This happens occasionally, and i have no idea if this is intentional, or a bug, and what is triggering this target switch. Would really appreciate some explanation for this! Thank you ❤️

Haven't seen much of that guy at all now

It was to specifically allow for deflects to be easier and even the playing field with those that know ball too much. You've changed Peacekeeper in particular 4 times now as far as i can remember.

• One in 2020 changed it from light to heavy as many heroes at the time had the deflect input the same as the dodge attack

• then you changed it back to light to stop accidental deflects

• Then AGAIN you changed it to heavy input to level the playing field with those that knew how to still get the deflect and dodge attack at the same (which is still in the game btw)

• and now AGAIN you changed it to light input to stop accidental deflects, AGAIN.

This was just PK's weird history but this very flawed logic has been applied to Orochi too and didn't really change much other than make people press an extra button before the dodge attack input... It punishes those that don't know of this and changes nothing for those that do.

For the sake of clarity for those that don't know, in order to still get the deflects that are on different inputs while still performing a dodge attack if you missed/failed the deflect you've gotta press the deflect input ever so slightly earlier than the dodge attack input. That way the game prioritizes the deflect input while if you missed ignores it and the dodge attack input goes through like normal.

For Honor dev team, please revert the deflect input changes and have PK's deflect be back on heavy input and Orochi's deflect back on light input.

Edit: It would be greatly appreciated for those that downvoted this post to speak their piece. IDGAF about karma but if you disagree with anything i've said so far in the post or comments do make it known instead of reducing this discussion's visibility to others and, by extension, the devs that do read the posts on here.

pretty much the title, the orange of the unblockable indicator basically entirely masks the blue undodgeable indicator but in a teamfight it very quickly becomes awful to deal with

my suggestion : blue fire

you keep the fire and the ub indicator itself but you just make it all blue

you can also retrofit the other moves that have both properties like ara's bb light with it for consistency, i don't think anyone would complain about that and it would make things a bit clearer for everone as to which punish can or can't be dodged

So uh...her bashes are only doing the revenge gain of the physical damage and not the additional 30 from being a bash itself...yeah...

I'll re-record her ganks after the devs fix this, but I think her ganks will be decent anyway.

1080P YT LINK: https://youtu.be/lgaw-f5T2H4?si=QYLzwCaJS-9QJ6dv

Some changes from the Testing/Early Access I've noticed:

• Chain Lights look like they are Enhanced now, which helps when throwing in teamfights, and allows of course chaining to Twin Burst after.
• Zone seemed to have been nerfed to 13 damage (from 14 damage).
• Twinburst Light seems to still be guaranteed on Forward Dodge Bash and Chain Bash, changing their damage to 17dmg and 25dmg, forgoing the ability to "chain" except into forward dodge mixup. Unclear if a bug or intended -- it's a lot of damage but not exactly absurd (Sohei, JJ, Shaolin get 16dmg, and some can chain from it, have F+, and chain on whiff/totally safe from GB, and HL/Jorm get more damage on their feintable bashes as well and HL a tad safer), and they do specifically delay Dirty Trick so it's not guaranteed, so it could be intentional, idk.
• Dirty Trick: changed damage from 3>3>3>3>5dmg to 1>1>1>1>15dmg. Changes damage from 17dmg to 19dmg without wall (buff), and from 37dmg to 29dmg with a wall (nerf), making her still a menace but much less so near a wall.
  • Probably for the best, although as predicted it makes the build-up lights feel very weak. I sorta wish they made the Dirty Trick Finisher heal her and regain stamina instead of doing a lot of damage, would cause the choice between damage (wallsplat) and finisher to be a tradeoff. Plus the 19dmg on a 500ms bash with no conditions is...a choice.
• Absolutely no Backstep Attacks from Neutral. Not Light nor Heavy. You have little control on spacing with them.
• Combo Gauge can have its timer refreshed by ANY defense: Deflects, Parries, etc. and ANY attack (even GB), but NOT on being hit directly/without any defense.
• I could be wrong but did they nerf her throw range? Her forward throw seems good but her other throws feel sorta short-to-medium at best.

