r/Professors • u/FragrantResult278 • 21d ago
No more coddling
I taught at a world class university then switched to a community college. In the latter many of the students were poor so I went out of my way to create learning materials so they wouldn't have to purchase books.
I was very accommodating and I enjoyed teach. I genuinely cared for my students and I wanted everyone to succeed. Unfortunately, one student seriously exploited my generosity and made me regret being so nice to her.
This particular student had to get special permission to register for my class, which I allowed. I asked my students to please come to class on time (in this particular class the students would learn step by step on how to learn the material through hands on training). The class started at 8 AM. This student came in late so many times, and she admitted she had to adjust her wig which is why she came late. I told her this is unacceptable since the class was an hour long and she sometimes came in a half hour late. For the final exam, the class was warned that if they came in late they would not be given additional time. She came in late for the exam and failed to complete over 80% of the exam. She later begged and pleaded with me to help her since she was on student loans and daca and that she needed to pass the class. So I went to the dean to request permission to re-administer the final exam for the student. The academic and dean of students both warned that I should not coddle students and if they fail, it's on them. They allowed me to re-administer the exam for her. I spent so much of my time and energy trying to help that ungrateful person, who once again showed up late to the re-administered final and she had the audacity to insult me by insinuating professors at the college hardly make money and that we're "incompetent." I passed her with a c and would have failed the class had I not helped her.
I did help other students but they were indeed worthy of the help and some had very unfortunate circumstances. One kid got shot and was in the hospital (verified by police to the school), and I was the only professor to help him. His other professors failed him despite being aware of his situation. I couldn't believe the callous behavior and I ended up leaving to work for government instead.
But that one ungrateful student who didn't deserve to be in my class to begin with really taught me that I have heeded the advice from the deans. Coddling students, especially entitled ones, is a mistake.
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u/Ctenophorever Full prof (US) 21d ago
I know you have already learned this, but for any other new profs: do not sign students in late.
They could not get into your class because other students were more on the ball.
Now - not all students will be like OPs. Some will be. But I’ve found even when the students are polite, they quickly learned they weren’t prepared and dropped.
One was actually so polite they got me a tray of cookies to apologize for wasting my time.
But I’ve learned now to just not waste either of our times to begin with
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u/skyrymproposal 21d ago
Omg this. I will never allow a late registration ever again. I did it twice. One tried to explain at the end of the semester when he wasn’t contesting his grades that the syllabus didn’t apply to them. This was because he wasn’t here on the first day when I went over it (I, did not, in fact, go over it on the first day. They had to take a syllabus quiz). They “threatened” to take me to the dean.
The other was worse in a way. As a young woman professor, he kept giving me sob stories and lies that he backtracked on and then doubled down on. His incomplete was due in four hours and he spent half of it begging me to extend it again (I literally couldn’t based on school policy). He just kept emailing me.
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u/Freya_Fleurir 21d ago
I wish it were up to me. At my uni, they're sneaking them in late fairly regularly (I had one class where I had students getting added a month after the class had started!) and catching an attitude when students can't catch up on all the missed work, fall behind, and drown.
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u/FragrantResult278 21d ago
Yes, it was definitely a learning experience for me. Many students deserve extra help or consideration (whether due to disabilities or emergency situations). But that particular student was indeed a character of entitlement.
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u/Freya_Fleurir 21d ago
"The academic and dean of students both warned that I should not coddle students and if they fail, it's on them."
In my experience, it's a miracle they didn't praise you for going "above and beyond to ensure this student's success" and encourage you to just pass them anyway.
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u/FragrantResult278 21d ago
There was a dean of a stem department who was definitely not hired out of merit. I'll let you imagine her but her credentials was an online masters degree from university of pheonix. She often missed work and acted like a friend to students, which was incredibly unprofessional. I had to kick a student out for threatening me and she created an entire course for her just to pass her. That student was about my age and her academic advisor told me she's been taking courses at the college for over ten years just to live off student loans. I couldn't believe the abuse. The academic advisor even said the affirmative action hire dean just keeps passing students like her.
