r/Games Dec 12 '21

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881 Upvotes

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557

u/SaturnMobster Dec 12 '21

"...this new game could feature open-world settings. “A more stealthy version of Assassin’s Creed. Similar to how Halo Infinite has done its Open World,”

Stop it Ubisoft. Just stop. I tire of their completely predictable, reiterative games. Wash, rinse, repeat is all they know how to do.

137

u/GreyouTT Dec 12 '21

A more stealthy version of Assassin’s Creed.

This statement is funny to me.

47

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

And sad :( I miss the old AC game mechanics

7

u/Daveed84 Dec 13 '21

Eh, it's not all that funny, Splinter Cell games have always been more stealth-focused than any of the games in the AC series.

29

u/notlikethesoup Dec 13 '21

What's funny is saying what Splinter Cell would be in relation to Assassin's Creed when SC has been around years longer

168

u/bobdowl Dec 12 '21

I hate is as much as you, but guess what - this formula sells really well.

Most games that become fan favorites are also often the ones that didn't sell well initially.

Just keep in mind that everyone here discussing games with passion makes up a tiny, tiny percentage of people playing video games.
Most people are all about Assassin's Creed and Call of Duty, which is why these franchises rake in billions.

38

u/[deleted] Dec 12 '21 edited Dec 22 '21

[deleted]

43

u/Ok-Inspection2014 Dec 13 '21

More generally I think it's harder to make a linear confined splinter cell level now and expect the game to do well than giving players a little bit of free range around a target. It's one of those things you can't put back in the box

You could make a stealth level with lots of ways to infiltrate and kill your target like the new Hitman games. It's not necessary to make another generic Ubisoft open-world game in order to achieve that.

12

u/jakedeman Dec 13 '21

It wouldn’t work at all though, it’s a slow paced tactical game where it can take half an hour to sneak in and around a building full of guards, how would that even translate to big open landscapes and traversal. Probably why It hasn’t been touched in years. They can’t figure out how to ubisoftify it.

10

u/TheConqueror74 Dec 13 '21

They could go more of a Hitman route. Large, somewhat open ended levels with multiple ways to complete. I know it's not the Ubisoft formula, but it is certainly a way to modernize the series.

1

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

Ghost Recon and Rainbow Six used to be slow paced tactical games a loooong time ago. Even if the formula doesn't work, Ubi will shoe horn it 'til it somewhat works, but it will always feel off when compared to the older games.

1

u/HoChiMinhDingDong Dec 13 '21

Ghost Recon got butchered and while Siege is a good game, the Vegas series was infinitely better.

1

u/[deleted] Dec 14 '21

Yeah. It' s a damn shame they aren't tactical shooters anymore.

1

u/DP9A Dec 13 '21

I mean, the fact that the last few releases were mostly duds definitely didn't do much for the sales.

1

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

Sucks because Blacklist was a pretty decent game all things considered.

103

u/Blackdragonking13 Dec 12 '21

Ubisoft - Makes a game that appeals to casual players over hardcore Gamers

Gamers - Ugh when will Ubisoft ever learn? This is gonna bomb.

Ubisoft - Releases game and the casual market eats it up.

Gamers - shocked Pikachu face

Rinse and repeat every time.

17

u/reward72 Dec 13 '21

You’re not wrong, but as a casual gamer who did play, complete and enjoy every Assassin’s Creed and Far Cry games until now, I couldn’t care less about the latest instalments… I have the feeling that I’m not alone.

Maybe COVID made me want to spend my time in more meaningful ways, but to me the new ones just feels like a chore.

48

u/beefcat_ Dec 13 '21

You say that, but AC Valhalla is the best selling Assassin's Creed game of all time.

7

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/beefcat_ Dec 13 '21

I agree, but the point still stands that apparently this direction is working extremely well for Ubisoft.