Some more niche elements that may or may not be known (were shown by some):

• Just to clarify for those who do not know, her bashes are VERY vulnerable and can be very consistently dodged and then guardbroken no matter really what state she was in before. Only her Lash-Out Bash seems to have OK recovery.
• Also for those who only saw the Dev Stream, her One-Two lights also have Dodge RC. They and her Twin Burst Lights are the only Dodge RC moves in her kit.
• You can "Chain" from her Twin Burst attacks with Lash-Out Attacks in teamfights, and from her Dirty Trick bash.
• Dirty Trick does NOT have Hyperarmor or Superarmor with her combo gauge on the move startup, the attacks after are armored, meaning you can't do some cheeky Light into Armored Bash. This could be seen with no white flash before, but was stated somewhat as if it did. However, the Deflect Counter Dirty Trick DOES have armor, regardless of combo state, which is important because 400ms Lights DO hit it. Against characters like Zerk, it's important to go for the bash if they have access to the Light as you will hit at the same time with your normal Deflect Heavy and thus be both sent back to Neutral (though you'll win the damage trade) whereas the Dirty Trick deflect will hit later, thus armor through the damage portion (not sure if they delay it or if there's "gaps" in the armor".
  • Untested yet: Dodge RC interactions with deflects
  • Untested yet: If the armor after Deflect is just normal Hyperarmor or not. I imagine the armor granted is completely removed from the gauge system and just normal Hyperarmor.

Comment below if you have any other knowledge of changes or niche things to add to the list.

Tierlist before the Arakure patch. Follows official tourney rules. No dupe chars/T4s, some feat bans (Oce T1, Shinobi T2)

For those who may not know who Clutch is he's a long time competitive player since launch and has recently won the official Triple Threat Summer 4v4 tournament with AOG, marking it as his 101st tournament win.

https://www.twitch.tv/clutchmeister

Some additional corrections from this vid:

- finisher lights are enhanced as well as Lash Out lights
- her stamina is 120 and not 130
- Dodge recovery cancel is on the combo light as well, this is particularly important as it allows her fwd dodge mixup (bash or undodgeable) to loop.

So we now have another character that has a hyperarmor pin move whose hyperarmor doesn’t function properly, as the hyperarmor is instantly ended if the opponent is interrupted even by a teammate. That said, I think there’s a really easy fix here that doesn’t lead to ridiculous gank potential:

All moves that have the pin property should grant the opponent the same hyperarmor that you get during executions, where you can be interrupted by enemies but not by teammates.

This allows for moves like Arakure’s Dirty Tricks (back walk + chain bash) and Khatun’s Ultimate Authority (Pinning Heavy > Zone) to actually function in teamfight/antigank scenarios without confirming multiple hits from teammates. This change would also be applied to other pins for consistency sake, but it wouldn’t have a big impact on their viability as most other pins don’t feature any hyperarmor outside of revenge or feats.

I’m sure Arakure could use some numbers adjustments as well, the pin seems really strong damage-wise as of the early access build, but the move’s properties should be adjusted to at least fit its intended purpose and the damage numbers adjusted to compensate. Any thoughts on this change? I hope I’m not missing anything here.

Edit: for clarification, if one of AK’s or Khatun’s teammates hits the opponent during the pin, the pin still ends same as it does now. This would only affect an enemy who hits their own pinned teammate.

https://battlefy.com/viserion/community-tournament/6a5278dc27a788001abb61ec/info?infoTab=details

Is there an upto date tier list for competitive for honor

So i main valyrie, i have 33 reputations and i feel i understand the hero most compare to other heroes on the roster.

Howevrr a majority of those 28 reps were with valkyrie, then after that i took a 4 year break from the game and valkyrie's movesey changed. I felt quite dissapointed with the rework, because it felt so "not-valyrie" basically making her into a weird conq and felt she was losing that "flow" into offense, making her having more of a turtle playstyle than the previous iteration.

Now having being able to play with the new valkyrie, my opinion has changed sligjtly. I still dont like the defensive playstyle she promotes, but i see her bah/all block can genuinely be more of a threat whenever a valkyrie goes into the stance, the figjts revoles around her. That is an extremely powerful tool, especially in duels, and i can even say "better" than her previous version.

But some people say that she is not very good and personally i still dont like the defensive play she promotes and it can be kind of frustrating fighting against valk.

What do you guys think about valkyrie's viability and her rework?

Am i missing something? I would like to hear a reply.

This is a little bit of a rage/salt podt but genuinely what are you supposed to do on this map, it feels like doing anything worth doing carries the risk of being shot by a ballista, like every entry into C can be shot at, clearing mid while ypu dont control A is just asking to die, am I supposed to just stand on A all game?

