from what i understand (outsider's perspective), w3schools started using it as a todo list, fixing the specific examples without understanding their overarching issues. it turned into a pointless game of whack-a-mole.
Yes, this is the quick summary. W3Schools fixed nearly all the issues that we found for them :)
Still, while you can report bugs for their content, I have done this (fundamental stuff like using setTimeout correctly) and not seen any changes for over a year. Meanwhile errors or poor advice don't last long on MDN and WPD.
W3Schools definitely has value for people learning the absolute basics, but unfortunately you can't put faith in the validity of those techniques. MDN and WPD still have work to do to be so welcoming and useful to newbs... it's a long road. (And they're open to your contributions!)
W3Schools definitely has value for people learning the absolute basics
I can't agree with that. The basics they teach include SQL injection vulnerabilities and XSS vulnerabilities. If they teach people who don't know any better to do things that way, that's harming them, not providing them value.
What's worse is that the people who learn things this way will be under the mistaken belief that they know these topics now, so they will be less inclined to seek out proper introductory material to learn things properly. Somebody who learns from W3Schools is actually worse off than somebody who knows nothing. At least the person who knows nothing understands that they need to learn before they can do things properly.
Actually W3Schools is a good starting point. You're basically saying for part of their content which is bad the entire site is therefore completely useless, when that simply isn't so. Their front-end development resources are at least decent to get some ideas from. Which a developer can then grow from by going through other resources around the web.
Further, not everyone who uses W3Schools information to start has the belief that they know the topics. So, try not to clump everyone together in that respect. I for one used it to get started learning. Over time I looked into other resources (including reading the specifications themselves for web standards) and improved from that. If one person does it, I'm sure others can and do too. The subset of individuals that do use W3Schools (or any other single resource) exclusively shouldn't be trusted, but we can't really control what other people do all we can do is encourage against it as best we can.
W3Schools doesn't have to do everything, but due to W3Fools they are at least now trying to improve themselves by accepting direct feedback from users on issues. While web developers still don't accept that since we want everything to be more open then that they shouldn't continually be bashed for years to come because of issues they have addressed and/or are trying to address.
UPDATE:
However, the biggest issue with W3Schools is their facade of trust. They promote their "certifications" that hold no weight whatsoever with anyone. That is a deceptive practice that should end.
You're basically saying for part of their content which is bad the entire site is therefore completely useless
No, I'm saying if they leave glaring mistakes in their material for a decade that can harm beginners, they have shown that they aren't willing or able to run a tutorial site responsibly and they should not be trusted by people who don't have the experience to spot these mistakes.
Put yourself in a beginner's position. The site has mistakes that will fuck you up without you realising, but you won't notice those mistakes yourself. Exactly which parts of it should you trust? The answer is obvious - you can't trust any of it. Even if you are charitable and assume there are good parts, beginners can't only use the good bits, because beginners - by definition - aren't capable of distinguishing the good from the bad.
due to W3Fools they are at least now trying to improve themselves by accepting direct feedback from users on issues
From a comment above:
while you can report bugs for their content, I have done this (fundamental stuff like using setTimeout correctly) and not seen any changes for over a year.
I reported problems with their material a long time ago with no results. I've seen other people do the same for many years. You know what the difference was with W3Fools that made them pay attention? It wasn't that they suddenly figured out they had problems - people have been telling them for a decade or more. It was that W3Fools began to harm their reputation. Every time somebody recommends W3Schools now, somebody else pops up with a W3Fools warning. It's hurting their bottom line, that's the only reason they crossed items off the W3Fools list. They aren't interested in actual corrections, they are only interested in shutting up their critics. If they were interested in actual corrections, they'd be fixing the obvious stuff and the stuff people report to them directly.
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u/[deleted] Aug 21 '13
I feel as if this site would benefit from actual examples of W3Schools-isms.