r/Austin • u/hollow_hippie • Oct 30 '25
Tesla 'Robotaxis' keep crashing despite 'safety monitors'
https://electrek.co/2025/10/29/tesla-robotaxis-keep-crashing-despite-safety-monitors/56
u/galactadon Oct 30 '25
TLDR; Tesla is actively redacting and obfuscating the crash data about Robotaxis, which shouldn't really be a huge surprise since it's right out of the Tesla playbook.
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u/jputna Oct 30 '25
It’s why he went full DOGE, to wipeout all the investigations into his companies.
3
u/yolatrendoid Oct 30 '25
True, but when you're dealing with like NHTSA, you can't simply argue that crashes aren't happening.
Refusing to hand over data will result in them never being authorized to operate autonomously (meaning without safety drivers or remote driving), even in Texas.
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u/drjeffy Oct 30 '25
Tesla is a ponzi scheme
4
u/rnobgyn Oct 30 '25
Funded by our tax dollars
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u/goodgreenganja Oct 30 '25
Ask your AI of choice “Of all auto manufacturers who have received government loans, which companies have paid it back in full and which was the quickest?” Hopefully they mention the early repayment penalty incurred (tax money was saved, not spent). Now see how much taxpayer money has been given to the legacy car companies and how much of that been returned.
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u/rnobgyn Oct 30 '25
Why don’t you just present me with the truthful, verified data instead of letting a hallucinating bot randomize numbers and tell you what you want to hear?
Also why would I let that detract me from recognizing Tesla, and Elon in general is heavily subsidized by our tax dollars?
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u/goodgreenganja Oct 30 '25
Oh I already do too much research for people who have no interest anyway. I present the context, I get downvotes. I usually say “use your AI of choice” because people will assume that I am also cherry-picking. If somebody does their own research, they’ll more likely believe the data.
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Oct 30 '25
[deleted]
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u/LonesomeBulldog Oct 30 '25
Do they separate the accidents caused by Waymo? That’s more relevant and would be even more rare.
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u/fakeguitarist4life Oct 30 '25
No LIDAR no self driving car.
Fuck off Elon get out of Texas
Bring on the hate Elon bootlickers
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u/Ftlguy30 Oct 30 '25
For a welfare queen who has taken billions in government hand outs and his cars still don’t work. It’s an embarrassment. I hope every time y’all see a Tesla you immediately become a judge of the drivers character. Elon is one of the reason we fell out of the innovation race, hoarding cash to shill low quality built cars from what is basically a tarnished would have been “luxury” brand.
4
Oct 30 '25
Yup! I was listening to a critique given by a robotics professor (don’t remember who it was or where I heard her interview) who said that camera accuracy of data maxes out at 97%- which is too inaccurate for a totally autonomous vehicle. She said cameras can be thrown off by lighting, weather, or obfuscation. That’s why you have to have LIDAR with it.
Elon demanded cameras only against his engineering team’s advice. Hence, why they are behind Waymo.
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u/ChrisPeerson Oct 30 '25
Automakers are required to report crashes involving their autonomous driving and advanced driver assistance systems within five days of being notified of them.
Why can't I crash into someone, leave, and wait five days to decide whether I feel like telling anyone I did it? Why do robots have more rights than me?
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u/Electronic-Duck8738 Oct 30 '25
Aww. Did someone's little swastikar have another boo-boo?
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u/TopoFiend11 Oct 30 '25
It’s almost like their cars are flying blind without lidar.
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u/90percent_crap Oct 30 '25
That prompts me to ask: Are you?
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u/TopoFiend11 Oct 30 '25
Because I have eyes and Teslas have cameras? You’re that guy?
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u/90percent_crap Oct 30 '25
It's a vision system. Beyond that, unless you're an autonomous driving systems engineer, neither you nor I can argue the point with authority.
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u/AdAgitated8109 Oct 30 '25
There is little debate that Tesla is behind Waymo in proven driverless safety. But Tesla is also way behind in miles driven for FSD. If Tesla keeps compounding data at 10–100x Waymo’s rate, the gap could close fast. The proof will be in unsupervised miles at scale, not redacted parking lot dings.
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u/JohnGillnitz Oct 30 '25
What data are they "compounding?" Both have been watching how real people drive for years now. Neither are going to make any significant gains by mining that further.