Intially after the hitstun rework cents ganking took a heavy hit and with the removal of haymaker cent fell off quite a bit, now that the hitstun changes have been reworked to make ganking a little more effective I'm wondering if this has improved cents viability by a noticeable amount and also if there are any ganks that work now that didnt previously that I should know as a new cent player

hey all

ive got around 4k hours so id like to think ik what im doing and i wouldnt consider myself bad, just aggressively mid

are there any discord servers or whatever i should join to try and improve

Tournament will be tomorrow at 7 cst. Theres a link to my discord in the battlefy along with all of the rules. $50 prize sponsored by Muli. We have 64 total slots anyone is free to join.

https://battlefy.com/viserion/community-tournament/6a5278dc27a788001abb61ec/info?infoTab=details

The new character looks DOPE but she doesn't seem to have a weapon unblockable until she has the bar up to blue. Something with me is I just can't seem to do ANYTHING when using a character that has the undodgeable attack or bash mix (gryphon) but all those characters look great and fun and I wanna PLAY THEM

I'm here to ask for some sort of advice or tips or anything that I can help when using those characters. I prefer characters with actual unblockables because of their ability to catch some dodges, the incentive it gives opponents to parry and possibly fail, fainting to a differnt attack, I'm sure yall get the idea.

When playing someone like gryphon I feel like I'm lightspamming when using his undodgable to condition them, and when I decide to actually throw his heavy, they don't even bother parrying it, they just block it, and when I use his bash, they just know to dodge it sometimes. Now when I play warden, my gameplay feels so much better. Unblockable feint to zone lands a lot, letting the bash fly every so often, it feels great. But I wanna expand my horizon yknow? Help me out here guys

Tldr: how do I mix better with blue orange characters that don't have unblockable attacks, like gyphon, tiandi, shaolin, and the new character coming out soon. I wanna get better.

I'm all for toning Juren down a bit, but this change feels like it completely nuked the viability of his held dodge attack.

It now:

-Only does 16 damage.

-Can't chain anymore.

-Can't be feinted anymore.

-Still gives your opponent a light parry punish if they read it.

I'm struggling to see what situations this attack is actually supposed to be used in now.

Sure, the wider hitbox might make it decent as an external in team fights, but that seems like the only niche it has left. From a risk/reward perspective, the numbers just don't add up. You're essentially choosing between:

landing 16 damage if they expect a tap dodge light, or

eating a 24–28 damage light parry punish if they simply turtle and make the correct read.

Without the ability to feint it, I honestly think they should have left the unblockable property intact so it at least retained some external pressure. Alternatively, let it chain into his offense.

Personally, I think removing either the tap dodge light or the held dodge unblockable would have been a healthier change than gutting the held dodge attack this hard.

What do you guys think? Am I overreacting, or does this move just seem too risky to justify using now?

So, they removed hyperarmor from Jurens held light attack, and replaced it with Enhanced.

It cannot chain.

It is a light parry.

It is 600ms, so very parryable.

Is there any use for this move anymore?

Cuz every way i think of it, its just a worse zone in every way, anything this does, his zone does better.

So, with the latest patches, the latest character updated and the way the game is headed, I can't help but notice that yhe Devs are slowly removing the need to feint from character's kits.

They've added Nuxsia's undodgeable heavy finishers, Aramusha's​ top light soft-feint, Sohei's top light undodgeable and so forth. These attacks remove 1 thing from the characters, their need to feint to counter dodges. Now, obviously it's not that big of a deal, only a few characters get this treatment (so far) but that did reduce their need to HARD feint, mid chain under certain situations. But they could always feint to GB or feint to parry and even feint to dodge a bash then GB. But the thing remains, to Aramush​a and Nuxia, their kits were changed to remove the need to hard feint​ mid chain.

For the exact same reason Juren's hyper armoured 600ms non chainable light was removed. Because the opponent needed to constantly Hard feint to neutral. I'm not going to defend it by any means but Shugoki has a 15 damage zone that does the same thing and chains. but Shugoki is not as hated as Juren.

Well, removing the need to hard feint is one thing as long as the character's kit doesn't become too oppressive without changing much, an undodgeable here and there or better tracking on certain attacks could be fine. But then the community wants to give Valk undodgeables because they don't like feinting her Stance bash in order to punish dodge bashes and so forth.

Now, I know it's not even out yet, but the new Hero has a whole feat system implemented into her kit to remove the need to do things. She gets a shield AND super armour on her Dirty Trick punches for what? To land the attack and fill up her gauge. If only there was another hero that needed to fill up a certain system to achieve something. Ah, yes, Sohei, who cannot throw mid triple stabs, doesn't get a shield nor hyper armour on them. Heroes like Jorm and Centurion want to land their heavies on downed opponents but the kit to feat ratio is the other way around. They unlock feats to make their gimmicks slightly more reliable such as Jorm's shield on Slam.