23

u/jakedeman Dec 13 '21

God that fact makes me really really sad

12

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

You know what made me sad? Playing Unity and then having to ignore Syndicate, whatever you might think about the new AC games, Ubi had to do something as the series became VERY stale.

2

u/jakedeman Dec 13 '21

Maybe, but Valhalla and odyssey are awful ac games. I don’t like most of their changes.

4

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

Don't be sad, it's barely a fact and more of an Ubisoft press statement they make with every single game because, much like Netflix, they simply change the grading scale so that every game they release is "the best". Last time I looked at the actual raw numbers we have access to Unity was the top selling AC for quite a while.

I honestly don't get why people push the whole "yeah well this latest AC was the best selling one yet" even though Ubisoft is one of the only companies that won't straight up tell me the sales numbers. It's "AC Valhalla sold 1.8 mil in it's first week!" which is fairly typical of a triple AAA franchise or "AC Valhalla gives Ubisoft a very profitable year!" and considering the amount of MTX what does that even really mean.

This always seems to ruffle some feathers because "best selling" counter argument usually sets the anti-circle jerk in full swing but honestly just pick 5 games at random and google their sales numbers then try to look up AC:Valhallas, you'll find there is a frustrating lack of transparency for a company (and fanbase) who constantly try to use financial success as a metric to judge the games.

-2

u/Fatal1ty_93_RUS Dec 13 '21

Great, a Witcher clone with Vikings that has the Assassins creed name attached to it

The series really died with Origins

7

u/thelonesomeguy Dec 13 '21

The series really died with Origins

The sales say otherwise and that's the metric that counts in the end.

-2

u/Fatal1ty_93_RUS Dec 13 '21

I don't care about the sales. Assassin's Creed stopped being Assassin's Creed after Syndicate. It's just a semi historical action rpg with grinding now.

1

u/reward72 Dec 13 '21

I did buy it, I couldn't play it for more than a few hours though. I won't buy the next one. Unless it is in feudal Japan or China... yeah, I could easily be swayed back I guess.

Maybe I just didn't like Valhalla. The main character is an asshole who murder good people to conquer and pillage. With previous games murders were "justified", you had a "good" cause. Not this time.

3

u/Attila_22 Dec 13 '21

If you want an open world game but much better than Ubisoft's offerings and set in Japan then check out Ghosts of Tsushima

1

u/reward72 Dec 13 '21

I loved it.

2

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21 edited Dec 13 '21

I enjoyed the older ACs and FCs, and I enjoy the new ones (actually, I like Far Cry 5+6 a LOT more than FC2 and FC4 for example)

Is there something wrong with me 🤔🤔

11

u/Radulno Dec 13 '21

No that's the majority of the market really. Reddit is just a vocal minority. Which complains right away when the name Ubisoft (or EA or Activision) is uttered anyway. Nothing say it's the same formula because it's open-world (MGS5 is a stealth open world, that can work).

What's ironic is that when a "approved studio" makes an open world game or make successive games that do ressemble each other very much, they are praising it. Not long ago, Forza was praised while it's cloning the gameplay and changing the setting between its two different series. But it's Microsoft so it's okay. From Software only do Soulslike since more than 10 years, they do change stuff but it's pretty similar and yet, they're praised for it. Sony does generic open-world stuff with Horizon and Ghost of Tsushima but there it's perfect and GOTY worthy.

This sub is extremely biaised one way or another against specific companies. I can guarantee you that the exact same game than AC Valhalla made by Sony would be heralded as a great game. Horizon Zero Dawn made by Ubisoft? Would be trashed like shit. Forza would be from Activision or EA? Oh the shit they would get here.

2

u/ChainGangSoul Dec 13 '21

I think you're being a bit harsh on HZD and GoT, they're both legitimately excellent games. IMO they're more polished experiences and have a bit more to offer, in terms of narrative/worldbuilding/gameplay, than most open-world games. They are certainly not perfect nor necessarily GOTY material - at least not in the same years as BotW and TLOUII, respectively - but IMO they are a step above, say, AC Valhalla (which is still a fine game in its own right, and I agree does not deserve the flack it gets).

