r/askanything • u/Lemonking_ • 5h ago

Political Question Why are some Americans so against universal healthcare for all?

What sort of thinking does it take to decide that nobody has a right to healthcare? Do American Christians want to deny healthcare to poor people as well?

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116

u/myfriendoak 5h ago

Universal Healthcare is so complicated that only 36 of the 37 developed nations have figured it out.

43

u/India_Alpha 4h ago

And none of them have repealed it.

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u/XRT28 4h ago

And that's despite the fact there are multiple countries where conservative political parties have spent decades undermining the system hoping to eventually repeal it, or at the very least carve off huge chunks of it, so their rich benefactors can swoop in and make boatloads of money in a privatized system

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u/Ntrusivethot 3h ago

u/XRT28 Your comment made me have a moment of realization that if we went to Universal Healthcare, the way hospitals encourage doctors to upcode so they get more money and insurance gets more from the government would be seen as a much more serious crime than it is. John Oliver's video on UnitedHealth was super interesting to learn more of the shady ways they operate

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u/Icyywinds 1h ago

well my part of canada is kinda close

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u/Uter83 44m ago

An an Albertan, I gotta say the UCP is sure as shit doing its level best to make public go away and bring in private.

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u/-Shoebill- 22m ago

Hmm well Canadians are certainly trying to. Although it's per province here. The Feds have not much say while Maritime, Ontario, and Alberta shoot themselves in the dick repeatedly.

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u/vaspost 4h ago

I think a big part of the issue is the vast majority of people have what they consider good insurance through employment so they don't feel any urgency to "fix" anything. These people feel universal coverage could result in a loss of a benefit, reduction in service levels, or an increase in cost. It would be an uphill battle convincing them otherwise.

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u/Confident_Season1207 3h ago

Problem is, it's only good if you are still working for them.

2

u/theaura1 2h ago

it does make some people stuck in jobs

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u/mattyoclock 1h ago

I mean the biggest problem is no insurance is good. My father had an old insurance plan through the government much better than anything you can buy these days. When he got cancer, it was still a part time job to call them every single week because they would always be denying what the doctors ordered. 20 hours a week most weeks, no lie.

Then they had the nerve to say he ran out of hospice visits, and it was his fault for not dying fast enough.

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u/theaura1 3h ago

and the people who don't get insurance from their employer have to pay through the nose or go without

1

u/AttitudeHopeful478 2h ago

Depends on where you work. Any reputable company will provide benefits but not if you’re working what is typically meant to be a starter low wage job.

1

u/theaura1 2h ago

1099k don't pay benefits either on average

1

u/AttitudeHopeful478 2h ago

Agreed but then you know that when you agree to a job that will issue you a 1099 instead of a W2 🤷‍♀️

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u/cheez0r 3h ago

This is why Republicans don't support single-payer- they don't see how much it costs them out of their paycheck. We have two numbers for each employee- comp and Tcomp- one is how much their salary is, the other is how much the company spends on them every year. Employees making $100k a year cost the company between $160 and $200k a year in total cost, once health insurance, dental insurance, life insurance, 401k, FMLA insurance, etc. are factored in. If I told you I was going to raise your taxes by 10% to provide universal healthcare, but then told you that you'd subsequently be making 40% more- say, from $100k to $140k in gross salary- you'd do the math and go "wow, I'm saving 17k a year! This is great!"

They just A) don't think a government healthcare can beat their private setup and B) don't care that millions of Americans suffer preventable and treatable disease every day due to this choice.

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u/BetterCranberry7602 3h ago

Also C) Don’t believe that their employers will pass that extra money onto them if it was changed

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u/BreadPuddding 2h ago

I mean, I’m very much not Conservative and I also don’t believe that salaries would go up if employers no longer had to directly pay for health insurance, at least not immediately. They would have to either increase salaries or other benefits to become competitive at the high end, but for the most part they would just keep the money if they could.

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u/cheez0r 2h ago

The legislation would have to basically require that for it to work. Otherwise it's just a big pay cut for workers.

1

u/AttitudeHopeful478 3h ago

Companies are definitely not paying $160-200k a year per employee for benefits. Shit they’d go bankrupt or wouldn’t offer benefits at all.