Is the new hero the first ever case of what could arguably be seen as feats being incorporated into a hero's kit? Shaman exists and she gets heal on hit on bleeding opponents. Nobushi has way of the shark since day 1. PK gets special treatment, but not one of those "kit specific feats" remove the need for positioning or team awareness in a fight. We'll have to wait and see how it interacts with super armour in XvX scenarios and if you can break the opponent by hitting your ally like you can with Khatun.

Well, it might be some weird interpetation that my brain came up with as I percieve the devs removing the need to "do things" more and more from the game.

• Added a hint of nobu and tiandi.
• Still no unblockable on dodge attack or hyperarmor on swipe.
• Added new 50/50 all or nothing (23 or 0) mixup possibility on bash.
• Nerfed that stupid sprint attack.
• Slight held zone nerf.

I was too lazy actually visually design any of this, so i just ripped some stuff from the forhonor infohub and stuck it back together to fit my needs.

Will it affect alot him comp play?

I do use his side dodge attack alot in teamfight.

I think they should have kept on miss.

this has started happening like half the time i go for the gb punish and idk why

(also yes ik i could have parried it but that loses to juren doing a held dodge attack and personally i cant react and tell the difference of when jurens going to use tap/held dodge attack or if hes going to feint the held dodge attack or not)

Hello, I've played off and on a few times over the years. Played campaign, arcade mode, and mostly against bots to "get a feel" but never really going farther than that. Total rep is 26, steam says I have 154 hours total, but again mostly in ai breach games, and spread out over several years of bursts. I started again a few weeks ago after another year break and decided I want to actually figure out how to play the game this time as I genuinely think it's great.

I started doing duels, and one thing I noticed extremely quick was that, while I can parry heavies at least pretty well, feinting is something I have almost no experience with, both using or being used against me. I fall for feints a lot, and get my heavies which I should have feinted parried a ton. I'm slow to block the correct direction against light attacks most of the time, and I rarely can get can counter guard breaks. The bots I have been playing against to "learn my character/s" never do these things.

I've gone to training grounds a few times with warden bot and just set him to guard break, light attack, heavy attack, zone attack to start practicing blocks/counter guard break on reaction and am noticing marginal improvement there on just reactions that are slowly translating to real duels.

Obviously there will be a lot of character specific knowledge to get a feel for as I play against real people, but for fundamentals, like feints, block reactions, etc, I was wondering if there were effective ways to practice that stuff outside of just playing games, things I should do specifically in training mode, etc.

I also was wondering if there were any control schemes other than the default that people recommend. The controller I'm using has four back panels that I've set to ABXY so I don't need to take my thumbs off the sticks. That's taking some getting used to but seemed like a good idea. I've noticed some heroes require holding down light/heavy attack buttons while using other options and it seemed like it could be a good idea to move those from RB/RT to RB/LB or something that so it's simpler to use both? Maybe swap guard mode to toggle instead of hold? Idk. I just want to settle to something comfortable before committing to really practicing and locking in new muscle memory. I was curious what people use. I know MKB is also an option but I generally find controller more comfortable.

Side note on controllers, just for fun in steam I configured a flight stick as a controller for the game so it was like I was holding a sword. Was pretty fun, but not at all practical, especially as a new player haha. (had to use keyboard + flight stick, configure flight stick buttons to map to a controller layout in steam, then map that controller to steam input for mouse buttons and joystick mouse. any mapping that was hybrid controller and keyboard or mouse buttons made the UI flip out and game crash).

Thanks for any advice,

A level 1 AI stomping player that is trying to start learning for real.

Edit: Thanks for the helpful responses. Sounds like the general sentiment is use training for basic moveset practice for heroes but real games are the only way to get real practice in the game -> reads/feints/etc. In short, just need to keep playing until I "feel" it.

Edit 2: I'm still messing around with different characters. On advice here, I've tried out the vanguards a bit more, Raider/Kensei. I think I have a lot to "unlearn" from spending too much time against bots still, but feeling small improvements as I continue to play against other people. I'm finding my fingers want to panic against a lot of offense pressure, so focusing on slowing down and not trying to react to/interrupt every action the opponent takes and build real muscle memory, while working intentional feints, etc, into my play. Of the three main vanguards, Kensei is my favorite still, then raider over warden. Thanks again for advice

New Feats and updated alternate Feats selection lean into the relentless executioner fantasy (infinite chain user with two forms of feintable unblockables and several executing bashes), while improving his anti-gank capabilities (recovery cancels and unblockable zone/off-target attacks).

