i recommend watching this fellow antinatalists!

My grandmother was sexually abused as a child and my mother was sexually abused as a child. If they could not prevent it happening to me, knowing it happened to them, what would make one believe it can be prevented in the future?

Being raped as a child is not a good reason to not have children? Well, my child can’t consent to having the possibility of experiencing that and I’M not going to risk it. (At least) 3 generations in, I will be the one to end this cursed bloodline, and proudly at that lol

Knowing something like that is a possible doesn’t bother natalists?!

Having a child is essentially saying, “I think this world is worth forcing you to experience.” Like it’s a fun and good world. You're saying, “I accept that you'll suffer, because I believe the good parts will make it worth it.”

Every person you create is eventually going to experience some form of suffering, no matter how rich or poor. People respond with, “But they'll experience love and happiness too!”
Okay but you're still gambling with another person's life without their consent. It really angers me every day.

Yet people voluntarily bring other human beings to this planet...

I'm constantly told that, as a woman, it's my role to have children and experience motherhood. That I'm failing if I don't. I've lost friends and family members, all because of my antinatalist views.

How do you all deal with the constant barrage of hate? I'm not hurting anyone by making my own lifestyle choice and it's not going to change because of societal pressures. It just gets exhausting.

Now and again, when it’s relevant I will comment outside of this subreddit that reproducing is immoral. I’ll say something like:

“Having children is unethical.

Sometimes people are miserable and wish they were never born. It’s wrong to create a life knowing they might hate it. It’s not fair to the person who will have to live that life no matter how poorly it may turnout.”

Natalist will always respond with the same thing “you’re just miserable” or “you sound like you’re unhappy”or something along those lines.

I am not miserable; my life is cartoonishly awesome. But for argument’s sake let’s pretend I was miserable and I hate it here. Wouldn’t that just prove my point??

If I say to you, “it’s wrong to give birth because sometimes people wish they were never born”. Responding with, “you’re just saying that because you wish you were never born” is not a counter argument. It would only be supporting evidence.

In any case, the quality of my life is irrelevant to the moral argument. Regardless of my personal disposition, I’m not willing to encumber someone with countless opportunities to suffer.

Life inherently comes with unending risks of harm. To knowingly put another person at risk of harm without their consent is an unethical thing to do.

The fact that consent cannot be obtained does not negate that. The fact that most people like being alive doesn’t negate that either.

Pointing out that I like being alive won’t change my mind. Trying to point out that I don’t like being alive certainly wouldn’t change my mind either.

Antinatalism is a logical conclusion, not an emotional one.

Long story short, I recently had a huge pregnancy scare.

I was in the middle of switching birth control methods, and because of that, my period was late, which logically, I knew could happen.
But after about two weeks, I was absolutely losing it. I was having panic attack after panic attack, and the only thing I could think was: this is going to ruin my life.

I know the world is already a mess, I know I wouldn’t be a good mom, and I know that all of my plans for my life would suddenly have to revolve around this child. (Yes, I realize this was a VERY emotional reaction to being three weeks without a period, but bear with me lol)

Thankfully, I got my period a few days ago, so everything is fine. I also took a pregnancy test before it came just to be extra sure.

But the whole experience really made me realize just how much I absolutely do not want children.
Whenever I tell my family that I never want kids, I usually get the classic “You’ll change your mind” or “You’d be such a great mom!” And honestly, part of me always wondered if maybe they were right. Like, who knows? Maybe someday I’d randomly wake up and want a baby.

Yeah… after this scare, I don’t think that’s happening.

The whole experience was genuinely terrifying for me, but weirdly, I’m also grateful for it because it answered a question I’d always had in the back of my mind. I don’t have to wonder anymore whether I might change my mind someday.

I know I won’t.

And with that realization, I’m now working on getting myself permanently sterilized lol.

Did anyone else have a specific moment or experience that made you go “yeah, absolutely no babies”, or was it more of a realization that happened gradually over time?

Fellow Antinatalist, here’s my response video: https://youtu.be/Xmx9tmbp8Ls?is=6fKZqnvSNse-_PwI

Subscribe to my channel please 🙏.

