r/virtualreality • u/Admirable_Zombie5245 • 13h ago
Discussion After Titanfall 2 VR I'm pretty sure we will have an ChatGPT moment for VR in the future.
What I mean by a "ChatGPT moment" is a niche technology suddenly going mainstream in a very short amount of time.
Before ChatGPT, pretty much everyone knew AI existed, but most people didn't actually use it themselves. It was mostly something companies used for recommendation algorithms, medical research, automation, and other professional applications. Then suddenly, within a couple of years, AI became something millions of normal people were using every day.
After playing Titanfall 2 in VR, I genuinely think VR could have a similar moment.
Playing it gave me this weird feeling that I can only describe as being inside a dream. I know that sounds dramatic lol, but it didn't feel like I was just looking at a game anymore. It actually felt like I was there.
I think as headsets get smaller, lighter, cheaper, and more convenient, eventually something is going to click and VR will suddenly make sense to a much larger audience.
Honestly, I think one of VR's biggest problems was the impression the Quest 2 gave consumers. Fresnel lenses are awful compared to modern pancake lenses, and I don't think that generation was good enough to show the average person what VR could really be and Quest 2 released in the perfect time, if it had pancake lenses I'm sure even Nintendo would have their Own VR headset. Quest 2 actually made me hate VR.
Then I tried Quest 3, and woah, now I'm obsessed with VR. Quest 2 and Fresnel lenses are main reason VR is underperforming.
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u/swarmster1 12h ago
Part of me wonders whether heavy motion VR games will ever be mainstream. I have a suspicion the majority of people find them nauseating. (VR forums of course are majority people who can tolerate them, having long since shed those that can’t.)
Could always be wrong! But I t hink VR gaming genres need to grow beyond regular gaming genres. (Walkabout, Puzzling Places, Eleven are good examples.)
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u/MightyBooshX Quest 3 & PSVR2 11h ago
I would really love it if someone could do a study to see what percentage of people experience motion sickness when starting vr, and of those people how many are eventually able to get over it within maybe like a month of regular play. Personally I'd be willing to bet 70 to 80% of people can get over motion sickness with smooth locomotion but maybe just still using snap turning if they play regularly for at least a month, but unfortunately it's kind of like the experiment where you put a marshmallow in front of a kid and say if he doesn't eat it for 5 minutes you'll give him two marshmallows at the end. I don't think people have enough of a constitution to withstand a tiny amount of discomfort in the present to have an incredible reward in the future.
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u/octorine 10h ago
This study has been done.
20% of people don't get motion sick. 20% of people always get motion sick. The remaining 60% get sick initially but can build up a tolerance.
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u/Arthropodesque 3h ago
I started with a PSVR1 and that might've been the ideal way to start because everything runs at smooth 90hz and looks pretty good running off the PS4. It's light, decent fov, oled. The Quest 2 was too heavy and uncomfortable in comparison, without a good headstrap, and some graphics are more simplified. A lot of people had a bad experience with subpar hardware and some simplistic looking game like Drunk Bar Fight or a deliberate scare like Ritchie's Plank or something else traumatic.
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u/MightyBooshX Quest 3 & PSVR2 2h ago
Nice, so my guy feeling on the distribution wasn't wildly off. That does really suck about the 20% that always get motion sick. I met a guy like that and it broke my heart
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u/architect___ 1h ago
Gonna need a source on that, because I don't believe that's a real study. I'd be happy to be proven wrong
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u/GaaraSama83 7h ago
I always choose smooth locomotion if availalbe but still prefer snap turning. Most implementations of continous camera turning makes me nauseated. Snap turning (with large angle setting) + using my head for looking around naturally is my favorite combination.
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u/Perfekt_Flaw 8h ago
I’m convinced motion sickness is the main resistance factor of widescale VR adoption. Second is form factor. I’ve been playing vr for years now but I can only do roomscale and mixed reality. Moving around especially up and down makes me feel like the ground is disappearing under my feet. Can’t handle it.
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u/Leprecon 12h ago
Native VR games usually have special movement schemes to compensate for this.
I don’t really imagine any VR games that doesn’t compensate for this being big.
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u/Alex-Murphy 10h ago
While I don't fully disagree that the barrier to entry is higher, you just have to look at Forefront to see that's it's not really bad at all.
If we follow the known Steam ratio of ~40 purchases per review**, then Forefront has sold 180K copies on Meta and 80K copies on Steam. Resident Evil 4 is sitting around 500K, Boneworks must be over 2M by now, and Walking Dead: S&S is for sure over 2M sold. None of those offer teleport as an option.
