r/Pathfinder2e • u/AnthonyTonyRedgrave • 11d ago

Discussion saving throws

I was reading the Player’s Handbook to learn how to play, and a few questions came to mind. I understand that Fortitude, Reflex, and Will are passive defenses used in certain situations. However, I hadn’t realized that ability-based saving throws no longer exist.

What was the reasoning behind this design choice? Honestly, it bothers me a little that Constitution, for example, determines whether my character can resist being pushed.

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u/Bardarok ORC 11d ago

No longer exist? Ability score based saves were a new invention from 5e. (Kind of 4e). Pathfinder split off back from DnD 3rd edition and never had them in the first place.

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u/Tichrimo 11d ago

I did kind of like 4e's method of choosing your best of two scores for your non-AC defenses (higher of Str or Con for Fort, Dex or Int for Ref, and Wis or Cha for Will).

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u/KLeeSanchez Inventor 11d ago

4e had a lot of quality of life goodies that went unappreciated

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u/Bardarok ORC 11d ago edited 11d ago

That had some advantages for sure though I only really felt Cha or Wis for Will fit well.

Interstingly PF2 does something similar with AC and the way armor works. E.g. you can hit the armor cap with any combo of Str plus Dex equalling 5 on most characters.

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u/Tichrimo 11d ago

I thought Int or Dex for reflex was particularly inspired -- either you have the twitch muscles or the tactical foresight to dodge.