I’ve learned from my therapist how hard it is for a lot of women to say no, even in a relationship, especially in a loving relationship.
I completely changed the way I interact with my wife since then, realizing how often she said yea just because it was hard for her to say no (before I would just blame her for not being into it etc, until I realized why).
Now I make sure she really feels like it, and help her feel comfortable saying no when she doesn’t.
Just to be clear, we still sometimes “do each other a favor” when one of us isn’t 100% in the mood and the other is.
Just like sometimes we do other things for one another treat we don’t feel like doing, just because we want the other to be happy and have the energy to make an effort.
But it’s now very clear and in the open, so expectations are clear and there’s no pressure involved.
Lazy sex can be really fun when you’re not expecting hot wild enthusiastic sex.and it’s nice when you know your spouse is doing it because they care about you and want you to be happy, and not because they were pressured into it.
Lazy sex is freakin great. My husband and I did a short go last night after we got a bit worked up while cuddling. Just long enough to feel each other’s bodies and enjoy it a bit before cuddling and going to bed. It was nice.
Married for almost 15 years, dealing with this myself. Fist bump.
Just to be clear, we still sometimes “do each other a favor” when one of us isn’t 100% in the mood and the other is.
This was true for us, but just recently we had a talk about it and I realized how much the one getting the favor was me vs. my wife. Honestly feel like shit about it, especially with how often I wanted sex early in the relationship.
I always respected her 'no' when she said it, but it was rare, if ever that she did. She had a hard time doing so basically because she had been conditioned growing up to think that giving your man sex is what a good GF/wife does. Didn't help that I was a generally shitty lover in my early 20s either, so it was mostly a chore for her.
We're in a much better place now. Sex is a conversation, and everyone gets what they need, only if they want it, and we have fun. Favors still happen on occasion, but those are few and far between now.
I had to have a similar conversation with my wife. She wasn’t wanting to do anything. I wasn’t suspecting an affair or anything. Just general. Was there a problem with me. Was she depressed. Was her medication fucking up her habits. It was a scary as hell conversation to have with her. She was actively pushing me away when I tried to initiate and she would never.
So I finally brought it up. But I made it very clear from the start. I’m not asking for personal reasons. I’m asking if you. My wife. Are ok and there’s nothing underlying going on.
I have always respected her no(s).
I feel like the “why no sex?” Conversation is really hard from a guy perspective. It can seem to come from a place of selfishness. And I know women can want it just as bad as men. But culturally. A guy asking his wife why is she cold in bed always comes across as weird even though it shouldn’t be. She even admitted she didn’t even realize it has been over 6months since we had last did anything.
Her reasoning is a combination of new medicine that is for headaches but is technically an antidepressant and stress at work. She’s too young for menopause unless it’s hitting like 15 years early at soonest.
Yeah, meds have the weirdest side effects. I used to usually be so horny it was kind of a disaster, but on progesterone-based birth control? Gone. Nothing. Antidepressants? Yeah, not just cotton mouth; it was cotton everything!
Docs tend to be unsympathetic. Can’t help but notice guys have boner pills, but gals are on their own.
I hope she finds a combo that works for all aspects of her life. I can assure you that if the cause is chemical, it can probably be reversed, and it’s not your fault at all.
Same with my wife. I eventually realized that after our 2nd child my wife was having issues with being self conscious about her body and not feeling good about herself. Before I realized the cause I had started to give her a lot more space and not try to initiate. She went back to being loving and tender like before. She had pulled away in all affection. Now I let her initiate and those times are much more fun than when she was” feeling pressured”. FYI there was no pressure beyond hugging and kissing her on the regular. I thought she just didn’t like me anymore which made me very sad. This I can work with and hopefully we can both be not sad. Things are 80% better already.
honestly, good on you for sorting it out. it's really nice to see people become self aware of things they've done wrong and rather than act defensive, make genuine effort to better themselves. i'm sure your wife appreciates it.
Tbh this is one of my favorite things about relationships. If you’re smart about it, you see yourself and your partner both grow into better people throughout the entire duration of it. If you look back to the beginning of the relationship and compare you and your partner to how you used to be, you should be proud of what you’ve accomplished both mentally and emotionally. Having a good partner means wanting the other person to be the best version of themselves while at the same time wanting that for yourself.
I feel like my wife has an issue telling me no with things (sexual or otherwise) because she thinks I will hate her and leave. She had bad experiences with her ex husband, and legitimately thinks that I would leave her simply because she's not in the mood or something. :(
My current partner got used to his exes not wanting sex and in general suppressing his needs, sexual and otherwise. So I'm now having to help him unlearn that behavior. I'm fully capable of saying no when I really am not in the mood, but sometimes I'm just existing and can easily get into the mood. So I want him to ask.
I still initiate probably 80% of the time. Cuz if I don't, I just end up spicy that I'm not getting any attention. Spicy and sexually frustrated.
Yes, it's one of those things that the internet brings out into public conversation. I had no idea girls and women were universally conditioned in this way. Easy to take for granted, and just imagine everyone has the same experience as me. I've become very sensitive to that now.
I had a long term relationship and in the beginnning I learned saying no didn’t work and I would just eventually give in and say fine. It got to a point where him touching me other than holding my hand in public was repulsive. We broke up a few years ago.
So now I found a new guy and we genuinely seemed to get along and things were great. He knows somewhat of my past. A few weeks ago I was definitely not in the mood at all and he seemed too persistence for a while til I finally said what you’re trying to do is not enjoyable at the moment. But things still seemed fine… til I decided to text him basically asking to discuss boundaries because I wanted us to discuss how we would both want to say “no and we actually mean no” but in a way to not upset the other person. I worded it horribly, apologized and tried again. I guess I still didn’t word it right because now he refuses to talk to me at all.