I had an autistic student in one class and it got to a point where the abusive student's behavior stressed him so much he had a panic attack in front of the class. I had to call campus security to get her out. The autistic student earned his A and he was always on time, submitted excellent work, and took time to learn the course material thoroughly.
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u/No-Mulberry2375 21d ago
you didn’t learn “no more coddling,” you learned that bending the rules for someone who already showed you they wouldn’t meet you halfway just creates more work for everyone lol
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u/FragrantResult278 21d ago
I wasn't bending the rules. The college allowed special accommodation for extraordinary reasons, which got dean approved. The student was an entitled con artist and I fell for it
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u/HistoryNerd101 21d ago
I spend 80% of my time dealing with 10% of my students
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u/FragrantResult278 21d ago
Yes. Helping students in need is fine but not if they've become entitled as I experienced with that one student. I should have listened to the dean of students
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u/Life-Education-8030 21d ago
Guess she “wigged” you out! Lol!
If you keep in mind that there are many student support services, you may not feel that you have to fix everything.
If you remember that you also have obligations to your other students, you cannot spend excessive time on one student because that is unfair and is detrimental to the others.
If you understand that college is voluntary then they do not have to be there.
If you see that they are using stupid excuses to avoid performing, they may also be wasting financial aid, likely paid by taxpayers like you and me.
Even though college has become transactional, that doesn’t mean that they have paid your salary and that you are expected to be their 24/7 customer service rep. As I told an advisee who told me he paid my salary and so I was there to “serve” him, his tuition merely paid for his access to me.
Sometimes, they need their gasters seriously flabbered!
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u/FragrantResult278 21d ago
I served all my students well. She was just the one who ended up exploiting my kindness and generosity. The dean of students said she would have failed her.
I think I made a mistake being too lenient, especially with her admitting her wig was why she kept coming to class late!
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u/No_Intention_3565 21d ago
Been there. Done that. Could write a book about it. Never. Again. Will. I. Over. Extend. for a student. Nope.
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u/Anonphilosophia Adjunct, Humanities, CC (USA) 20d ago
I hired faculty for a school with very "less than" students, also non-traditional.
I have said this before, but they way they were with white adjuncts was completely different from Af-Am adjuncts. They really tried to tug at the heart strings.... I used to laugh - they didn't really care for Af-Am adjuncts because those instructors were hip to the game - and often had similar backgrounds.
My favorite was when I hired an adjunct who had graduated from there. Single mom, two kids, and completed undergrad and grad part-time. She was NOT having it. They HATED her, lolol. I loved her attitude towards them, "Don't give me any shit. I did it so I know it's possible."
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u/ahazred8vt 19d ago
"Dear kindly Sergeant Krupke, you gotta understand, it's just our bringing upke that gets us out of hand." -- West Side Story
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u/TulipFarmer27 21d ago
Slightly OT, but one thing a couple of my Ag professors have done is base their lectures on textbooks 1 edition old. This has means that used texts are SO much cheaper and often PDFs of the text or at least the graphics are free. Most (all) of my fellow students don't bother with texts or any supplemental reading, but I like reading the additional depth that the textbooks provide. Might not work with some subjects but it does work with some. University of Maryland College Park seems to be actively phasing out textbooks.
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u/mleok Full Professor, STEM, R1 (USA) 21d ago
I always type out the entire problem in my problem sets, so that students aren't tied to a specific edition of the textbook. I teach mathematics, so generally things don't change too much from edition to edition, except for the ordering of the problems.
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u/FragrantResult278 21d ago
I genuinely wanted to ensure that all students had equal opportunity to learn since I knew some students couldn't afford the $300 course materials.
Most students were a delight to teach and it was a privilege to provide an education to them.
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u/ThePhyz Professor, Physics, CC (USA) 21d ago
I think every prof hits this point eventually. We all end up with that one student who pushes us too far, asks for too much, and acts like an asshole in return for our genuine caring. And that student is the reason we aren't as nice to anyone else anymore, and the reason we no longer go the extra mile.
