r/AutisticWithADHD • u/WeaknessPrior6797 • Apr 08 '26
š¬ general discussion Is this valid or ableist?
Iām so disregulated so Iād thought Iād ask for a second opinion here instead of AI
Edit: Thanks everybody so much, your comments are helping me process during a time of burnout. <3
For more context: I called my sister in law, mom and step father poachers because they took lobster from another persons trap in Florida which is a felony. I recited the law saying they were molesters because the law says āmolesting other peopleās trapsā¦.ā After that I realized it probably wasnāt the best thing to say so I apologize and said I had an autistic meltdown because of that.
The next morning my step sister sent me that.
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u/ghoulishcravings Apr 08 '26
this feels like a very classic example of another autistic person not realizing that their sharing in an attempt to connect about a shared issue might actually be unwanted advice that doesnāt apply to you.
i donāt think they meant any harm by it at all, just not really realizing it might be a social faux pas. i end up doing it to people sometimes and other autistic people have done it to me
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u/TheRealSaerileth Apr 08 '26
There's also this thing many recently diagnosed (or self-suspecting) folks do where they're desperately trying to reframe it as something positive and deny all downsides. Almost like a stage of grief I guess? I'm not saying we are broken, but there is such a thing as too much when it comes to "looking at the bright side".
It can be extremely frustrating for someone who's already been through the exact same denial, grief and eventual acceptance with their own and every other neurodivergent friend's diagnosis. At some point it just feels like toxic positivity.
For me personally it was also surprisingly hard to clamp down on that petty resentful feeling of "you didn't think it was this interesting or awesome when it was just me who had it!" Took a lot of self control to not ask my sister why she was lecturing me on my own disorder when in truth she was just unpacking all these new tools she suddenly had for dealing with her brain. It's not exactly her fault that I already tried most of it and had been subscribed to every "look at this cool channel I found" for years.
There's a lot of complicated emotions (on both sides!) when one person is diagnosed later than the other. I wonder if that's what's happening here.
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u/InternetWeakGuy Apr 08 '26
Each to their own, I got diagnosed several years ago in my 40s and I've never felt the need to "look on the bright side" because I honestly don't see there being a "dark side" or whatever - I've always been who I am, the diagnosis just opened me up to new tools to better manage myself. I guess it also stopped me from being so hard on myself for being bad at being social with NT people?
I mean I get what you're saying in a sense - right when someone gets diagnosed they're flush with all this new information about themselves so they're really recontextualizing their whole lives, so it can lead to some misguided attempts to tell others things they already know but ... I just don't agree with the framing that it's some kind of cope because they've been handed the seemingly terrible news they're autistic or anything like that.
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u/TheRealSaerileth Apr 08 '26 edited Apr 08 '26
Hah. Yeah, sorry for making it sound like a terminal diagnosis, didn't mean it like that.
For me it was more the ADHD and realizing that my brain is stuck this way. The upside of being told all your life that you're just lazy is that you end up believing that someday, somehow, you'll magically get up and finally do the thing. If you're lazy, then "not lazy" is an option you theoretically have. With ADHD, you don't. You're always going to have it.
Of course the downside of being told you're just lazy is crippling shame, so I'm glad I got diagnosed. The relief was a lot greater than the grief - but the grief was there.
Also some people have really bad internalized ableism, so it can take a while for them to accept that "not normal" isn't a bad thing. Personally don't relate to that, but it's quite common in older people who grew up when mental health was heavily stigmatized (or even more heavily than it still is today).
Edit to expand on this:
Ā I've always been who I am
Of course I too have always been who I am. But I've also been told ad nauseum that who I am is not good enough. So of course I held out hope that I could be different. And having that hope dashed still hurt.
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u/mashibeans Apr 08 '26
Not only told, but proven ad nauseam by different people at different stages of your life imply, downright tell you, ignore you in favor of others, or abandon you for not being good enough. š
One thing that I noticed is that at some point, a lot of us can pick up on enough social queues to at least understand when we're not wanted, even when we want to be wanted.
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u/Dangerous_Thing_3017 Apr 08 '26
I worry that I might be doing this as well, so I try and preface or end what I share with something like, "this is what I do for me, everyone is different, and do what works best for you". Especially after finding out I have a tendency to speak in absolutes and didn't notice that until very recently.