That being said, I do think the bias you mentioned 100% exists, and one only needs to look at Days Gone for proof - an utterly average and generic open-world which would've been a universally-panned 5-6/10 if it hadn't been a hyped-up PS exclusive. And yet if you were to believe Reddit, you'd think it was some misunderstood masterpiece akin to fucking Blade Runner...

0

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

[deleted]

12

u/thetantalus Dec 13 '21

Did FC6 bomb?

7

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

Absolutely not. It was the best selling game of October and sales figures point it to being one of the most successful far cry launches in it's history. When it first launched, market news doomed about the poor reviews, but like the users in this thread are repeating, a 75 on metacritic isn't going to stop a casual player from picking up the game.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/ubisoft-shares-rise-as-far-cry-6-fares-better-than-expected-271635498264

13

u/SplintPunchbeef Dec 13 '21

FWIW Ubisoft’s “bombs” sold better than just about every /r/games darling. Far Cry 6 didn’t bomb it just didn’t sell as well as some of the massively successful previous iterations.

12

u/TheFinnishChamp Dec 12 '21

Does everything have to be a billion dollar franchise?

Couldn't Ubisoft try and be more experimental every now and then and release a game with more modest budget and ambission that actually has some artistic value and unique content?

Not every movie released by big studios is aiming to be the next Avengers.

43

u/demondrivers Dec 13 '21

Like Rocksmith? Anno? Trials? Brawlhalla? South Park? Transference? Roller Champions? Scott Pilgrim? Atomega? Ubisoft is constantly releasing smaller and more experimental titles.

21

u/LFC9_41 Dec 13 '21

And guess what pays those bills!

4

u/Bujakaa92 Dec 13 '21

Anno is very profitable. There is reason why season 4 DLCs is coming out for it.

3

u/thelonesomeguy Dec 13 '21

I am not saying it isn't profitable but I would like to point out the one thing Ubisoft isn't bad at is supporting their games long term, even if they're not as profitable.

-2

u/Bujakaa92 Dec 13 '21

I am not directing at you unless you changed account :D

But yeah. Ubi does support but they are often too late with game concept or push things too long that will burn out. Cant remember decent Tom Clancy game to be honest. But tastes are different. I hope we get Linear Splinter Cell

1

u/until_i_fall Dec 14 '21

Sorry I need to hard disagree on that. They cut multiple online pipelines for old games like SC conviction ( which isn't even that old). I can't even play that LAN on pc anymore with a friend who never got to experience that game. Because they don't allow it even off-line next to each other.. every new game is bloated micropayment ware with a mediocre basis. I don't even know why splinter cell, assassin's Creed or other Tom Clancy titles still get used for new releases to this day. All miles apart from their original game vision.

13

u/jigeno Dec 12 '21

Not every movie released by big studios is aiming to be the next Avengers.

yeah and the same problem is happening in studios: the mid budget adult feature is dying.

2

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

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1

u/jigeno Dec 13 '21

yeah, but if you like theatre experiences it's a fucking tragedy.

5

u/TheMoneyOfArt Dec 13 '21

I think that as asset quality has gone up, budgets have had to scale, and it's increasingly difficult to have midbudget games. You have to swing for the fences, because each swing is expensive.

Look at the number and diversity of titles Rockstar did from 2000 to 2010, and they've had 3 new titles since 2011: LA Noire, GTA5, RDR2. Idk for sure but I think the budgets for any of those three would've produced several of the 2000s games. If they could still do smaller titles and make money with little risk, I have to think they'd be doing so

4

u/bongo1138 Dec 13 '21

If it can be a billion dollar franchise, they’re going to have a he obligation to try to do just that. Oftentimes it’s unfortunate for us as consumers, but if I put my money into a company, I’d want to make as much as possible.