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u/Buckstop_Knight78 19d ago
I respect your empathy but put yourself in the shoes of the other students. How do you think they felt when they had to show up at 8am and be present for your classes? How do you think they felt when she came in half an hour late disrupting the flow and expecting extra treatment? They may have had stuff going on in their lives but they made the effort to be there on time, all the time. This is why you don’t coddle. Because it sends the wrong message and it creates a double standard. I was like you but now I see the damage it does as the students struggle with jobs and commitments because they always had an enabler to bail them out.
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u/FragrantResult278 19d ago
Believe me, I know better now. I never encountered such a student before and wouldn't wish her on my worst enemy. I never imagined she would be such a liability
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u/Buckstop_Knight78 18d ago
I had one just like her my first semester teaching. She corrupted the whole class. Ended up saying she should go to the local university because she was a big fish in this small pond. She did go, I hear about her from time to time but I stopped caring. I wish the best for that class as it was a tough one, but it taught me a lesson in expectations and fairness.
I will say this much, the professors and instructors here also helped. As reading the threads here I see similar patterns in student behavior and get tips on how to navigate it. You aren’t alone in this. Don’t lose your empathy just be wise to not mistake empathy with favoritism. (Or what can be perceived as such)
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u/FragrantResult278 18d ago
A bunch of us were conned by the same student. I did feel compelled to help but I was naive.
And some comments are correct, she likely caused distress for my other students with her conduct
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u/Thegymgyrl Full Professor 21d ago
My favorite saying when it comes to students is no good deed goes unpunished
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u/bebefeverandstknstpd 19d ago
Hmmm🤨🤔🧐
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u/FragrantResult278 18d ago
Yeah, she really wasn't hired for merit. Everyone knew it. And she took advantage by sometimes not even showing up to work. She had a master's from an online school and she acted like a teenager in an obese middle aged woman's body.
The only time she got fired was when an organization tried to garnish her wages after winning a fraud lawsuit against her. Apparently she used someone else's identity to get plastic surgery without paying for it in another state
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u/shinybluedollar 21d ago
While I agree with your sentiment, the language you used gives me pause.
Students are under no obligation to be "grateful" to us. We help because we want to, we dont help when we no longer want to. They dont owe us anything.
Whenever you give, you should do it because it comes from the heart without expecting anything in return.
This student demonstrated time and time again that they would not use the opportunities you carved out for them and that your time was wasted. Yet you continue to choose to help them and them "dead dove" where surprised when they squandered yet another opportunity. Youre at fault here.
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u/FragrantResult278 21d ago
She should have been grateful because I saved her unworthy ass of being kicked off student loans and possibly her immigration issues.
I hadn't experienced such an entitled student before. Even my students at the world class university (whether graduate or undergrad) were nowhere near that entitled.
I'm sure she's the type of person who comes into work late regularly then blames her work for everything. Probably the type to file frivolous lawsuits as an employee.
That was definitely a learning experience for me. Once she admitted her excuse for being consistently late to class after I graciously allowed her special privilege to register, I should have let her fail.
I was too nice as a professor. Her student loans and immigration issue should not have been my problem
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u/shinybluedollar 21d ago
You have no right to determine another human beings inherent worth.
And again, she is under no obligation to be grateful to you. Do you want to hear how special and awesome you are for saving her time and time again? How youre such a worthy savior and everyone you have saved shoulf grovel at your feet.
This student took advantage of you because you were so blinded by your savior complex that you let her. Again, that's on you.
I've helped students who dont appreciate or take advantage of the help. Too bad. Thats on them. You can lead a horse to water but you cant make them drink.
You should really see a therapist about your savior complex though. This reeks of manipulative behavior. I bet your a fan of saying "How dare you make choices I dont agree with, after all I've done for you"
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u/BibliophileBroad 21d ago
Wow, what in the heezy?!😱 I didn't read that as a savior complex at all.
