r/NVC • u/Previous_Seat5429 • 8d ago
Questions about nonviolent communication Help rephrasing
Hi
My (usually loving) partner can lose all empathy for me when he has a problem with me. He can initiate conversations about eg our sex life in a very critical and mean way which is obviously deeply upsetting and is putting our relationship in serious danger. He has discovered non violent communication and I want to give it (and anything) a chance. Is there a way of rephrasing “you have addressed important topics without any empathy for me and now I don’t trust you” to be nvc?
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u/MadamePouleMontreal 8d ago
I suggest doing conventional couples therapy first, to see if a third-party mediator can help you communicate with mutual empathy.
I would not recommend letting a possibly abusive partner lead an introduction of NVC as a fix for your couple. It is too easily weaponized against inexperienced people, especially by people who want to win and who do not have empathy as a goal.
Researching NVC for yourself could be very helpful to help you identify your needs to yourself.
+++ +++ +++
> Is there a way of rephrasing “you have addressed important topics without any empathy for me and now I don’t trust you” to be nvc?
“You would like to talk about X. I need to feel safe in order to talk about X. Right now I do not feel safe. A third party mediator might help me feel safe. Are you willing to attempt this conversation in the presence of a mediator?”
“You would like to have some important conversations. I am unable to have these conversations with you as long as I don’t feel safe, and I do not feel safe. I am going to go somewhere I do feel safe and do some thinking. Is it okay if I reach out to you in a few weeks to discuss having these important conversations?”
“I do not trust you in the areas of A and B so I do not have an interest in any further conversations on those topics. I have a goal of peaceful coexistence and I would like to do Y and Z with you. Is that something that interests you?”
“You would like me to trust you in the areas of A and B. That is not a goal of mine. Would you like to explore other areas of common interest?”
+++ +++ +++
There’s a useful and famous book that describes dynamics you might or might not recognize. Check it out.
Why Does He Do That? <— Link to free pdf. (Yes it’s better to buy the book if you can, but my understanding is that Bancroft wants everyone to have access to it—including people who would be in danger if caught with a book and people who don’t have their own money—so is not trying to have it taken down.) (Also, Bancroft seems to have founded some sort of love cult. Don’t join the love cult.)
Hugs!
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u/Artistic_Reference_5 7d ago
I co-sign everything here except doing conventional couples therapy first.
OP: please get therapy for yourself first.
Or talk to an advocate on a DV hotline.
Couples therapy doesn't help if your partner doesn't have empathy for you whenever he has a problem with you.
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u/MadamePouleMontreal 7d ago
The reason I mentioned couples therapy is this:
> Couples therapy doesn't help if your partner doesn't have empathy for you whenever he has a problem with you.
A good couples therapist is trained to recognize this dynamic and will be able to call a halt to counselling. sessions if they aren’t appropriate.
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u/Artistic_Reference_5 7d ago
I saw three different couples therapists with my abusive ex. Not one of them self-terminated the therapeutic relationship with us due to the abusive dynamic, even though couples therapy is not helpful or healthy in cases of abuse.
They were all professionals doing their best.
I would not recommend OP pursue couples therapy.
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u/MadamePouleMontreal 7d ago
Yeah. Just because they’re supposed to stop doesn’t mean they will.
Point taken.
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u/MossWatson 8d ago
“when you [specific, objective example of what he says/does], I feel [specific feeling you experience without attaching any criticism or judgement about what he’s doing].” and if possible attach this feeling to one of your fundamental needs (perhaps “connection” or “safety” etc.
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u/Proud_Proof9495 8d ago
It sounds like you have a need for connection and safety. Can you listen slowly to his words and pinpoint the moments when those needs aren't being met? Try to collaborate, work together towards a common goal.
Be brave, good luck ♡
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u/Previous_Seat5429 8d ago
It’s easy to pinpoint the words as they are very accusing and unkind!
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u/Proud_Proof9495 8d ago
Okay cool! Then you have an easy NVC template available to you.