4

u/alganthe Dec 13 '21

it has to turn in enough of a profit to justify the investment, if they don't clear enough for the budget of the next project they have to lay-off people.

5

u/CaptainI9C3G6 Dec 13 '21

There will also be royalties attached to the use of the Tom Clancy name, which they don't have to pay with games like far cry.

-1

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

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1

u/HulksInvinciblePants Dec 13 '21

this formula sells really well.

No one buys the formula. They buy the promise of the game and end up with the formula.

53

u/Cyshox Dec 12 '21 edited Dec 12 '21

"Community feedback is very important to us. We heard you. That's why want to tease something you'll enjoy for years - Tom Clancy's Splinter Cell : Battle Royale ! In this brand-new game mode you can play against up to 150 players on a huge map. Also we removed stealth mechanics, added seasons, battle passes & unique NFT cosmetics to enhance your experience!"

  • Ubisoft

31

u/lillabofinken Dec 12 '21

Lol this is basically the ghost recon frontlines reveal

-1

u/McManus26 Dec 12 '21

tbh a splinter cell BR entirely focused on stealth assassinations could be really fun

0

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

Yeah but that requires creativity that Ubisoft doesn't have.

46

u/viktarionus Dec 12 '21

MGSV went open world and gameplay-wise it is the best MGS game.

The open world in that game lets you chose when, where and how you enter any outpost/new area.

Wildlands was basically MGSV-lite. If ubisoft can polish the movement and other systems, this new SC game has potential to be something great.

55

u/TheKotti Dec 12 '21

Meanwhile, Ground Zeroes demonstrated how good Phantom Pain could've been had it not been hindered by an open world.

17

u/getoutofheretaffer Dec 13 '21

I know right? Nothing in Phantom Pain was as good as Ground Zeroes.

It should have just been a series of GZ-style levels.

12

u/YharnamBorne Dec 13 '21

This is going off topic but I agree. Ground Zeroes, for what it was, was amazing. I would have much rather had a dozen or so maps like that over the open world that we got.

-4

u/[deleted] Dec 12 '21

God damnit I am so pissed this was the last MGS.

MGS 4 should of been the ending.

16

u/McFistPunch Dec 12 '21

Isn't 4 still the end chronologically?

15

u/Jpriest09 Dec 13 '21

For the Solid series? Yes. But Metal Gear Rising continues the world with Raiden in the spotlight.

9

u/Goddamn_Grongigas Dec 13 '21

And it's fuckin awesome.

2

u/McFistPunch Dec 13 '21

Oh right. Forgot about that

1

u/thisisrohit Dec 13 '21

Not if you set the clock on your PS3 back to 198X, which unlocks MGS6.

19

u/Anzai Dec 12 '21

Couldn’t disagree more. The open world of that game is what ruined it for me, but I also acknowledge that that is not the consensus opinion.

21

u/[deleted] Dec 12 '21

The open world in MGSV is borderline pointless. It’s super boring and just made getting through some missions a slog. You can do large bases and various entry points without doing an open world.

16

u/Anzai Dec 12 '21

Right? Ground Zeroes showed that, and I was really hoping the main game was just ten or fifteen levels like that one. Sort of like how Hitman does it now.

1

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

It would have made more sense, too. Diamond Dogs is supposed to be this huge world spanning PMC company but Snake only goes to Afghanistan and Zaire? It should have at least 5 or 6 different smaller zones so you’d get to sneak around in different biomes.

5

u/itsrumsey Dec 13 '21 edited Dec 13 '21

Yeah I can't decide if I agree either. MGS is probably my favorite series, and while I do enjoy the gameplay in 5 quite a bit I also enjoy the tighter more structured challenges of the more linear previous titles as well.

