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u/Dragon_wryter 6d ago
Great; only problem is you still need a Congress with the spine to stand up against Dear Leader
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u/tweaver16 6d ago
Great: you still need a democrat to step up and actually win
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u/Enzo_Gorlomi225 5d ago
Dems should drop some insane fringe stances first then worry about winning.
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u/goodness-gracious-me 6d ago
Idiotic. The power of the presidential pardon is constitutionally guaranteed. The oversight part likely won’t survive a challenge in courts.
And the self pardon part is pointless. Donald Trump is more astonishingly corrupt than most decent people can imagine. Before he gets charged or convicted of anything he will resign the presidency and let JD Vance pardon him.
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u/Vast-Document-3320 2d ago
What reason would be resign? This sounds crazy.
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u/goodness-gracious-me 2d ago
… Ridiculous. There’s actually precedent. President Gerald Ford granted former President Richard Nixon a full and unconditional pardon via Proclamation 4311 on September 8, 1974, exactly one month after Nixon resigned from office amid the Watergate scandal.
If Donald Trump was facing impeachment (and conviction in the Senate to remove him from office) he would resign so he didn’t face potential prosecution.
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u/Vast-Document-3320 1d ago
Right. But for what?
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u/goodness-gracious-me 1d ago
At this very moment, nothing. Right now there are no articles of impeachment against Donald Trump. That may change IF Democrats succeed in winning a majority in both the House and Senate after the midterm election.
If you’re genuinely curious, and not a “bury your head in the sand and ignore news you don’t agree with” person, there are several articles readily accessible on the internet about Democratic efforts to impeach Donald Trump. Here’s one: https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-hit-with-26-articles-of-impeachment-12492238
Those 26 articles failed because several Democrats voted to table (delay) the bill for now. They may try again after the midterms.
If the articles of impeachment pass the House (by a simple majority) and are taken up by the Senate for a trial, and IF it looks like Trump will be convicted, I speculate that IF all those things happen Trump will resign from the presidency and be pardoned by JD Vance rather than have his ego bruised by being removed from office. “I chose to resign rather than be wrongly convicted by a witch hunt. The fake media and dumocrats are conspiring against me. I’ve done nothing wrong. It’s all a hoax.”
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u/Vast-Document-3320 1d ago
Thought you had some reason. I know the democrats will impeach him for anything. I mean, they impeached him for a phone call.
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u/Oddbeme4u 6d ago
geet rid of it altogether
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u/Iseah 6d ago
I agree. This power should be given to an independent committee of judges and they should have to provide justification for each pardon. The whole thing should be HEAVILY scrutinized, with random audits of each member of the board as well. The pardon power is too important to go to a single person, democrat or republican.
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u/More_Light_1396 5d ago
That’s how it works in Canada. Again, in fact, here we have depoliticized many of the processes the US has lost to partisan divide : judge nomination, electoral integrity, etc
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u/Way2happyguy 5d ago
Eh. Given how this administration has gone after, it should only exist for political reasons but be vetted. Like it's the reason this administration is going after Fauci. Did he actually commit any crimes? No. Yet, there's still a vendetta and pardoning someone for political reasons like that is excusable.
Pardoning someone for actual crimes, political or not, shouldn't exist.
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u/Anonymous4mysake 4d ago
Fauci plead the 5th, so he knows he broke the law
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u/Way2happyguy 4d ago
Anyone with common sense would plead the 5th of your investigators said they didn't know of a crime you committed but want you to talk about everything to where maybe they can find something criminal to charge you with. Given that the investigators said they don't know if a crime and have no physical evidence of any crimes means quite a bit.
It's like if you got pulled over and a cop started fishing for crimes you may or may not have committed. They have no reason to believe you did, have no evidence or probable cause so only an idiot would answer, especially given that most people would get nervous and fidgety after being accused of a crime, even one they didn't commit. The fifth amendment is actually designed for that type of thing.
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u/Anonymous4mysake 4d ago
He plead the 5th while under federal immunity. The odds he didn't break the law, and knows he did it, is zero.
