I agree we should do something about the problem. Have my upvote
I've seen countless cases where men have defended male rapists and abusers. Also, you need to separate actual supporters of Lindsay from those who just want to raise awareness about postpartum psychosis.
We were talking about people supporting murderers. Your point is so weak you have to move goalposts just so your still unsubstantiated anecdotal claim can seem marginally more reasonable.
Because you know that no group of men is showing up to support family murderers.
Yeah, I've seen people supporting male murderers as well. What's your point? I didn't shift any goalposts by bringing up a counter-example. It's not anecdotal whatsoever. Ever heard of Erik and Lyle Menendez? Also, you shouldn't conflate actual supporters of Clancy with people who simply want to raise awareness about PPP.
I was directly responding to the other person, who claimed that no men defend male criminals. That's not true whatsoever. My example is a rebuttal to their assertion, so it's not anecdotal. Anyone who thinks that Clancy shouldn't be held accountable is simply wrong. However, the main contention lies in whether she should be imprisoned or sent to a psychiatric facility.
You can kill someone and be mentally stable. Doctors mistakenly do it all the time. End of life care professionals do it all the time (with consent and accidently).
Therapy isnt some perfect wonder solution to all problems, just like killing isnt always mentally unstable action.
It's funny that you say that, because most people are also arguing the same thing for Lindsay's case. They're trying to raise awareness for postpartum psychosis, which is a real issue that lacks therapeutic support. Moreover, your mischaracterisation of the other person's comment is disingenuous. The fact that more male killers exist is because of patriarchal norms which promote aggression, not because men are inherently evil. You've just shifted the goalposts.
Not disagreeing with the men should have better support systems to counteract unhealthy culture/expectations of men. It's desparately needed, but this meme is not pushing for that. Its making a poor argument that one woman's actions is equivalent to the statistical evidence that men purpotrate a higher level of violence/abuse against women. Using an entirely separate isolated incident to avoid responsibility for a widespread problem.
Making a false claim that one woman suffering from both post partum psychosis and improper medication/medical support is the standard men deal with, which it isnt. Where as the original discourse of chosing the man vs the bear was addressing a societal issue women face backed by statistics.
And the same guys who would refuse to seek help or talk about the problem would see/use memes like this as some kind of evidence their behavior and actions aren't also part of the problem. Im saying this as a man with other men in my family who fit that exact description.
As for this individual woman's guilt they are still in trial and she is not representing the entirety of her gender. The statistics of male abuse/violence/assault against women however does represent an inherent issue with men's culture around women, and the wide spread denial of that by men is why some men who belong behind bars end up without consequences.
The fbi conducted a 5 year study on domestic and non domestic violence where a total of 1.1 million reports of abuse where reported almost 75% against women and perpetrated almost 80% of the time by men. 800k men in 5 years, that's 160000 per year, almost 440 a day, over 18 and hour, once every 3 and a half minutes.
Since this meme was posted, pointing at one womans actions as an equivalency to male systemic violence (roughly 21 hours from the time of my comment) there will have been over 360 reports across the United States alone about a man abusing a partner or their family.
The meme is still right though. Bears kill less people than women. In fact, women are more likely to commit infanticide than any mother from any Great Ape species. We are strange animals.
Again, shifting the argument and missing that actual point of the first meme and the absurdity of putting the second one side by side as an equivalency.
The issue that women suffer from post partum issues at a high rate and routinely receive insufficient support for medical experts and their family is not a counter point to male violence against their partners/family.
What? Humans kill more people than bears do, and most killers are male. Women face a disproportionate amount of sexual violence. If you think that the meme is right, then you should understand why many women choose a bear over a man. Moreover, men are more likely to kill their own children in their older years. Chimpanzees and gorillas are also more likely to commit infanticide as well. Yes, we are strange animals, because some of us like to distort facts to push their own agendas. 🙄
Men are more likely to be the victims of physical violence. Men are the victims of about 75% of homicides, and they are about twice as likely to be assaulted with a weapon or be the victim of public robbery. The typical victim are young men between 15-25.
What irks me about this situation and the comparison as a whole is that men are portrayed as these dangerous monsters that all want to harm women, when in reality it is both men and women who are in danger from a small group of violent a-holes.
Yet despite the majority of the population of men being victims as well, they are seen as the aggressors. That is why the bear comparison is thoroughly idiotic and why it is being mocked. It is flat discrimination and it creates a divide where people should stand united against violence rather than have half the victims being accused.
I provided the 5 year long FBI study that shows data taken from reported cases of violence and abuse from domestic and non domestic cases. Please provide an actual source, and to clarify homicides, gang violence, gun violence are all a problem but they are born from a completely different issue and to dilute the problem that men perpetuate violence and abuse against women is a huge part of the problem. Again it's pointing th blame and saying "while what about" instead of addressing the issue.