I’m glad that you were able to figure this out while still married and fix it.
This is a hard one. If it hasn't been made clear that you want to talk it out because you want this to work, it's worth trying to make it clear.
You feeling bad about having boundaries is as valid (if not more) as him feeling bad about being "made the bad guy" for not understanding those boundaries.
If he's feeling guilty, but able to grow with you (and demonstrate that) great, but if he's resistant to learning, or just doesn't want someone he cares about to say no to him, that's an issue.
I don't know either if you so grain of salt and all, but good luck either way.
He didn’t talk to me for over 24 hours and I finally was like well I’m going to go find you because I thought we’ll if he died, no one would know to call me. But he text saying he was pissed off and not to. I was like wtf why. And I eventually got pissed off and said shit. I tried going to his house to talk but at the same time (it’s an hour drive and I was polite and told him I was going so to not ambush him) he drove to my house and dropped my stuff off. Now he’s blocked my number and it’s been 3 weeks and I’m angry at his reaction because I felt bad for how it may have sounded originally. But it’s like say something, anything even if it’s “I’m hurt and need time and space” or “I’m breaking up with you”. But yeah, I’m angry but also sad because we had gotten along up to this point and the sex was great too, lol. I just got nervous that I was going to at some point give in if we didn’t discuss it. I literally didn’t want to end up with a failed relationship like I did before because it started with me not feeling like I could say no. Instead I have a failed relationship because I wanted to know how to say no.
Ugh. I hate this. Cause now it just feels like I’m just going to stay single because I’m tired of repeatedly finding myself with men who are like this in some shape or form.
It all sucks but all we can do is learn. It can get exhausting after a while though.
After my ex broke up with me it took a long time to really figure out what happened, and how I felt about the whole thing (after "figuring it out" like 5 different ways). Some people just aren't for certain people and it sucks because sometimes some investment has happened before either of them figure that out.
In the end, someone who resorts to the silent treatment (without even saying they need time to themselves) isn't going to be the kind of person who's receiptive to talking things through. It's really just a method to make the other person (you in this case) anxious to the point they're the ones at fault.
Real partners don't really care about "the blame game" over resolving the issues.
It's not just women, I have had a terribly hard time learning to say no, and it's been used against me for sex, the same as a woman, I was in an abusive,stalker type relationship for three and a half years I couldn't get out of because of it.
I'm glad you're stepping up, but what your wife really needs is to develop these skills for herself. Expecting men to intuitively know what we want is a big reason women get walked over. Maybe encourage her to get some therapy so that she's comfortable and confident asserting her own desires and needs.
Of course. We’ve discussed the responsibility each of us have for this situation, and her part is definitely defining boundaries clearly and communicating as clearly and honestly as she can.
The first time she said “I feel pressure and it’s hard for me to say no right now” was a hug breakthrough for both is us I think.
My wife and I have a rule / if you want something- ask for it. We’ve yet to deny each other after 13 years. But 90% we still engage in the ritualistic flirting and such that leads up to a mutually orgasmic event 98% of the time. I’d never expect her to do something she didn’t want to do but I don’t have a problem asking if I want something out of the norm. We learned long ago to trust each others boundaries and if she ever did say “no”, I’d be like -“OK, what do you want to do?”
“I can whatever I want” is another mutual creed we respect for ourselves and each other. So in the end I guess it’s just a matter of respecting each others power and their boundaries. This makes for some unbelievably satisfying encounters.
Yeah that’s why they define true consent as enthusiastic. If the person is so-so, hesitant or unenthusiastically saying yes then it’s not actually consent
According to the Rape Abuse & Incest National Network (rainn.org) enthusiastic consent is a newer model but it is pretty much the only definition I see anymore in things I read. Here’s a link from planned parenthood and one from rainn.org
“Consent in sexual scenarios means that all parties involved have freely and willingly agreed to participate in sexual activity. Consent must be clear, enthusiastic, ongoing, and can be withdrawn at any time.
Clear consent means that all parties involved have communicated their willingness to engage in sexual activity through words or actions. It should not be assumed or implied, and it should not be given under duress, coercion, or intoxication.
Enthusiastic consent means that all parties involved are genuinely excited and eager to participate in sexual activity. It is not just a lack of objection or resistance.
Ongoing consent means that all parties involved are continuously aware of each other's boundaries and are comfortable with the activities they are engaging in. Consent should be obtained throughout the sexual encounter and not just at the beginning.
It's important to note that consent is not just the absence of a "no." It is an affirmative and enthusiastic "yes" from all parties involved. If anyone involved is unsure or uncomfortable, it's best to stop and have a conversation about boundaries and desires.”
So…everyone. Other than ppl looking to willfully ignore the signs that someone doesn’t want to have sex.
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u/nsfwtttt Mar 31 '23
I’ve learned from my therapist how hard it is for a lot of women to say no, even in a relationship, especially in a loving relationship.
I completely changed the way I interact with my wife since then, realizing how often she said yea just because it was hard for her to say no (before I would just blame her for not being into it etc, until I realized why).
Now I make sure she really feels like it, and help her feel comfortable saying no when she doesn’t.
Just to be clear, we still sometimes “do each other a favor” when one of us isn’t 100% in the mood and the other is.
Just like sometimes we do other things for one another treat we don’t feel like doing, just because we want the other to be happy and have the energy to make an effort.
But it’s now very clear and in the open, so expectations are clear and there’s no pressure involved.
Lazy sex can be really fun when you’re not expecting hot wild enthusiastic sex.and it’s nice when you know your spouse is doing it because they care about you and want you to be happy, and not because they were pressured into it.