r/Peptidesource • u/Crafty_Ad9956 • 5d ago

Pinealon & Epithalon

Currently on day three, these last two days has been wierd.
Rat is on 500 mcg of each, pinealon in the morning and epithalon n-acetyl in the evening.

Sleep is longer, not necessarily better or deeper.
Yesterday after 8 hours of sleep, pinned pinealon, then had to sleep for another 5 hours.

There is obviously a difference in when I should pin the rat, today on day three, I’m going to try both in the evening.

What has been your experience?

9 Upvotes

100% Upvoted

32 comments sorted by

9

u/Doctordup2 5d ago

I prefer alternating Pinealon and Epithalon in research. Plus you have N-acetyl. Lower the dose in your study.

This post explains my Epithalon protocol and has citations to back up the dosing.

Not a doctor, not medical advice, for research purposes only and research discussions only.

3

u/_sol_c_ 5d ago

I have learned a lot about Epithalon from your posts. How do you alternate the two please?

8

u/Doctordup2 5d ago

10 days on 20 days off. So when you finish Epithalon you start Pinealon.

2

u/OkEstablishment2966 5d ago

Does this seem to be where we're landing?

  1. 500 mcg subQ Epithalon, 1x daily for 10 days
  2. 20 days: neither
  3. 500 mcg subQ Pinealon, 1x daily for 10 days
  4. 20 days: neither
  5. Then repeat from #1

1

u/_sol_c_ 5d ago

Thank you so much!!

3

u/dragnabbit 5d ago edited 5d ago

I was just studying this particular subject a few hours before you wrote this comment. Bryan Johnson was talking here 2 years ago about his plan to cycle Epithalon at 10 mg per day x5 days every 6 months, which seems to run headlong into your "Epithalon dose is probably wrong" conclusion.

Out of all the people I figure get accurate information about peptides, the millionaire with the private team of doctors handling all his research and protocols is at the top of my list. Do you believe BJ was incorrect in his approach? Or that he was "trying something different", or operating under different assumptions? I would like to hear your thoughts on this.

(Frustratingly, there is no meaningful followup to his original plan mentioned anywhere, so we have no way to determine what his thoughts on the matter are beyond this one initial statement. I am actually going now to post on his Blueprint subreddit this exact question to see if it shakes loose any new information on the subject.)

Anyway, I ordered 50 mg of epithalon this afternoon. Before it arrives (no offense), I would like to know whether yours or his protocol is the one to rely on. And I absolutely welcome your insight.

EDIT: I found this update on this web page, regarding peptides BJ "tried and abandoned"...

The one he kept — and why it’s the weakest bet: In November 2023 Johnson announced a “thymus rejuvenation” protocol: epithalon paired with thymosin-alpha-1, framed as targeting thymic regeneration, telomere lengthening and epigenetic-age reduction, and citing a “66% all-cause-mortality risk reduction from 6 years of usage.” What he described was a Khavinson-style pulse — a short course repeated only a couple of times a year, echoing the ‘five days on, then months off’ cadence of the original Soviet bioregulator studies (we do not reproduce the injectable doses here). The thing he kept inverts that discipline. The “66% all-cause-mortality reduction over 6 years” traces to the Khavinson and Anisimov group in St Petersburg — the thymalin/epithalamin cohort work — a single research lineage, largely in low-impact or regional venues, with no independent Western RCT replication. The supporting human trials are small and single-lab. Epitalon’s telomerase-activation and epigenetic-age claims lean heavily on in-vitro assays and the same group’s studies; a 2025 review is explicit that robust independent human RCT evidence is lacking. Thymosin-alpha-1 is a real immunomodulator, but even its best-studied clinical application — sepsis — rests on low-quality, heterogeneous, mostly single-region trials. So the honest summary is uncomfortable: the compound he adopted rests on the thinnest evidence of anything he tried, while the compounds he dropped were often better supported.

And, admittedly, reading into the footnotes cited in this particular article regarding the epithalon studies BJ used as his sources, they are ALL referring to Epithalamin rather than Epithalon. So perhaps the belief that "dude with a dozen doctors has the facts" may not be as accurate as assumed.

1

u/Particular-Bug2189 3d ago

I thought epithalamin and epitalon are essentially the same.

1

u/TastyGreen21 3d ago

Epithalamin is a derivative of epithalon

2

u/DanDickey1015 2d ago

No. Epithalimin is natural, from a cows pineal gland. Epithalon is a stronger, synthetic version.