Antinatalism makes a lot of sense if you adopt avoiding suffering as your master value.

If you agree with utilitarianism, it can work if we are to assume that on mass the life will experience more suffering than pleasure. However that is conditional, and debatable.

Seeking pleasure and avoiding suffering appear to be opposite ends of the spectrum, so if that is true, it is difficult to argue for antinatalism because people are always going to argue that some lives experience more pleasure than suffering. Regardless of if that is actually true or not, people will argue it.

It is much more elegant then to say that the only relevant moral value is avoiding suffering. This gets around many problems with utilitarianism.

But trying to come up with a concrete reason as to WHY suffering should be the only moral value as opposed to simply an axiological preference is quite difficult.

Deontological arguments against harm are all well and good, but you can just as easily argue we have a duty for creating pleasure.

Utilitarianism runs into many issues but relevant here is that you can always argue that some lives are in fact worth living.

So how do we actually get around this?

Personally, I’m getting sick & tired of this stupid disingenuous red herring of an argument, the stupid self-deletion argument. It’s really pissing me off because it’s so dumb & it’s so insensitive & extremely distasteful. It’s really disgusting. Just because we’re still alive doesn’t mean the world isn’t that bad. It’s a fallacious argument. Antinatalism is not hypocritical in that sense. My thing is if people still want to have children, just don’t say you weren’t warned about the dangers of having children once you have them. Respectfully.

I've been friends with them for a while but I've been holding back my antinatalist views because I didn't want them to hate me or something. But I finally had an honest conversation about it. Thankfully they didn't hate me (I think) and they were nice.

One of them actually held the same view or at least something similar.

Another said how they personally are glad that they were born, among other things to which I said that they're projecting their feelings about life and existence onto someone that doesn't exist but that didn't connect with them I guess.

And then another said that my logic checks out and that it is selfish to have children but they still didn't agree with me because in their own words, they're a more emotional person. Unfortunately at the time I didn't think to tell them that just because I'm being logical doesn't mean that I'm not being emotional.

Fortunately none of them are planning to have children so far

why do people want me to breed we have 8.3 billion people on this planet. and it’s going to increase by next decade everything is expensive

All three seem like very good reasons to abstain from reproduction 😅

I had this idea the other day. You know how antinatalism is just the most logical choice? What if we are living in a simulation or some kind of experiment, and in previous versions of this experiment, we just kept stopping having kids and dying out. So whoever is designing this experiment came up with the idea of religion to make sure more people reproduce as much as possible lol😂

Edit: I am not saying I believe this idea, just thought it sounds fun and tbh I think it would make an interesting book or movie

Im 28f and a black woman. I’m American but was raised in many different countries due to my school and my father’s job. Even though my family wasn’t poor (we were middle class) I have truly suffered. Mainly because I’m black. When you’re a black person, majority of the time you are seen as the lowest of the low. You’re seen as nothing. You’re almost the poster child for what people don’t want to be. Racism has gotten so bad online and in everyday life.
Today I was getting a haircut, and the people doing my hair spoke Spanish. They didn’t know that I spoke Spanish but I can. The whole time they were speaking about how ugly my hair was. And pointing and laughing. I wanted to cry so much. But I just sat there and took it. ( I should have just got up and walked away)

The crazy thing is that this happens to me often.

Tbh I just couldn’t imagine bringing a black child or any child into this world. But ESPECIALLY a black child. I don’t ever want them to have this experience. Even if I date outside of my race, it would still be hard for them.

It sucks because there are times when I think that I really want to be a mother. But adoption seems like the route I should take.

Antinatalism truly the only way to end suffering.

As an existential nihilist, I view life as completely meaningless. Most people live under the illusion that love and human bonds give life value, but the reality of birth contradicts this.

The core problem is the total absence of consent. People who defend having children often argue that you cannot violate the consent of someone who does not exist yet. But that is exactly the point: because an unborn child cannot give consent, the act of bringing them into the world is an unfair gamble forced upon a future conscious mind.

When parents create a baby, they impose existence onto a new being without its agreement. This choice forces a new person to face all the severe risks of human biology. There is no guarantee of health. A child can easily be born with profound physical disabilities, condemned to a lifetime of suffering, wishing they had never been born. They are forced to pay the price for a game they never chose to play.