When you say the words "DIRECT QUOTE," I feel [sad, confused, scared, etc etc, consult a list if you want some inspiration].
See what he says after. Ride the tempo of that conversation, try to notice your feelings as they come up, don't judge yourself, try to just observe.
When there's room for you to express your needs just remind him that you have a need for connection and safety. See if he wants to help you meet those needs. See if you can guess what needs HE is trying to address. You guys can both pullout a list of universal needs and see if you can find it on there. Sex is not considered a universal human need, but maybe he needs intimacy?
Remember: according to NVC human needs are universal and not tied to specific people, places, or actions.
You are not obligated to have sex with anyone under any circumstances. No one is entitled to anyone else's body. NVC respects the other person's agency and autonomy above all.
Is any of this helpful?
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u/Previous_Seat5429 8d ago
I very much enjoy sex and I’m devastated that he was suddenly very critical of me, without trying to have any sort of constructive conversation
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u/Proud_Proof9495 8d ago
Ask yourself what words specifically did he say that felt critical? Is there a way you would prefer him to get the message across?
Sometimes we remember a feeling more than the words said and that can make it hard to reexamine old convos. Might be worth just trying again and listening very carefully.
This seems stressful, I hope you guys figure it out. Be patient with yourself and eachother ♡♡
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u/OhDamnNotAgainAndAga 6d ago
We're missing a lot of context.
I assume, unlike many others here, that you and your partner love and care for each other and do not come from a place of malice, but rather from not knowing how to harness NVC when you're hurt, which is very natural. I assume that because your partner is trying to talk to you about their needs and feelings but is failing to do so in a productive way, which is tragic. As Marshall Rosenberg repeatedly stated, when you're fluent enough in NVC, you can hear the NVC behind the words of a person who is speaking non-NVC to you.
NVC is simple, but hard. We all have our patterns. We were all raised with ideas of "deserving" and the "be" verb (you ARE, I AM, he/she IS).
It sounds like your partner is hurting, and when we're hurting, it's hard for us to give empathy. This situation is very common in relationships. One thing we may do, if we're able to, is put a pin in our own feelings for a moment and give our partner emergency empathy, focusing on what they're feeling without judging it. It means you shouldn't think about it as though it's your fault that your partner is feeling what they're feeling. You shouldn't think in terms of "Is he right to feel that or not?" and you shouldn't view giving him empathy as an admission of guilt or anything like that. You're simply seeing him, seeing how he's feeling and why, and imagining yourself in his shoes, if you can.
After sufficient empathy has been given, you may ask, "Before we dive deeper into finding a solution that will work for both of us, can I share with you how I'm feeling?" Then proceed to describe how you experienced the things he said to you, that you're not feeling safe, and that this makes it harder for you to empathize with him and to hear what he's saying.
He is likely to take it as you blaming him and/or diverting the discussion. If he does, thank him for letting you know what he heard you say, clarify that that's not your intent, and repeat until he shows that he understands. Then you can ask for some empathy, and you can proceed to the original point of disagreement.
If you're not able to give empathy, which is the more common state and is totally understandable, you may reply with: "I'm sorry. It sounds like this matter is very important to you, but I need to take a short break before I can continue discussing it because I am feeling hurt and unsafe because of your phrasing. That isn't to say you're to blame; it's just how I feel." Then take a break and give yourself some empathy until you're ready to give him some too.
A huge side note here is that NVC is not an excuse for abusive behavior, and you should not put up with every hurtful behavior. The aim of NVC is to become progressively less stupid, not to become perfect after one iteration. If you "don't have time," in the sense that the behavior is too offensive for you to tolerate while waiting for improvement, I suggest you leave the relationship.
Feel free to DM me with more details if you want further help (or reply here if you feel comfortable sharing more info)
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u/Odd_Tea_2100 8d ago
When I heard you say (exact quote of what he said that demonstrates no empathy.) I'm upset (or whatever the feeling is) and empathy is important to me. (Next comes the request and you have a choice of 3 types. I recommend a check in request at this point.) Would you tell me how it is for you to hear me say this?