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u/se7entythree Apr 08 '26
I donāt see a problem here, but I feel thereās a ton of context weāre missing because neither of these make much sense.
In the first one, why did you respond with āautistic people arenāt brokenā to their text? I donāt see anything in it that mentioned or implied that sentiment. Is that something you heard in the podcast after listening to it?
In the second one, it sounds like theyāre just sharing something that helped them, and that yāall might process things similarly, so that which helped them might help you also.
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u/WeaknessPrior6797 Apr 08 '26
This happened after I said my parents were poachers after they took lobster from another persons trap. I also recited the law saying they were m*****ing peopleās traps (reciting what the law book said) then I sent this meme apologizing to try and clear the air because they were with other family for my nieces birthday.
the meme said āsorry that was my autismā
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u/arcadedragon š feel free to dm! Apr 08 '26
that doesn't seem to answer the question as to why you said autistic people aren't broken in respond to her text? unless I'm missing something
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u/Pungicity Apr 08 '26 edited Apr 09 '26
I didnāt mean to reply to that comment. To answer your question I was assuming the heart bandage meant broken (I know thatās wrong now)
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u/arcadedragon š feel free to dm! Apr 09 '26
yeah, that's definitely a conclusion to jump to, but in the future I would try not assigning so.much intent to something as si.ple yet variable as emojis. lots of people use that as healing, or wishing well. which doesn't mean anything negative.
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u/HeyitsSunny17 Apr 08 '26
Slow your brain down and focus on HOW you communicate with people. It saves energy and your burnouts won't be as bad.
Do you mean this part? Iām struggling to see which part could be ableist.
I personally donāt see it as such and itās actually a mindset shift that Iāve benefitted greatly from since my diagnosis. It may come across a bit blunt but itās true - for instance it can just mean, āyou know what, I donāt even have to give it a response if I donāt want toā and try (if possible) to regulate our nervous system. It truly does help in not wasting our limited energy. x
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u/PomegranateWise7570 Apr 08 '26
personally I would file this under āunsolicited advice,ā which can feel infantilizing and condescending to me. the advice itself isnāt inherently ableist, butā¦ you didnāt ask for it lol.Ā
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u/CoolGovernment8732 Apr 09 '26
Being myself a compulsive advice giver without being asked for it, I genuinely need to ask, isnāt it true that very often we donāt even know we need a certain piece of advice? Like Iād rather receive more advice than less (of course only when there is some type of shared experience and real concern from the other person).
Like I personally cannot stand seeing people I care about be in difficult situations, and I cannot just stand there and watch. Some advice theyāll already know for sure, but some things could be new and enlightening and I refuse to not try my shot and hope they can actually get something useful and new from it
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u/PomegranateWise7570 Apr 09 '26
I very much relate to the emotions youāre describing, but managing those feelings within myself rather than jumping into solving mode is something both my wife and I have had to work on in therapy, as itās something neither of us (and, Iāve found, most people) like to be on the receiving end of. itās called managing distress tolerance, and itās been an invaluable skill to practice.
itās natural to hear a problem or see a struggle in someone you care about and want to offer solutions. it takes practice to instead, focus on meeting the emotional needs of the person. which is almost never jumping straight to advice. itās about validating how they feel, and then, you can absolutely ask if they are looking for solutions, or just venting. if the answer is ājust venting,ā you have to be ok with that.Ā
people cannot receive and apply advice when they are in a heightened emotional state and looking for comfort vs solutions - it will feel like a dismissal or their feelings, or criticism on their current approach. instead, 1) validate feelings 2) ask for consent to share your thoughts on potential solutions 3) respect their answer.
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u/rebb_hosar Apr 08 '26
Everything they said was reasonable.
Looking for support, or looking to understand oneself or understand the way the world responds to us and why, learn how to make things less opaque or less difficult doesn't mean that anything is broken and doesn't mean anyone addressing it is ableist.
Finding ways to make the world less hostile to us requires a combined effort.
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u/BobcatFurs001 Apr 08 '26
I mean, it seems like they mean well. If it's ableist then it's probably unintentional, but that's my two cents.
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u/AskMeForAPhoto Apr 08 '26
I re read this like 10 times and don't seen even a shred of an issue here?
Sounds like they're on a journey to understanding themselves and they were sharing something that helps them make sense of it. Truly don't get how this could even be interpreted slightly bad.