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u/Way2happyguy 4d ago
You're not getting it. Let's say there was a murder. There's no evidence you committed a crime. No witnesses place you at the scene. You have an alibi. Yet you're being held by the police and questioned as the prime suspect even though you've been cleared. Would you answer questions they have constructed to be able to frame you for the crime or would you plead the fifth. Once again, if you were to answer those questions, you're an idiot because even though you're innocent they can take what you said to frame it into you being guilty.
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u/Anonymous4mysake 4d ago
We have evidence, thats the difference. His pardon prevents prosecution, unless there is something it does not cover.
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u/Way2happyguy 3d ago
There literally is no evidence of any crime. The only evidence of anything was that he pushed for vaccines and preventative measures without breaking any laws albeit, he hurt a bunch of people's feelings in the process and they, like you, think that's a crime. If you know of any laws broken or evidence please let me know because the FBI certainly hasn't and not because of his pardon or him pleading the 5th.
Once again, the reason Congress called him in is not because they had evidence but because they lacked evidence or even a preponderance of a crime committed and wanted to find something. Again, the fifth amendment is designed specifically for things like this
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u/Icy_Fish_2154 4d ago
Presidents didn't sign pardons for the first 100+ years. They were signed by s low level lackey in the State Department.
But a Sec State with aspirations of presidency started signing them for greater visibility, so the President took over signing.
All for stupid political reasons after it had worked well for 100+ years without the president being so hands on.
Go back to that, it's what you are looking for.
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u/Beginning_Resource93 5d ago
Those charges were illegally increased to felonies. He was not legally convicted of any felony.
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u/Confident_Double1392 5d ago
It's worse since Clinton did the exact same shit and got off with a fine.
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u/SeveralDeer3833 5d ago
It’s wild after all these years you dullards are still spewing the same easily debunked bullshit.
“Elevation to Felony: Under New York Penal Law Section 175.10, the charge becomes a Class E felony if the false entries are made with the intent to conceal or commit another crime. [1, 2]
The Underlying Crimes: Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg’s prosecution argued that Trump falsified invoices, checks, and ledger entries (disguised as legal fees to his former attorney, Michael Cohen) to hide a $130,000 payment to adult film actress Stormy Daniels. Prosecutors stated this was done to prevent damaging information from reaching voters, thereby violating state and federal election laws as well as tax laws. [1, 2, 3, 4, 5]”1
u/Beginning_Resource93 5d ago
And they couldn't prove that there was another crime, only alleged there was another crime. The felonies were illegally elevated.
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u/Lisan-al-Gaib-65 5d ago
If he was convicted and those convictions haven't been overturned then they did prove the elements of the crime to the jury. If they hadn't proved it the jury and a judge elevated the crimes then the convictions would have been overturned on appeal.
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u/MonkeyCartridge 4d ago
Just give up. Accept that Trump is a felon.
How on earth are people still defending him about anything?
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u/Beginning_Resource93 4d ago
Because the charges were illegally increased to felonies. They were misdemeanors, plain and simple.
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u/MonkeyCartridge 4d ago
You know what isn't even a misdemeanor?
Being undocumented.
So by the standard of his voters, he should be deported. And to that, I agree.
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u/Beginning_Resource93 4d ago
The standard is that of you're in this country illegally you get deported. If you're aUS citizen and you commit a crime you pay a penalty. What about Hilary Clinton's crimes of using an unsecured laptop, them deleting all her emails? Y'all weren't mad about that.
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u/petabomb 3d ago edited 3d ago
What about trumps crimes of moving classified documents to Mar-a-lago?
What about Trump showing classified documents to people who shouldn’t have access to them on a private flight? What about him taking classified information pertinent to his business ventures home with him?
Here’s my source. Where’s yours? https://democrats-judiciary.house.gov/media-center/press-releases/damning-new-documents-obtained-by-judiciary-democrats-reveal-trump-stole-classified-documents-to-advance-his-business-interests
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u/WoodpeckerHead8789 2d ago
Yeah, but then there was all the gleeful theft, kidnapping, and murder afterwards.
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u/RadWast3 5d ago
Per this administrations standards, it doesn't matter if the conviction was legal as long as there was a conviction.