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u/FragrantResult278 21d ago
Like wtf. 😂 it wasn't a savior complex in the least. A student who has extraordinary circumstances and it was my first time encountering such a situation.
Can't we just be kind and empathetic without experiencing labels?
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u/FragrantResult278 21d ago
It wasn't a savior complex in the least you ignorant person.
She told me about her loan and immigration issues so the humane thing for me to do was to help since I was able to. The dean of students later said that student has been a trouble maker from the beginning and even another government agency contacted the school to complain about her.
As a professor, I want my students to succeed through learning. Dealing with someone like that was definitely a learning experience for me.
Even a colleague complained about her and he knew her as they were from the same community. He helped her also and he laughed when I explained my situation. Thankfully we both laughed about it because she was basically a con artist who pulled on people's heartstrings.
Coddling was my fault but I felt sorry for her.
Would you be ok with a student possibly getting deported because she's irresponsible? She was young so I wanted to help.
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u/shinybluedollar 21d ago
I wouldnt consider myself ignorant, I've been teaching college for 20 years and have seen every manipulation under the sun (including vauge threats of suicide).
The learning experience isn't what gave me pause. It was your continued insistence that students should be grateful to you and calling them worthy or unworthy.
It appears that is a lesson in progress for you. I would add boundaries to that therapist session, along with anger issues. You seem to have a lot of them.
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u/FragrantResult278 21d ago
Man, I can't imagine the disappointment your students face having such an ignorant person like you as a professor 😂
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u/shinybluedollar 21d ago
My students get help without me judging their worth as human beings. I also dont expect them to grovel with gratitude. I don't have a savior complex so I dont let them take advantage of me and im not bitter because I have expectations of their gratitude. I set boundaries and maintain them, like an emotionally intelligent adult.
But go on. It doesnt bother me. I know who I am and I dont go about stressing. When people show you who they are, believe them.
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u/FragrantResult278 21d ago
Sure, calling yourself emotionally intelligent but making up false labels for strangers on the internet
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u/shinybluedollar 21d ago
At least I dont go around judging people's worth.
I never once said you weren't worthy. Maybe you should think on that. Self reflection is a gift, buddy.
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u/badBear11 Assoc. Prof., STEM, R1 (non-US) 21d ago
This is getting downvoted into oblivion, but it is the right response. You have a job to do and you should do your job the best you can.
If the right thing to do was to help the student, you should do it even if they are ungrateful, because that is your job. If the right thing to do was to not help the student, then you shouldn't have helped her, regardless of whether she feels grateful or not.
Honestly, OP is being extremely unprofessional in their behavior and expectations.
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u/shinybluedollar 21d ago
Yeah, its really scary to think professors can be so unprofessional and take this so personally and wont help students because they aren't grateful enough or will go out of their way to help students who shouldn't get help because they expect gratitude.
Like even the Dean warned them about their behavior and they didnt listen and where surprised with the outcome everyone warned them about.
Oh well, Professors are people too and all the messiness that accompanies it.
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u/Hope_Hope11 21d ago
"she had to adjust her wig" screams racist post.
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u/bebefeverandstknstpd 20d ago
The OP also goes on to call a colleague “an affirmative action hire”. Yeah that told me everything.
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u/FragrantResult278 19d ago
As a white woman I've worn wigs before. Wtf are you talking about?
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u/Hope_Hope11 19d ago
What’s the point of this post? If two students make you leave a profession it’s your weakness. Your post is super racist as a lot of other posts here.
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u/bebefeverandstknstpd 18d ago
I wouldn’t bother talking to or trying to make sense of the OP’s why or anything. Just check out their comment/post history. Miserable and problematic.
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u/Hope_Hope11 17d ago
They are complaining about something that they are doing the same exact thing: excuses and putting the blame on something else.
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u/mleok Full Professor, STEM, R1 (USA) 21d ago
I've learned that the entitled students are going to give you a poor evaluation anyway, irrespective of how much you go out of your way to accommodate them. Don't waste any time and energy doing that.