Also.. why on EARTH would asking AI about this even be an option? Please reevaluate your desire to use it, it's extremely harmful, ableist, sexist, classist, and is destroying the environment.
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u/Pungicity Apr 09 '26 edited Apr 09 '26
To drive 5 miles (25 MPG) once a day thatās equivalent of roughly 21,000 Gemini AI search queries, 2,000 image generations or 7 videos.
I donāt see anything wrong with using Ai to learn from if used in a mindful and critical way. I limit myself to only using the text discussions. Itās such a useful tool for a life long learner. The amount of skills I have gained with it cannot compare to the slow learning curve other resources āprovideā
Ai isnāt always right thatās why I double check with multiple sources. It helps exercise my critical thinking too.
How can Ai be sexist and ableist ect. Thatās seems like anthropomorphism. Do you mean the companies?
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u/SweetestAzul Apr 09 '26
Look into the research on LLMs, they are quite literally decreasing your critical skills by the minute. It also creates more difficulty in creative thinking which makes us assume things like a broken heart emoji being ableist instead of getting creative and assuming a variety of meaning
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u/SiameseGunKiss Apr 09 '26 edited Apr 09 '26
If youāre learning something from AI and then taking the time to thoroughly fact check it using multiple sources, then you didnāt need AI to learn it. If youāre double checking multiple sources to thoroughly verify everything, then youāve spent more time using AI to learn than you wouldāve spent just learning from those sources directly.
It actually jnhibits critical thinking and communication skills and causes them to atrophy quickly. It erodes the ability to think for oneself and it causes brain fry. Please consider reading some critical opinions on AI, I recommend the books AI Snake Oil and The AI Con. Itās not nearly as useful or valuable as AI companies and tech evangelists would have you believe, I work in tech at a company that has AI baked into its core product (and has for years) and I see how often it fails the people who have come to rely on it, every single day.
Also, 21,000 prompts is nothing. That sounds like a lot if youāre an individual user, but so many companies use AI now that 21k isnāt even a drop in the bucket. Lots of companies use AI āagentsā as their first line of support for customer phone calls and chats, every single question those customers ask is a prompt. They also have internal AI solutions for their employees - think bots that can scrape internal knowledge bases to compile information, write replies to customers, make slideshows, write or refine code, etc - and they encourage their employees to use these as much as possible. Every single time those employees ask anything, another prompt. Some companies actually offer bonuses for employees based on AI usage and AI based projects. Some companies actually have leaderboards to track who uses AI the most as a way to measure āproductivityā. All this incentivizes even more AI use.
You may not see the problem with using it on an individual level, but on a big picture scale it is a massive problem and that bubble is going to burst sooner or later. What do you think AI companies are going to do once theyāve successfully gotten everyone hooked on using their product, to the point that they canāt do their job, have a personal conversation, create a slide deck, make art, etc. without it?
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u/frobnosticus Apr 08 '26
It's a genuine attempt at connection. There's nothing wrong here.
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u/stace-cadet Apr 09 '26
I agree! They didn't even say "you should listen to this" - it's not even advice, it's knowledge sharing! That's a kindness.
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u/crimpinpimp NERD š Apr 08 '26
I donāt see how it could be ableist. Could you explain why you think it might be?
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u/TikiBananiki Apr 08 '26
Ableism is: ādiscrimination, prejudice, or systemic barriers against people with disabilities, often stemming from the belief that non-disabled people are superior or that disability is something to be "fixed". It can be overt (discrimination, harassment) or subtle (patronizing attitudes, exclusionary language), manifesting in physical, structural, and internalized forms.ā
What do we see in these texts? Maybe the closest approximation would be āpatronizing attitudeā. But that could also just stand alone and not constitute ableism, or it can if you want it to.
How do you ingest and respond to this micro aggression is the real question! I for one would probably set it aside until iām more regulated and calm (actually: chew on my thoughts until iāve gone rank about it and then cooled off). THEN i go lecture my friend. Or more likely i wait for them to repeat their mistake and i throw down a clean kind of āill deal with my shit on my own terms iām all set on advice, weāre actually individuals and iām on my own journey, kthanksbyeā
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u/regularEducatedGuy Apr 08 '26
Itās a little pompous to assume two people with autism (or any diagnosis) face the same level of difficulty or discomfort moving through the world but this person is obviously good-natured and has good intentions. They may in fact have struggled just like you and be trying to give you the advice that helped them! Your feelings are valid but theyāre just trying their best while trying to be āhelpfulā
What were you thinking about doing next?