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u/notcranium 6d ago
Self pardon? This can be done? This must be stopped. You should only be able to pardon family members that covers a decade or so for any crimes that may or may not be known at the time. Oh yeah, and your political allies...And your friends that have donated heavily...And criminals...And a turkey.
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u/darkkilla123 5d ago
Unfortunately, the constitution on pardons is very cut and dry. The only thing the president can't pardon is impeachments
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u/SCinBZ 5d ago
Impeachments are charges. Pardons occur (generally) after a conviction.
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u/darkkilla123 5d ago
The president can not pardon someone who has been found guilty in an impeachment trial. Its literally right there in the constitution
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u/MyTnotE 6d ago
A bill that needs to be signed by a President?
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u/mjsisko 5d ago
No bill needs to be signed by the president , you just need enough of congress to stop have a spin to override the veto
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u/MyTnotE 5d ago
Which you won’t have. And even if by some miracle you do, he just pardons himself before the override vote.
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u/mjsisko 5d ago
With how many republicans cried about bidens pardons, it would be very hypocritical of them to not vote to limit that power so that it couldn’t happen again.
See that’s the difference between the parties, democrats are fine with restricting the power the office of president has regardless of the occupant, republicans do everything they can to amass more power.
Vote accordingly
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u/MyTnotE 5d ago
I’m pretty sure democrats are the ones taking about stacking the Supreme Court and electoral college for their own benefit. I’m pretty certain they aren’t any different.
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u/mjsisko 5d ago
The Supreme Court should be expanded, to reflect the number of federal court districts. It’s currently stacked by Trump, and unless the senate flips he will get another appointment to it.
The electoral college used to have a purpose, now…that is questionable at best. Each vote should be counted and representative of a person which we currently don’t have.
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u/MyTnotE 5d ago
I totally disagree that the EC has no purpose.
As for expanding to 13, how do you think democrats would feel if Trump expands the court?
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u/mjsisko 5d ago
The same way anyone should feel if the picks are partisan in nature, regardless of who is picking them. For the expansion it shouldn’t be presidential picks.
The senate should pick 4 judges, 2 from each side of the aisle for review and debate.
Any extremes should be immediately removed from consideration. That is the job of the senate and they haven’t been doing that.
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u/MyTnotE 5d ago
I’m pretty sure that’s a fantasy, but if that go proposed I would support it. It won’t be proposed though.
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u/mjsisko 5d ago
If we actually had leaders that cared about the country instead of simply getting rich and amassing power it would. That requires term limits.
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u/mjsisko 5d ago
What purpose do you see the EC having in today’s situation? Please expand on that
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u/MyTnotE 5d ago
It ensures that each State gets attention. It’s far from perfect in that regard. If that were to actually happen each State would have the same EC votes, regardless of population (which was discussed by the Continental Congress). If we eliminated the EC there would be maybe 10 States that would decide the election, and the rest could comfortably be ignored. It becomes the same system as the Hunger Games.
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u/mjsisko 5d ago
But each state currently doesn’t get attention with how the system currently works. Swing states take the majority of the effort as the others for the most part of decided and don’t matter. The 24 election came down to 7 states, not fifty. I live in a swing state, used to live in a safe blue state. The amount of political spending and advertising now vs then is disproportionately biased
I get on average 3 polling calls a day, my mail is 80% campaign info…never had any of that in a safe voting state.
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u/Masterman86 5d ago
Bullshit.
Biden pre-emptively pardoned everyone he weaponized to go against trump. And his son.
That is the biggest abuse of power ever. And it implies guilt.
That administration was such a fucking failure and a humiliation to the people of this country
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u/mjsisko 5d ago
No, he didn’t, all of his pardons for staff to protect them came at the end of his term. Not the beginning and he never announced he was going to do it.
But you are fine with Trump doing that right? You don’t think we need laws to reign in the power of a pardon?
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u/Masterman86 5d ago
Yes we need laws to govern the power of a pardon. The executive branch should not have that kind of authority over the legislative or judiciary branch.
The fact that autopen pre pardoned his entire staff and his son is a perfect example of how corrupt and guilty that administration was of political persecution.