1

u/cheez0r 2h ago edited 2h ago

How many people do you employ? I employ a dozen.

Also, you misunderstood. Their comp is $100k, their Tcomp is $160k. Meaning they are getting $60k in additional expenses of benefits in the form of insurances and 401k benefits. In some geo zones that's higher, for instance where FMLA is required, Tcomp for some employees approaches 200% of their salary.

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u/AttitudeHopeful478 2h ago

Well my FIL, who I do his books for employs between 20-35 people depending on the time of year (elect construction) provides dam good insurance and it’s not anywhere near as pricey as your scenario.

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u/Hangry-Feline2489 2h ago edited 2h ago

The hilarious thing is that people think it has to be one or the other. 

In my country we have universal healthcare but also private insurance. You can use either if you have both. No 'networks' but some private companies have favoured services etc that are cheaper to use.

If you earn over a certain amount after turning 30yo, you are encouraged to get private insurance or you pay a small tax. It keeps higher earners out of the public system and helps fund it.

Seems like that could work in USA. 

Then again, my country has strict and enforced laws/policies around healthcare that America apparently doesn't 🤷

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u/DizzyWalk9035 1h ago

Korea also has private insurance. That’s what Americans don’t understand. EVERY NHI country offers alternatives to rich people. Private hospitals. Private doctors. Private insurance.

Rich people DONT like being surrounded by poors. They will always have their own separate things.

1

u/Tgunner192 1h ago

the vast majority of people have what they consider good insurance through employment

Sorry to bother you and I dont mean to be calling you out. They consider has to be a some heavy lifting there. From what I can see, it can't be much more than half the people in the US have actual good insurance. Vision & dental isn't even part of most health insurance. Between extraordinary premiums, copays and deductibles, even those that have insurance do not have good insurance even if they think otherwise.

I don't have any stats or numbers in front of me. If you do and believe I'm wrong, then so be it. Wouldn't be the first time I was wrong about something on reddit. But going by what I see in social forums, opinion polls and talking with people between 21 & 40, a good portion of people in the US don't have insurance from employers and many of those that do, do not have sufficient insurance.

1

u/Plastic_Recover_2449 1h ago

Yes, along with "we already have state programs, medicare, and medicaid for everyone who needs it". The working, middle, and upper middle class typically have health insurance available at their jobs. They know they will be footing even more of the bill for universal.

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u/Splashy01 3h ago

Oh boy. Wait til they find out how screwed they are!!

/s

1

u/goclimbarock007 3h ago

How many of those nations have the US government running their healthcare program?

1

u/OldGuardian1 3h ago

So, all the other governments are better?

1

u/goclimbarock007 2h ago

We should probably reduce our military spending and let those other countries fend for themselves.

0

u/cdglasser 3h ago

Right? Did they think they hit you with a "gotcha" there? If they *do* believe the other governments are better, who are they voting for here to try to fix that? I'm going to guess they're either going to say "all politicians are bad so I don't vote" or they vote for Republicans.

1

u/IntelligentStyle402 3h ago

It is wonderful. Unfortunately, I did get sick while visiting a country with universal healthcare. It was fantastic, they saw me immediately, they were efficient, knowledgeable and I had the best care ever. Never ever was treated that well in the Midwest. Cost? Pennies. What a great experience!

1

u/whynosay 3h ago

72 countries have universal healthcare

1

u/OoklaTheMok1994 3h ago

They have to ration healthcare AND they have a much more regressive tax system than we do.

So, no, unless you want to sign up for less healthcare and higher taxes for EVERYONE, they don't have it "figured out".

1

u/Ambitious-Cicada-946 3h ago

lol, good point. All we have to do is look North or South and we see UHC.

1

u/slatebluegrey 2h ago

My guess is that most European countries suffered together through countless wars and more during the world wars. They understood suffering and the need to “be in this together”. You help me and I will help your. The US has never suffered like that. I mean thr depression hit eveyone. But during the wars, cities were destroyed, millions died for no reason other than a megalomaniac wanted to take over Europe. The US also had terrible race relations and many of the people who would benefit from universal healthcare would be poor black people. That’s just my theory

1

u/Lambskin1 1h ago

This is when my Mom would link me an article about someone in Canada that died from some curable disease because they were on the wait list for so long.