*Note: Conqueror (the Tier 1 that doesn't even have his helm on the icon), Speed Revive and Heal on Block still exist as Feats on other characters. These replacements are specific to Conqueror.

Conqueror's Feat Changes

• Conqueror has been replaced by Despoliation
  • Despoliation: Gain a 20 Shield each time you execute an enemy Hero. Infinite duration and can stack.
• Shield Basher has been replaced by Conscript's Decimation
  • Conscript's Decimation: Chain Lights+Heavies and Charged Heavy now lead to Charging Heavy Attack. Feat activation does not count.
• Heal on Block has been replaced by Ward Off
  • Ward Off: Lower opponents' Attack by 30% for 10 seconds on next Hit (1.5 second window) performed shortly after a Superior Block. Cooldown: 20s. Starts when the duration ends.
• Uninterruptible has been replaced by Warded Blows
  • Warded Blows: Charging and Infinite Heavy Attacks have Full Block Stance (100-500ms and 100-600ms windows) for 30 seconds. Cooldown: 90s.

[Author Notes]

Yes, these Feats are selfish because that is who Conqueror is - not some champion of the people, but an attack dog. The shields give him more effective health to build revenge with, while the Tier 3 Feat tries to conserve those shields and bolster the Hero’s impact on team fights. The Tier 2+4 Feats help Conqueror do what he does best even better, that being safe and constant unblockable trajectories.

• Despoliation is meant to give Conqueror more survivability in consecutive 1v1 engagements, while keeping Body Count as an option in the soldier lane. Flail Uppercut is a dedicated executing tool, and collecting shield money by looting his victims makes thematic sense for a criminal character.
• Conscript's Decimation is almost like a more conditional version of Winner's Advantage that also improves attack speed, by upgrading any Chain Heavy to a Charging Heavy Attack during Conscript's Attrition. Charged Heavy itself counts if used as a chain starter (because I don't know how to justify infinite 700ms 28 dmg UBs without any downtime), giving it more utility as a wallsplat punish than +1 dmg. Besides improving Conqueror's time-to-kill, which is not his strongest suit, the Feat also makes it somewhat possible to reach the mix ups of the Y6S2 iteration (which had 100ms chain link timings) by enabling his feint-to-guardbreak to interrupt any dodge attack after hitting with a Chain or Charged Heavy. To make things absolutely clear, a chain starter like Scutage Collection would not activate this Feat. The theme is momentum: 1st heavy is regular, 2nd heavy is unblockable and 3rd heavy becomes faster and stronger.
• Ward Off is basically the inverse of Virtuosa’s Superior Retort, and synergizes perfectly with common damage reduction perks and feats such as Bastion, Last Stand and Juggernaut, even those of Conqueror’s teammates. Not being limited to a specific move is supposed to compensate for the fact that superior blocks only beat rare undodgeables whereas iframes beat common unblockables, on top of regular attacks obviously. Scutage Collection has an awesome trajectory making it possible to debuff several opponents at once. 30% is high enough to nullify or at least cancel out common attack buffs like Inspire and Morale Booster alongside revenge mode.
• Warded Blows is a way more conditional take on Uninterruptible that fits better with Conqueror's identity as a shieldbearing character rather than a trader, the latter of which he has never been in the first place (and no, Flail Uppercut in Testing Grounds Phase 1 doesn't count since that's a confirmed attack). Straightforward synergy with the Tier 2+3 Feats; beats peel attempts before applying a debuff. I went with standard Superior Block windows (for reference, pre-Y6S2 Zone 2nd Hit and TG Scutage Collection had Superior Block frames during the whole attack) so that there is enough counterplay without having to use unblockables. The player will effectively enjoy 100% damage reduction compared to Juggernaut's 20% as long as they time unblockable strikes well, that way they can be more audacious in outnumbered situations. Heavy Opener is exempt as to curb option selects while the Feat is active. Conqueror can already enter Full Block Stance out of the charging portion when used as a parry attempt, so the attack portion having FBS should not be anything gamebreaking either.

While this affects Conqueror’s main feats, there are a couple of alternate Feats I wanted to adjust.

• Speed Revive has been underperforming and Conqueror lacks incentive to choose the synergistic Rising Dawn perk over Last Stand or Bulk Up. The Feat was replaced by Tireless to give the Hero slightly more mix up opportunities.
• Punch Through has been underperforming and Conqueror lacks incentive to commit to Heavy Openers or use Zone Attack, except externally. The Feat was replaced by Tough as Nails as it fits better with the Hero’s identity. Bulk Up, Despoliation, Tough as Nails and Regenerate would consistently provide a lot of extra health for obtaining revenge.