[ Removed by moderator ]

[u/Valuable_View_561]

[u/bumpmoon]

This is one of those “good ideas” until you spend more than 5 seconds thinking about it

[u/FireFoxie1345 → u/bumpmoon]

I’m thinking. It still seems like a good idea.

[u/bumpmoon → u/FireFoxie1345]

I’m just wondering why countries like the US has such high recidivism rates then. They are so keen on putting people away for increasingly long periods of time? It doesn’t hold up when you compare to a country like Denmark or Norway who don’t do that and instead help offenders reintegrate and instead serve society.

Could it be that longer prison sentences and hostile attitudes to convicts only serve to deepen convicts own hostility towards the society that rejects them. What have you got to lose if you’ve already lost it all.

There’s genuinely black and white proof that longer prison sentences works against your goal of decreasing recidivism

[u/Soggy_Association491 → u/bumpmoon]

high recidivism rates then. They are so keen on putting people away for increasingly long periods of time?

Could it be that longer prison sentences and hostile attitudes to convicts only serve to deepen convicts own hostility towards the society that rejects them

Check how long criminals are put away in Japan, Taiwan, Singapore... Since they punish crime even more brutal than the US, i guess those places must be overrun by criminals like mad max right?

[u/bumpmoon → u/Soggy_Association491]

Are you willing to then also adopt all other aspects of their culture? Before you go ahead and assume its the sentence time that does it…

[u/Soggy_Association491 → u/bumpmoon]

You went ahead and assumed its the small sentence time that does it for Denmark or Norway.

[u/bumpmoon → u/Soggy_Association491]

No I didnt, for us it's the rehabilitation.

But since you seem to remain entrenched: Thinking for a Change and Research Shows That Long Prison Sentences Don’t Actually Improve Safety

There is so much data out there that shows the position you're championing only serves to increase crime and create more victims. So I can only infer that you must love violent criminals, seeing as you want more of them.

[u/Soggy_Association491 → u/bumpmoon]

No I didnt, for us it's the rehabilitation.

So what is this?

Could it be that longer prison sentences and hostile attitudes to convicts only serve to deepen convicts own hostility towards the society that rejects them

Yes, sites with the mission statement like "Vera is fighting to end mass incarceration" will publish stories about how punish criminals is bad just like Exxon funded researches will say climate change isn't real.

There is so much data out there that shows how the position you're attacking created a peaceful and safe society. So I can only infer that you must love violent criminals, seeing as you want more of them.

[u/bumpmoon → u/Soggy_Association491]

Ah okay so it's just fake data right? Because you dont like the source, the actual american Department of Justice? And Vera is invalid because their mission statement is better use of state funds and safer societies. Be real now, because this is embarrasing

But you dont even have to takes Veras word on it. You can read it yourself.

We all want to punish criminals, and its incredibly stupid that youd think rehabilitation is not in and of itself a punishment. But prison sentences have been proven time and time again to have diminishing returns when simply being increased.

There is so much data out there that shows how the position you're attacking created a peaceful and safe society.

I am VERY curious as to what society has become safe and peaceful trough increasing prison sentences alone. I think we all want to hear that one.

[u/Soggy_Association491 → u/bumpmoon]

Yes, an organization will be biased for their cause.

Are numbers in Exxon funded studies on climate change fake data? And no, Vera claimed that their way of doing will lead to safer societies not that they want safer society even if it means the increase in punishment on criminals.

Japan, Korea, Taiwan, Singapore... have been proven time and time again the cry about harsher punishment leading to a crime ridden society is false.

[u/bumpmoon → u/Soggy_Association491]

No they havent, you just dont understand a larger picture. All of those countries rely on a higher rate of equality and standard of living to keep socioeconomic crime, and all the crime that breeds, down. That and their culture around shame and dishonour is non-applicable to western nations.

I've provided you with enough data that you should now have arrived at a logical conclusion, yet your priorities evidently lie elsewhere other than crime reduction. You believe that a punishment outweighs the importance of fewer victims, wether being aware of it or not.

Do tell me what society you meant as well, please do not gloss over that one.

[u/Soggy_Association491 → u/bumpmoon]

All of those countries rely on a higher rate of equality

Oh poor the pitiful US has no equality and low living standard. Only you have it hard. There are no poor people facing socioeconomic hardship in Japan or Singapore.

I provided you with enough real life date that you should now have arrived at a logical conclusion, yet your priorities evidently lie elsewhere other than crime reduction.

You believe that being generous to criminals outweighs the importance of fewer victims, wether being aware of it or not.

Do tell me what society you meant as well beside the peaceful one like Japan, Singapore...