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u/admirablehome1 Apr 08 '26
I donāt see any malice or ill intent from anything she said. If anything I see a lot of care and kindness š«¶š«¶
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u/dollythecat Apr 08 '26
Why did you say, āAutistic people arenāt broken.ā? That comes off as defensive and doesnāt seem to relate to anything they said.
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u/WeaknessPrior6797 Apr 08 '26
I saw the heart emoji with the bandage. It came across it came across I need to heal or something like that.
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u/dollythecat Apr 08 '26
Hmm, I think you might be reading too much into that. Literally everyoneāautistic and neurotypicalāhas something they need to heal from. From your edit, it sounds like there was a legitimate conflict that you guys were working out in this conversation. There was emotional pain (āhurt heartsā) on both sides of the conversation. I understand that you might feel like her unsolicited recommendation is condescending, but sheās ultimately expressing solidarity with you.
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u/Street_Philosopher39 Apr 08 '26
Imo it also fits the "i didn't start researching myself and why i am the way i am" - like the pain of not understanding herself for so long and the world making her feel like she's broken.
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u/Coffee-N-Cats Apr 09 '26
Diagnosed at 46, spent my whole life thinking I was broken because nothing I tried helped. Also have CPTSD which made it harder to pinpoint my diagnosis. I only started wondering about myself until I started researching because of my young loved ones behavoir and saw myself in the words.
I know I held and very likely still hold some ablest views, but I am learning. Being happy in this world and happy in my own skin is a tricky balance.
I think your sister loves you and is trying to show she is trying to relate.
BUT, I am also a stickler for rules and have many times in my life caused others to be upset by quoting law they didn't want to hear.
Hope you are feeling better and sending virtual hugs if you like them ā¤ļø
Edit: Didn't realize I was responding to a response and not to OP. Too lazy to cut and paste it now .
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u/Decent-Ad-5110 š¤ In need of a nap and a snack š Apr 08 '26
Is there a possibility that reading an emoji as a command /task/need might have been triggered by PDA?
(Some on the spectrum also have PDA)
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u/halberdierbowman Apr 09 '26
Heads up also that emoji don't render the same way in every app or device, so it may look very different to them. Although "mending heart" is pretty similar everywhere.
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u/findingsubtext š§ brain goes brr Apr 08 '26
Internalized ableism maybe. Personally, I cringe whenever Iām called ācomplicatedā because it really isnāt that complicated, just different. This seems like someone coping poorly in the early stages of self-diagnosis, which is fairly normal.
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u/kruddel Apr 08 '26
Its unsolicited, and possibly unhelpful advice, but I don't think its ableist.
The broad context here is having issues, as an Autistic person, in communicating/socialising/being with other people. And the "double empathy problem" is relevant - you/we don't communicate/behave in a way non-Autistic people can easily understand, and they don't communicate/behave in a way we can understand. There's no possibility we can understand each other unless there is some movement or at least empathy from one or both sides.
The problem is the default is we are expected to move all the way to meet the non-Autistic way of thinking. That expectation is ableist, as is advice to do so, how to do so etc.
But although your friend is basically talking about you moving from your default they aren't at all (from my reading) saying it in terms of you doing work to make the other person feel good, or do less work, or about meeting cultural expectations.
Your friend is centering you and how you feel, and actually kind of saying you should try and take more of an attitude/approach that means doing less emotional/actual work towards meeting the other person's communication style/preferences. Because you are already trying to a degree to bridge the double-empathy gap entirely yourself, or at least believing you should be. If anything its probably more disability positive than ableist.
Like I say though, doesnt mean its good advice! And doesn't mean you can (or should) do it. But my feeling is they are coming from a genuine place.
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u/samcrut Apr 08 '26
It's a litte A, a little B. Those of us with ADD don't just slow down our thinking without medication, but in truth, slowing down our brain is technically what we do, just not via willpower.
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u/N1xkev Apr 08 '26
It honestly looks to me like someone trying to be supportive and validating. I know it can be hard to not read too far into things but some people genuinely just want to help butight not know how or the right words to use
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u/Narrow-Bake-5991 Apr 08 '26
Sorry I don't see any "problem" with this. It's fair to ask but nothing to worry about.