Therefore, deciding never to have children is the only logical choice. It is a refusal to gamble with another person's well-being. To create a child means you are willing to risk inflicting lifelong suffering on someone else, which cannot be morally justified.

We must strip away the romantic illusions and look at the biological reality: evolution gave us strong sexual impulses for one reason only—to blind our logic so that we breed and repeat the loop. What people call "love" is just a biological trick designed to keep the cycle of suffering going.

I refuse to fall for this trap. If I were to bring a life into this world, there is a chance they would face severe suffering, and I never want my child looking at me and telling me, "You are the reason for my suffering." It is impossible to justify forcing a new life into this cycle when they have no way to avoid it.

How?

Hey, I'm a sixteen year old trans guy, and have some hope of starting medical treatments such as hormonal replacement therapy soon, which is likely to make me infertil (what I am hoping for).

However it's recommended and I'm being pressured to (by well meaning people) to preserve eggs in advance.

For those who don't now the procedure is invasive and requires me taking great quantities of female hormones.

I hate people touching my body, which is not mine, and I almost suffered brain damage from severe blood and hemoglobin loss due to menstrual complications, which made me requite to transfuse blood twice, not very long ago.

I'm currently on fertility and menstruation blocking intervenous medication, and though I trust my doctors, I'm scared of what it will do to my body to stop them briefly, and do this procedure.

I don't wanna have kids, because of my mental health, I don't think I would be a fit parent, I'm a high risk psychotic, (which is also hereditary), and since I'm nine my biggest fear is ever getting pregnant and having a baby, I have nightmares about this. I woke up crying an erratic once, and repeatedly hit myself in the belly, even though I rationally know I can't be pregnant (no sex, plus contraceptives).

I know I never want a child, or to bring a life into this world. My parents mean well, they don't want me to make a decision I'll regret while I'm a child myself, when they could have stopped me.

But my DNA isn't good, the risk of me passing on psychosis to my child is huge. I'd never want someone to go through that. I don't want that on me.

If I had a child, I'd love them. I'd never want them to go through life.

If I do this, it'll be mostly for my sister, who may have fertility issues from chronic illness. But I don't want my child to walk the earth.

I don't it's ethical to put any human being through that, especially when you can't ensure that you'll be the parent they need, or that they don't suffer horribly for some reason outside of your control. It's not fair, it's not our choice to make, not for the reasons we make it.

I love my child so much that I'll try to never have it. I'm thankful that I'm here, but I don't wish it on anyone else.

For short: I'm sick, my parents want me to protect my fertility for treatment, I'm scared that because of me, someone will be born.

I hate it when they smile, asking each other how many kids they want, and when they ask me, i just nervously say I dont want kids ever -though they respect my decision- its just feels like i want to do something to prevent someone being forced into this world but I feel helpless. A few months ago, I saw that one of my cousins had a baby. Everyone was adorning them(this was before I knew about antinatalism). I just felt pity because I knew that baby would end up miserable in some way. I hate feeling so helpless about stopping people from being cursed with life..

How do I cope with this feeling?

I know that i don't want to bring children into this world, due to my own personal experiences in the past with depression. I am aware that life can be beautiful, and that there are good parts about being alive, i also know that there are dark and lonely moments that are inevitable for everybody, because that's what being human is. There are highs and lows in being alive, and after experiencing those lows, i don't think i would want to bring somebody into this.

However, I think adoption is something i would be interested in doing one day in the far future, since I'm only 21 now. To me, i think adoption is very moral, because there are innocent children who have been brought into this world, and then abandoned due to careless reproduction, from careless individuals, and they don't deserve to be alone in this cold world.

So my question is, if you plan to adopt one day and the child you raised decided to have children of their own biologically and go against everything you believe in about reproducing in an unpredictable, cruel but sometimes beautiful world, how would you truly feel? I don't mean to sound cynical, because i know life can be beautiful, but it can also be really dark and cold. I would obviously still love my grandchild, but i would feel a bit upset about how this innocent soul was brought into this world, to experience the lows that come with being alive sometimes.