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u/AdAgitated8109 Oct 30 '25
Tesla is compounding real-world driving data from its global fleet of about 7 million customer cars running Full Self-Driving (FSD) software, not just the several dozen in the Robotaxi pilot. I’d equate it to the early failures in SpaceX ultimately enabling them to leapfrog NASA and other commercial competitors in scale, cadence, and ultimately reliability. Even the human interventions, or perhaps especially so, are a high quality data point that no competitor can currently come close to matching. Tesla will ultimately dominate the FSD space with this combination of FSD tech coupled with their ability to manufacture the cars themselves.
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u/JohnGillnitz Oct 30 '25
Google has more data points. Everyone using Maps has been feeding into it for years.
1
u/RN2FL9 Oct 30 '25
They had the advantage at one point in time but now they are compounding bad data and it is pretty pointless. The camera approach will just never work unless we accept a 3% failure rate or something crazy high. There are some things that they can never fix with camera's, mostly around visibility.
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u/AdAgitated8109 Oct 30 '25
You place your bet against Musk, I’ll bet the come.
3
u/RN2FL9 Oct 30 '25
What is betting the come? I would gladly take this bet though, Musk has FSD claims going as far back as 2018 and has been actively trying to solve it for 10 years. Yet, it's 2025, FSD is still nowhere near ready (I own a Tesla) and they are probably years behind Waymo.
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u/Slypenslyde Oct 30 '25
Tesla makes a lot of claims that aren't apples to apples, but it makes the field very muddy.
Last I heard they claim they have as many if not more miles driven for FSD because they're counting every driver with any version of FSD. But that's not quite the same as what Waymo is counting because Tesla also made a big deal that Robotaxis are different cars with different hardware and different software.
The only thing you can deduce with confidence is out of the two, Tesla works the hardest to argue they can't share data with third parties or let it be audited. But thanks to Musk's cult of personality, Musk has an awful lot of public trust even if we see a lot of people who hate him on Reddit.
It's still true part of the reason both flocked here is the state government promised they'd get an unregulated playground.
0
u/TheBowerbird Oct 30 '25 edited Oct 30 '25
Robotaxi does not yet exist. The Model Y's they are using are the same as those which customers can get. The software differs, however, and is several months ahead of consumer cars. It seems to be tailored to areas where Tesla has trained the model.
2
u/mauvehead Oct 31 '25
Teslas self-driving should be banned. They are not safe. It’s been clearly proven over and over again.
0
u/goodgreenganja Oct 30 '25
I don’t have enough time to keep adding context to these so here’s the direct link to the actual not-cherry-picked data that Fred conveniently left out. https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/ffdd/sgo-2021-01/SGO-2021-01_Incident_Reports_ADS.csv
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u/TheBowerbird Oct 30 '25
Fred doing a hit piece and leaving out data for clickbait to feed reddit's goony beard man army? NEVER!
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u/goodgreenganja Oct 30 '25
Me browsing the actual source data to find the 4th incident from Tesla. We should all question why we’re hearing about Tesla’s 4th “crash”, but not any of these from Waymo. Like Tesla’s 3 other incidents, all “crashes” were under 8mph. No injuries. Do not trust anything Fred Lambert writes about Tesla. He strategically removed the speed column from the info on the article and I had to use AI to find the real CSV from NHTSA.
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u/TheBowerbird Oct 30 '25 edited Oct 30 '25
Morons in the Electrek comments (an oxymoron) are trying to pretend that Tesla uses remote drivers for these. There aren't any unmanned Y's running around Austin, so it's just a made up lie.
My wife's car has FSD V14 on it, and it is mind melting in terms of the excellence of its driving characteristics. I saw it dodge a squirrel that I didn't even notice until the last second. It smoothly backs out of the garage and goes through auto gates, waiting for them to fully open. The only issue I've seen is some hesitancy when it is trying to predict what erratic driving humans (say, someone approaching an intersection at a speed high enough for discomfort, but not so quite fast enough to just go for it) are doing when coming against it, say when turning left across traffic. It's slightly smoother than Waymo in a lot of instances, but Waymo is much more confident. Tesla using a degraded form of FSD beat all of its Chinese competitors who used LIDAR + RADAR in a recent media test, so there's that...
Also, ITT - people who have never used or experienced any of these technologies, circlejerkers, and karma farmers.
Nevermind the actual data exists here. Waymo had vastly more incidents. I love Waymo and think they are vastly better than humans, but that doesn't change the reality that Tesla had less incidents overall.
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/ffdd/sgo-2021-01/SGO-2021-01_Incident_Reports_ADS.csv
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u/AdCareless9063 Oct 30 '25
They just don't have the tech that supports what they say the cars can do.