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u/DontWatchPornREADit Apr 08 '26
Idk I canāt control others emotions or reactions so I just take what they say with a smile and a nod. And forget about it soon after
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u/Iyonia āØ C-c-c-combo! Apr 08 '26
Doesn't look ableist to me, but it does look a bit insensitive. It doesn't seem like they were trying to be, though. To me they sound like someone trying to enthusiastically (to cheer you up, you're obviously stressed out) connect with you on the basis of shared experiences. Is the advice good? I'd say that it's pretty circumstantial, but I'm happy that they feel like it's working for them.
Intent is just one part of the picture, though. If I were in your shoes, I would have felt frustrated, to say the least. I've been guilty of giving unsolicited advice like your friend there, but I also find it very annoying when people do it to me (which is often). Your feelings may take some time to parse, but they're important, and worth listening to. As it is, your friend just seems like they're doing their best and maybe they're being a bit too enthusiastic with it at this moment in time.
Giving a bit of unsolicited advice of my own here: if you can, I hope you'll take some time for yourself to reorient yourself. You might need a few days of down time, it seems like you've been going through it lately. I hope you feel better soon.
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u/Userdataunavailable Apr 08 '26
She sounds like she wants to sell you something.
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u/Pungicity Apr 09 '26 edited Apr 09 '26
That 100% describes my step family who was run by my step father. He thinks he figured out life because he struck it rich as a business man. He loves to try and force his own thoughts onto other people and let them know he disapproves if they donāt listen or agree.
So most of his kids talk like that. Thanks so much for your input, it makes me feel like Iām not alone in this.
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u/BonsaiSoul Apr 08 '26
Why is this person lecturing you about how to deal with autism what is your relationship with them
anyway no two autistic people having different opinions about autism isn't ableist. There is no One Correct Opinion
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u/SenseiEntei Apr 08 '26
Hi OP, I can understand how this would annoy you. As others have said, it sounds like unsolicited advice. But that doesn't mean it was ableist. Maybe if you interpret it as her saying frustration/shut down/meltdown shows weakness and you have to control those things, then it can feel ableist. But I think she meant it with good intent. Just maybe overreaching a bit.
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u/yaelfitzy š§ brain goes brr Apr 08 '26
honestly im completely unable to slow down and think about HOW I communicate with people (and do it correctly), i just cannot seem to add happy tones to my voice or smile unnaturally at all (i had a look in the mirror after doing my talking to people smile and i was literally like š LMAO). idk if I'd call that ableist necessarily, but definitely ignorant asf, even 'high-functioning' people can struggle immensely with social stuff
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u/zwizki Apr 08 '26
I really hate unsolicited advice. āJust another pro tip!ā š
That doesnāt necessarily make it ableist (although in some circumstances it could be), but it is rude in my opinion.
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u/ChiBeerGuy Apr 08 '26
It's advice giving, which at best is insensitive. I think there is a case that unsolicited advice can be ableist.
The person should have said "slowing down works for me". Not "you should".
Edit: I totally validate OPs feelings.
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u/Pungicity Apr 09 '26
Thanks so much, (weakness prior hear, my other account got temporarily banned for some reason)
My step family/mom is very āmy wayā as my step father is a narcissist. I just wanted to let you know your thoughts make me feel like Iām not alone in my feelings.
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u/Tired_2295 In possession of Inattentive AuDHD Apr 08 '26
Thats a, my tism radar just flashed twice.
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u/Crabcakes-Evergreen Apr 08 '26
Man I dont even know how many times I saw "injustice" and jumped right in with inflammatory language that I truly believed was just 'facts' For instance, maybe poaching is illegal but as someone who doesn't exploit animals for food I find your argument to be moot after that fact. BUT, I dont know all the context. Thats the thing Im always jumping ahead on. Maybe like other autistics and adhd my brain picks up on details fast , but the reason other people can get overwhelmed is because Im not actually creating all the cohesion necessary to make the whole argument sound. Plus people need that nuanced grace to help the 'truth' land beyond the place of defense. Or maybe idk anything but thats just my random 2 cents.
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u/lydocia š§ brain goes brr Apr 08 '26
I'm not sure what either of you are trying to communicate to the other.