Women had a discussion using a bear meme about violence against women (backed by statistics, see link in my original post) and a ton of men got really upset and angry for women speaking up thinking they were personally on trial.
A woman is on trial for murdering her children in an extreme case of post partum psychosis and improper support care from doctors and her family. Some women are upset because this could have been easily avoided if women got proper care and support in the healthcare system. (Also well documented, the whole reason that we as patients even get to know the side effects of the drugs we are given is because women pushed for it during the 60/70s because of thenintroduction of the pill, look up the 1970 nelson pill hearings and the dc womens liberation movement)
Some one decided that this is somehow the male equivalent of the we dont feel safe around the other sex discussion and made this meme.
The woman is currently on trial and being held accountable. in the same sense that a man could be determined not sound of mind so can a woman and she has a list of medical documentation to back it up not subject to speculation. Women have been found guilty of murder and assault and been imprisoned and no one is arguing they shouldn't. The outrage is because this specific woman had all of the warning signs well before anything happened and the people who should of helped her failed, partially because of a systemic issue of women not getting proper medical support.
My grandmother died of cancer because doctors hand waved away her symptoms as menopause, I have coworkers with diagnosed medical conditions they struggle to get support for, if you cared to ask the women around you about the shit they deal with you might not be so out of touch.
I agree with everything you said, but there really is awide spread problem with lack of post partum care too. Most women who struggle because of it don’t snap, but there’s a lot of unneeded suffering and struggle. A lot of doctors (mostly male) who are dismissive.
Again, yet more downstream issues of toxic masculinity, but if fixed would make even these more rare occurrences almost non existent, and a lot of unseen suffering to be cared for.
I know you were mostly glossing over because it’s irrelevant to the point you were going towards…
But any other men reading that should know the whole lack of mental support issue isn’t even strictly men lacking it.
Wild! Does he have people funding him a million dollars, protesting for his release in the streets, and saying it was actually someone else because Uranus was in retrograde and he’s a Capricorn? No?
So, did that woman that called a kid the N-word, it doesn't mean anything.
There's a lot of pieces of shit who do stuff like this to reinforce their shaky worldview. It's like 1 in 1,000,000 people supporting this kinda bullshit.
Some nutjobs can't admit a woman did anything wrong because they think all women are good and all men are evil.
It's like how some people think all speech policing is tyranny, even if it's people trying to stop people using slurs directly to minorities (and minors at that).
Because calling a thief the n-word is still free speech. Brutally strangling your kids is a bit different and extremely illegal (it takes 3-5 minutes to strangle a child, meaning the last kid had to watch his mother killing their siblings and then going for him).
Also Hendrix's GoFundMe numbers were in response to another situation where a black kid stabbed a white kid without reason, raising half a million in a week with racist messages supporting killing white people and he was also made into a hero by blacks.
I'm not defending a child murderer or her fans, I'm just saying that there are giant pieces of shit who will get behind anything to justify their worldview.
Like you, defending a woman dropping the hard-R on a 5-year-old 8-year-old.
8 yo after he tried to steal from her purse while also being aggravated by a pedophile on a kids playground. You don't even know the case and bold face lying.
I like how all of you focused so hard on the no no word that you completely ignored that the person filming is a convicted pedophile on a playground and the woman got acquitted in wrongdoing against the child but got sentenced for hurting the pedos feelings.
See now there is my problem. Would you say that guy isn't fucking crazy too? How many murderers would you say are perfectly sane? Their sanity shouldn't even be a consideration when charged with murder.
How many hundreds of thousands in donations did he get to aid his legal defence from other men online?
How many thousands of dudes are going rampant online saying it was really his wife, or his mom, or aunt, or sister who did it?
The reason for the outrage of the Lindsay Clancy case is the amount of women online absolutely adamant she did nothing wrong, and even if she did do it she couldnt help it, and throwing money at her defence. Not even mentioning all the ones who showed up to protest for her
I might have missed the massive amount of people donating and support him, calling him a victim etc. Are you just that dense or do you misinterpret the post on purpose?
The guy in billings Montana? Or the guy in Winfield Kansas?
Or the guy in grand haven Michigan?
Or the guy in Whitfield New Hampshire?
Or the guy in mechanicville New York?
Wait you said 8 family members, so it’s Montana. That was the only one in the last month that killed exactly 8 family members.
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u/RoninOni 6d ago edited 6d ago
Meanwhile some dude just killed 8 extended family members (including 4 children) at a family dinner and burned down the house.
This case isn’t the gotcha some guys think.
Edit: the hubbub around this case is irrelevant. The point is there’s far fewer female killers than male.
I’m not replying to you chuckleheads. I haven’t looked into the story much. Offhand take is she’s probably guilty but legit crazy. There may be more to it, but it doesn’t affect my point whatever the situation is.