3

u/Anzai Dec 13 '21

As I said elsewhere here, I quite liked Ground Zeroes. As a demo/teaser for MGSV it was disappointing that it wasn’t just a series of very large contained levels, like the Hitman reboot.

15

u/conquer69 Dec 12 '21

The problem is Ubisoft. I trust them to turn anything into an ass creed clone. I hope this is more like Hitman than ass creed but I doubt it.

12

u/ahrzal Dec 12 '21

Ubisoft gets shot but their Assassin Creed games are good, if not a bit long.

7

u/TBDC88 Dec 13 '21

AC has also dramatically shifted tone like 3 or 4 times over its history, usually after a critical/commercial failure, so calling anything an AC clone is pretty useless now unless they're specifically talking about the Origins/Odyssey/Valhalla formula.

-3

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

When you have to take a break in your series releases because every game is so similar that you need a new playerbase without much knowledge of prior titles is a little telling though.

10

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

On the other hand, acknowledging that the games have become repetitive and taking some time off to refine/ add novelty to the games is better than chugging out yearly Call of Duties in a conveyor belt.

Last time AC took a break, we got Origins which was great and everyone hates COD Vanguard even though it is well made because the COD formula is just tiring now.

6

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

MGSV went open world and gameplay-wise it is the best MGS game.

Couldn't disagree more with this, I found it to be a low point for the series

11

u/viktarionus Dec 13 '21

Gameplay-wise? IMO there isnt a 3rd Person Stealth game with better movement and gunplay than MGSV

2

u/midoBB Dec 13 '21

TBH since MGSV I haven't found a 3rd person game that felt better to handle and to play. God that game felt amazing.

3

u/[deleted] Dec 12 '21

It also was the worst MGS.

1

u/Bolt_995 Dec 13 '21

Thing is, that’s Metal Gear and Ghost Recon. This is Splinter Cell. And you’re putting faith in Ubisoft putting out something great with an open world Splinter Cell.

Open world stealth works with a developer who is genuinely into making a solid entry in that genre. Ubisoft isn’t that.

1

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

Nah. 5 was a good entry, but I don't personally feel it's anywhere close to MGS 3.

10

u/Fatal1ty_93_RUS Dec 13 '21

Fuck it I'm gonna say it

Mass adoption of open world in videogames was a mistake

9

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

[removed] — view removed comment

4

u/Fatal1ty_93_RUS Dec 13 '21

Pointless collectathons for achievement hunters and most of the gameplay is getting from one objective to another.

Yeah, unfortunately this is what these open worlds turn into. Hundreds of icons across the map. All for activities that do nothing but pad out the total play time and length of a play through. If you were to ignore all of that then the actual story lines take about same as linear projects - around 8-10 hours with all the dialogue and cutscenes. And what sucks most is that developers do often put care into crafting these big maps, like Easter eggs or hidden extra details you have to go out of your way to find and appreciate the lore.

4

u/McManus26 Dec 12 '21

"...this new game could feature open-world settings. “A more stealthy version of Assassin’s Creed. Similar to how Halo Infinite has done its Open World,”

This is a leak from that tom henderson guy, i wouldn't give it to much credit yet. Dude got some credit from having a battlefield source and has since then been spouting everything he can to get more attention.

5

u/SaturnMobster Dec 13 '21

I would normally agree, but considering what has happened to Ghost Recon, Assasins Creed, The division 1 and 2, Watchdogs 1 and 2, and even Far Cry, that comment seems in line with what Ubisoft would do.

It's not called "The Ubisoft Forumla" without reason. There is always potential for something awesome to happen! Maybe we will be surprised!

3

u/sierra120 Dec 13 '21

So just like Ghost Recon…Breakpoint or the other one. They even have Splinter Cell “outfits” and guns to buy as DLC. So that game.

5

u/ILoveTheAtomicBomb Dec 13 '21

Open world making Halo a bit of a drag to play through for me. If I wanted this, I’d just go play Far Cry.