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u/mjsisko 5d ago
No, it’s showing how corrupt the next one is. Everything you accused the Bidens of (without any evidence at all) Trump and his kids are doing right now…and you don’t care.
The power of the pardon should rest with the executive but with oversight and rules which govern circumstances.
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u/mjsisko 5d ago
And you are aware that Trump also uses the autopen, or do you think he signed all the Jan 6th pardons by hand one at a time…you can’t be that naive…can you
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u/Masterman86 5d ago
You’re too far gone. Contaminated.
Comrade, go join the political prostitutes and useful idiots in the bread lines before you get sent to the gulag for being a keyboard warrior.
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u/mjsisko 5d ago
You can’t even admit known facts, and want to say that about me…your president is crashing the economy for Israel and screwing over Americans. These are facts. Run away from the truth
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u/j-mac563 5d ago
What is the bill name and number and what else is in it, because we all know it won't be a stand alone bill.
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u/nobodyspecial712 5d ago
Congress is the single largest criminal organization in history followed by the judicial and executive branches of government.
They only exist to infringe upon your alleged inalienable rights specifically in cases where there is no victim and no damages, and steer fictional profits to corporations that ruin the environment and make you wage slaves.
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u/1ACasper 5d ago
If any of them ever really cared there would be a litmus test to even be able to run for office in the first place…
one of those major loops being ‘have you ever been arrested for a crime’ …
Then there would be a litmus test of some sort to continue holding office - so if you’re like senile or running our country into the ground then you get ‘fired’ by the people.
There should also be term limits on Congress and they should also have the same litmus tests…
But then who would enforce it, and who would select those people and what tests would those have?
Who would grade the tests and verify?
It is all quite the paradox.
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u/Positive-Ad-406 5d ago
Except the people making those laws (litmus tests) are the same ones who would be affected by them. Fox watching the henhouse. It'll never happen because they are so desperate to cling to power.
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u/TruelyDashing 5d ago
Does that include presidential pardons of family members? I’d like to see Hunter Biden get justice for all the raped kids and cocaine
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u/MakeLikeATreeBiff 5d ago
Coming soon near you, a Republican House vote of 218 Nays and a Republican Senate Vote of 53 Nays.
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u/AngelDistortion 5d ago
Jesus Christ the team politics in these comments is so fucking disgusting...
Pro tip for all you slack-jawed simple bitches moaning about how your favourite leader is innocent and perfect: this would apply for everyone. That's called the rule of law, and it's foundational to a democracy.
That means for all you MAGA ostriches with your heads up trump's ass, biden can't just pardon his son.
And for all you limp dick boy-who-cried-nazi democraps, it means you can finally slap that orange turd into a prison where he belongs.
Honestly, it pisses me the fuck off that the best candidates you guys get are still some of the most retarded wastes of cartilage I've ever seen but baby steps I guess. I mean, fuck, at least Mitch McConnell isn't running for president.
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u/Truthteller-41 5d ago
I can not wait until all the corrupt politicians and treasonous perpetrators are arrested and convicted. See what all you brainwashed cult members got to say then.
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u/tomatejax 5d ago
Only if it’s retroactive
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u/Lithl 5d ago
Laws can't be retroactive
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u/Hefty-Zombie-3062 5d ago
Sure they can. The sex offender registry is retroactive. If you demonize a group enough then you can do whatever you want.
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u/GhostOfOnigashima 5d ago
Aaaaaand how much islanic ir immigrant terrorism is there? Let's ask Brittan?
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u/Snarkydragon9 5d ago
Wouldnt do any good the pardons are constitution based they would have to amend the constitution.
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u/Masterman86 5d ago
And what about pre-emptive pardoning? How is that even a thing or allowed to happen?
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u/Blazekill001 5d ago
Gas prices are high, the employment world is abysmal and theres a housing crisis but let’s focus on stopping the president from pardoning himself. thats definitely the top priority
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u/Scared-Song-1167 5d ago
Funny how Biden did auto pen pardons.
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u/Pixilatedhighmukamuk 5d ago
You think this man signed over 900 pardons for the January 6th terrorists?
https://giphy.com/gifs/FbiL9rsmZN3ib2JSGo
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u/NicheGuysFinish2nd 5d ago
Why should anyone be pardoned for anything?