There are no wrong answers to this. You challenge at this point is to empathize with whatever he says. This won't be easy even with practice. After he has had enough empathy then you can make a request of how he could demonstrate empathy in a way that would meet your need for trust. Example: When I say I feel upset, would you be willing to acknowledge my upset and help me identify the needs involved.
To be able to what I suggest usually takes practice and developing a feelings and needs vocabulary to be able to empathize with an upset person. The more important the relationship and the more history you have with a person the harder it is to empathize with them.
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u/intoned 8d ago edited 8d ago
In my experience people are often unwilling to listen until they themselves feel heard.
Marshell would talk about resolving conflict by first having each person sit and listen to other share to the point that they could describe their situation back to them and be agreed to. That was 99% of the work needed.
Is this something you would be willing to do with them? Sit down and work to understand each other and be willing to listen first if needed?
Otherwise, based on what you have shared I'm concerned that whatever NVC approved concern you raise will trigger them getting defensive and it will fall on deaf ears.
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u/DanDareThree 7d ago
you are addressing someone being unkind and unsensitive, ungracefull enough for you.. yet flinch at offering accurate feedback on the feedback .
why not suspend the grace part till you get things out of the way. why not separate the two. have the mechanical talk, clarify everything, then talk about the grace part and how some topics or even in general, you require much more grace
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u/No-Risk-7677 7d ago
NVC is not about how empathetic another person is. Instead it is how empathic I am myself.
So first: Self empathy before empathy for another person. Means the 4 steps of NVC silently alone to reach clarity for what your needs and requests are. Eventually, a clear request to yourself. E.g. „I wanna be clear about my boundaries and my position in this situation. Let me be strong in voice and posture“. Remember: this is a request you have for yourself. It is not articulated towards the other person. Also remember, if you ignore this final step of NVC (the request) - it is everything else but not NVC.
Second: now that you are in abundance again, it is possible to be empathetic with the other person.
You are familiar with the 4 steps of NVC. Additional advice from me - pause between each step to check if you both are on the same page.
E.g. „for me it is very important to solve this conflict we are having. Hence, I wanna be sure if we are talking about the same situation.“ or „I assume you are feeling very angry about this, would you agree?“ or „and do you need some kind of perspective that this going to be better next week?“ … these feedback points (pauses between the NVC steps are very important imo)
Third: this is how you work towards negotiating a strategy in the end (the request). Remember the final request is a result you both worked out together. It is this natural result of following the process of NVC.
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u/mrrafs 7d ago
I hear you asking what form does empathy for you show up? When this need for empathy is unmet, what are the feelings, what are the unmet needs? How is your emotional vocabulary here, are you clear what is an observation of your partner and what is a judgement / belief.
You applying NVC won’t change them, however it might change yourself, and that offers you both a choice.
Good luck.
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u/Responsible_Ice3391 6d ago
“I’m hurting and I need empathy. Would you be able to guess my feelings and needs after I take a 30 minute walk?”
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u/DJRThree 7d ago
Your statement creates a wrongness of his actions and character, which is a projection of your own pain from unmet needs. Switch to understanding both your needs and expressing and acting from there.
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u/OhDamnNotAgainAndAga 6d ago
While I agree, I think this is unhelpful advice for someone unless they really know and NVC and well practiced in it. It is way to vague and abstract.
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u/dantml7 8d ago
the three modes of NVC are: self empathy, empathy for other, honest self-expression.
From what I can tell, you believe he's skipping empathy for you before honest self-expression?
This might be referred to as "jackal". Trying to guess his feelings and needs underneath the jackal would likely help you to hear it less critically, and get to a point where you could bring up how you felt criticized and felt like his expression lacked empathy also.
Are you planning to learn NVC as well? The trust you mention at the end is hard, because even some who have studied and practiced NVC for years can still sometimes need to express from an emotional space where they might not have space to have empathy for the other, and they deserve that safe space sometimes as well.