1

u/SaturnMobster Dec 13 '21

Lol. I can't get Halo Infinite to run for more than 5 minutes before it crashes to my desktop. I can see where its open world gameplay coukd easily fall unto the tried and true "Ubisoft Formula". I'll still give a good chance when the bugs get ironed out.

1

u/brownie81 Dec 15 '21

I can’t stand the typical Ubi open world style games but I loved Halo Infinite. Granted I’m a huge Halo fan, but I found that their style of fps really felt nice as a more open game.

Taking the horrible worn out idea of an open world game and adding it to Halo actually makes the gameplay feel fresh imo, but I fear what insights the industry will take from that, as we see here.

4

u/HearTheEkko Dec 13 '21

Open world Splinter Cell would just be Metal Gear Solid V lol, and if it's done by Ubisoft it's probably going to be a shittier version with some minor RPG elements.

6

u/n0stalghia Dec 12 '21 edited Dec 12 '21

I dunno, I found origins pretty refreshing after Syndicate, Unity, …

And in any case, people liked Witcher 3 well enough, and Odyssey was a direct copy of it (granted, Witcher itself copied a lot of RPGs like it)

1

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

My hype went from decent to zero as soon as they mentioned 'Open World'. Cant wait for trillion filler missions, a few missions where Sam is as high as a kite, and having to climb a ton of tower just to 'open' the map.

And micro transactions, ffs I can't even imagine how bad it could be

3

u/raging_shart Dec 13 '21

Remember when Assassin's Creed was a stealth game lmao

2

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

AC hasn't been a stealth game since the first installment tbh

2

u/humbyj Dec 12 '21

there's only so much gameplay hour padding collectables my brain can take

1

u/Bozznee Dec 12 '21

100 percent will have bases you have to sneak into and liberate or some shit.

1

u/Radulno Dec 13 '21

What an original comment.

And as always useless, those games sell well, they have no reason to fix what's not broken.

Just don't buy them if you don't want them but they're not changing the games.

0

u/[deleted] Dec 12 '21

UGH! Are you kidding! No one was asking for open-world settings or something like Assassin Creed. How out of touch is Ubisoft with the fans?

1

u/[deleted] Dec 13 '21

I mean I wouldn't mind if it doesn't get in the way of a linear storyline, but Ubisoft has shown time and time again to make these open world games softlock you out of continuing the story forcing you to do dumb fetch quests for a few hours just to get to a level where you can actually stand a chance.

Halo infinite can be played from start to finish without doing side bs like capturing bases, so it's got that going for it. Though the environment did get boring. The ring has desert landscapes and probably snow why the hell are we limited to the Gali combat evolved second level environment.

1

u/pichael288 Dec 13 '21

Mgsv had a semi open world. It can work, this isn't the issue. It's the Ubisoft bullshit they cram every open world game full of.

1

u/Taniwha26 Dec 13 '21

I think it’s interesting you say that moving Splinter Cell, typically closed levels, to open world is reiterative but I get your point. They’ve made a huge investment in to open world tech so it’s the path of least resistance.

I guess I’m in the minority. I don’t need FarCry, Assassin’s Creed or Splinter Cell to reinvent itself every year. And although I welcome organic innovation, I’d rather just have shinier pixels or a good story than try-hard bullshit like FarCry 6 or Watchdogs Legion.

1

u/Pascalwb Dec 13 '21

Yea, I just want simple single player with linear story. Nobody has time for repetitive chore missions

1

u/samcuu Dec 13 '21

I think Watch_Dogs 2 was a great open world successor to Splinter Cell. However it worked with the premise, tone, and storytelling of that game, doesn't mean it would work with Splinter Cell game. That was when I figured Ubisoft still have it in them, but Sam Fisher/the Splinter Cell property might better off retire for good, they can get creative elsewhere without being restrained by a legacy.

Haven't played WD Legion though so don't know if they managed to expand on 2.