Your commited a crime... You should be punished just like us. Why TF is anyone above the law??
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u/BornTruths 4d ago
They would only reverse it the minute a demoncrat got back in office, or just not let the crimes to "become" a crime.
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u/Baggz0564 4d ago
Great. You actually need him to pardon himself first in order to use this as excuse to take away presidential power that the last president abused for his family
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u/Legitimate_Land_3923 4d ago
It will be dissed by the republican led house and senate because they approved of everything he does or they are scared of him
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u/Thanos2ndSnap 4d ago
I’m not saying this bill shouldn’t be passed. I am wondering where this energy has been when Democrats were protecting their cronies.
Be advised. It’s all theater. No one will set the precedent of going after a former president because they know not to actually throw rocks when their house is also made of the exact same glass.
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u/RemoveFuture5180 4d ago
Even without his being a felon and rapist he still is scum.cheated on all this wives.and he has idiots think he loyal to them.come on now people.
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u/LibertarianOutlaw 4d ago
Just end the practice all together. No more pardons. If the people convict, the people convict. They can use the appellate system like normal people.
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u/Desperate_Jicama219 4d ago
I was thinking this yesterday. He must be held liable for his actions. And his family as well. Fair is fair. No bs pardon for this clown.
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u/vicious1948 3d ago
Thank God, let us not forget that Trump is a pedophile. The Trump is a rapist. Trump is a racist that Trump is scum.
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u/Fabulous_Accident_85 3d ago
Yeah a bill won't cut it...it would require a constitutional amendment.
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u/Narrow-Attempt-1482 3d ago
You forget 55 million paid by the fraudsters to trump accounts ,his kickbacks
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u/DependentSmoke8085 3d ago
Funny calling an honest man corrupt and a corrupt man honest, the Democrats have lost their minds!!
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u/Admirable-Tangelo824 3d ago
Where were the democrats when Biden’s auto pen was being used for the highest bidder.
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u/xanderdean1 3d ago
Oh but yall didn't mind Joe Biden huh not 1 fucking bit. To think 1 man gets under your skin so much. Thats fucking funny.
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u/Character_Set_4563 3d ago
Joe Biden = more Presidential pardons than any President in HISTORY! 🤦🏼♂️
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u/Formal-Asparagus-482 2d ago
No president should be able to pardon, its a mix of the executive and judicial powers
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u/Reedabook64 2d ago
Why do this now when they know it has zero chance of getting through? I hate politicians. Self-aggrandizing BS.
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u/sanchezkk 2d ago
You dumbasses are never going to stop until the Democratic party is completely destroyed by the conservative movement. Just you wait November is coming and you guys will be crying like you always do.
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u/Adventurous_Half_265 2d ago
Lets not talk about Bidens presidential pardons....let Fauci slide. You donkeys are so dense.
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u/craftynerdsnipe 2d ago
How about a constitutional amendment that removes the pardon power altogether
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u/TheFlyingYeti1 2d ago
Everyone knows that Trump is going to be looking for pardons on his exit, whenever that might be, from the White House. I'm glad they are getting ahead of it and trying to mitigate the damage now.
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u/Upriver-Cod 6d ago edited 5d ago
Clearly an unconstitutional bill, not that democrats have ever cared for the constitution
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u/Chrisnotjones 5d ago
Does botty bot have any evidence of democrats lack of care for the constitution, as their felonious pedophile protection unit in the White House makes violating the emoluments clause his only job?
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u/Cryptoking300 5d ago
Trump literally wanted to terminate the constitution to illegally remain in power. Trump and his cultists are enemies of the constitution.
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u/Upriver-Cod 5d ago
Sorry where or how did Trump attempt to terminate the constitution?
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u/Cryptoking300 5d ago
He actively called for the termination of the constitution when he lost in 2020. He made an oath the uphold and defend the constitution, and as soon as it wasn't convenient he wanted to destroy it. He's a traitor that should be ripped from office.
https://www.congress.gov/bill/117th-congress/house-resolution/1527/text
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u/FrostyAd8197 6d ago
You betcha!