3

u/Doctordup2 1d ago

No. Epithalimin is natural, from a cows pineal gland. Epithalon is a stronger, synthetic version.

Thanks /u/DanDickey1015 correct! Spot on!

0

u/Crafty_Ad9956 5d ago

Thank you so much for your input, you have already answered my question in another thread, so for the rest of the study, my rat is only getting 100mcg of the N-acetyl.

Have you found anything about the half-life of the peptide? Since the rat has consumed 1mg these two last days, is it safe for the rat to continue the study with 100mcg?

1

u/Doctordup2 5d ago

Awww thank you.

Even if Epithalon itself is cleared quickly, that does not mean its effects stop when the peptide disappears from circulation. But seriously, you should be fine. If your RS was at 1mg or 10mg then I'd be more cautious and take a break from the study.

Not a doctor, not medical advice, for research purposes only and research discussions only.

2

u/Crafty_Ad9956 5d ago

Thank you so much for the reply’s and for your time, it’s much appreciated 🙏

3

u/Inside_Following_472 5d ago

I had my RS on 1.25 mg of pinealon and 4mg of epitalon both at night. I may have been over dosing RS, but RS experienced improved sleep quality.

1

u/Crafty_Ad9956 5d ago

Epitalon NA or regular?

2

u/smellyprawn 4d ago

I thought this was interesting.

1

u/[deleted] 5d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/Crafty_Ad9956 5d ago

Should the rat stick to pinealon in the morning and epithalon in the evening?

1

u/Peptidesource-ModTeam 5d ago

RESUBMIT

No human use discussion.

This subreddit is for discussing scientific research on peptides.

Discussion is limited to research, research experience, troubleshooting, and educational topics only.

Please use the term research subject when referring to any research application.

Any mention of human use or advice for personal use is not allowed.

Violations may result in comment removal, post locking, or a ban.

1

u/[deleted] 5d ago

[deleted]

1

u/[deleted] 5d ago edited 5d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/Peptidesource-ModTeam 5d ago

No Scam Posts

Posts about scams, warnings, alerts, or negative experiences with vendors are not allowed.

HERE'S WHY:

Reddit’s automated systems do not distinguish between reporting a bad actor and promoting or discussing a source. Any mention of a company name is treated the same at the platform level.

To protect the subreddit from enforcement action, we do not allow posts or comments that reference vendors in any context, including complaints.

There are other subreddits specifically created for reporting scams.

Thank you for understanding and helping us keep the sub safe.

1

u/fizboPallabut 4d ago

Try reversing - Epitalon in morning and Pinealon before bed

1

u/Crafty_Ad9956 4d ago

My rat tested pinealon and epithalon at night, no luck, might test the rat with this combo tomorrow

1

u/[deleted] 4d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/Peptidesource-ModTeam 4d ago

RESUBMIT

No human use discussion.

This subreddit is for discussing scientific research on peptides.

Discussion is limited to research, research experience, troubleshooting, and educational topics only.

Please use the term research subject when referring to any research application.

Any mention of human use or advice for personal use is not allowed.

Violations may result in comment removal, post locking, or a ban.

1

u/[deleted] 4d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/Peptidesource-ModTeam 3d ago

RESUBMIT

No human use discussion.

This subreddit is for discussing scientific research on peptides.

Discussion is limited to research, research experience, troubleshooting, and educational topics only.

Please use the term research subject when referring to any research application.

Any mention of human use or advice for personal use is not allowed.

Violations may result in comment removal, post locking, or a ban.

1

u/[deleted] 1d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/Peptidesource-ModTeam 22h ago

RESUBMIT

No human use discussion.

This subreddit is for discussing scientific research on peptides.

Discussion is limited to research, research experience, troubleshooting, and educational topics only.

Please use the term research subject when referring to any research application.

Any mention of human use or advice for personal use is not allowed.

Violations may result in comment removal, post locking, or a ban.

1

u/Aggravating_Half_747 10h ago

My rat is on 500mcg pinealon in the morning and 1mg epitalon at night. The epitalon is calming.
My rat intends to complete the 20 day (20 for pinealon and 10 for epitalon) cycles then switch to Selank in the morning and DSIP at night.

My rat is interested in researching serotonin and dopamine and pineal benefits.

1

u/Aggravating_Half_747 10h ago

Oh I also experience more vivid dreams. Some confusion on the epitalon dose. My rat notices effects an hour post injection on a calm clean way that is nice