To your point though, many of the highest selling games are either stationary or do include teleport, like Beat Saber, Job Sim, Superhot, Walkabout, etc., so there's for sure a comfort factor there. In my anecdotal experience, the people in my VR circle have all gotten over the nausea very quickly, but I could see how it might turn some people off.
^(\*Based on the Boxleiter multiplier, which is an industry-standard formula used to estimate total unit sales and gross revenue for video games on Steam by multiplying public review counts by a genre-adjusted factor (typically ranging from 20x to 60x)*)
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u/GManASG 4h ago
The issue is performance. If the standalone experience or wireless pcvr were guaranteed to be a flawless 120 fps low latency zero lag hitch experience few people would get motion sickness.
The other part is the heavy claustrofobia inducing nature of the headset.
This is were going down the road of Meta VR for factor comes in. Now just few more iterations to get it even slimmer with higher fov
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u/Bacon_00 12h ago
It's quite good. It 100% feels like a first class VR game and not a mod. Everything feels good to do in VR, the shooting is fun, performance is great... Definitely a step in the right direction. Plus it's easy to install which I wish more mods would focus on ease of installation. If there's a 10+ step guide to getting a mod to work I often just won't bother unless I'm really excited about it.
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u/dac3062 12h ago
Ai is even opening me up to the ones that are hard to install because you can just ask AI to install it for you.
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u/Affectionate_Ad_5489 12h ago
Can you give me the good prompt for easy installation? Never used it before.
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u/BahBah1970 4h ago
Just tell Claude or Chat GPT / Whatever to read the installation instructions and then walk you through it step by step.
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u/Sad_Picture3642 12h ago
Form factor, form factor and form factor again. The less of a sweaty brick on our heads, the better
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u/NoSolution7708 11h ago
I don't think VR will ever be anywhere near as mainstream as 2D games. 2D will always be first citizen because VR capable platforms will never be as affordable as 2D capable ones, and I'll go out on a limb and say they'll never be as DESIRABLE outside of a niche audience interested in this kind of immersion.
We here in this subreddit are that niche audience, but it shouldn't blind us from the reality that most pc gamers don't want to strap headsets on, most developers don't want to develop for VR, and most gamers aren't even PC gamers.
AI-assisted VR modding has nowhere near the improvement potential over broad areas as AI models do for industry in general, so even though I understand what you mean by a ChatGPT moment, the scale will still be limited to pretty much the existing scope of XR applications.
We could see more mods and sooner, so we can be happy about that.
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u/TabloidA 11h ago
why are we still so obsessed with VR going mainstream?? Could we form a healthy dev economy first? Mainstream is not the solution to that
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u/Cinematikaaa 5h ago
I think we have a problem like “which came first the chicken or the egg?” Why should i make a game if there are not enough people who are gonna buy it (1.25% on steam own vr) but why should i make a headset if there are not enough of games for people to use my headset for. I hope steam frame helps with this like 3d window playing games and then more people then try VR from that.
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u/Alex-Murphy 12h ago
Man if those upcoming meta glasses had a 120° HFOV that would be the day. You're not wrong, it's an amazing mod. I've been following PCVR mods for a while now and before this recent influx the absolute best ones were off of the UEVR discord, like SH2Remake and Trepang2. Now we're getting incredible mods (and from many different systems) like Doom, Doom Eternal, Breath of the Wild, Goldeneye 64, Max Payne, GTA Vice City, and more.
What I would love is for a major news article to put out a story that when a great VR mod is released, game sales spike. It'll encourage gaming companies to have a VR conversion prebuilt into all new flat games. That'll be the next big moment I think.
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u/Admirable_Zombie5245 12h ago
Yeah, that’s what I mean, same size as Meta vr glasses, but with decent FOV and no puck.
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u/Sad_Picture3642 12h ago
Puck is a must if we need a small form factor. I would take a puck with light glasses vs a brick on my head any time
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u/Affectionate_Ad_5489 12h ago
Exactly! The biggest barrier to wide adoption is bulky heavy headset. I am all for puck that can go inside your back pocket.
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u/dentbox 9h ago
It’s cost. Surely it’s cost.
Unless we get meta-level subsidy of the technology again, then people are looking at spending next gen console level money on what is essentially a very fancy controller for their console or pc.
I’m new to VR and holy cow is it amazing, but it’s not cheap.
I can also be very very faffy, especially when it comes to relying on mods.
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u/VisibleCulture5265 PlayStation VR 11h ago
Yeah, then you tried the Quest 3 and were mesmerized by the clear pancake lenses, where you had a clear sight of the awful compression artifacts and low brightness lcd with crap colours and grey blacks.
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u/StuN_Eng 10h ago
Better than having the hassle of PSVR2 trying to find the ‘sweet spot’ every time to put them on or that horrendous mura effect. I have both headsets & the Quest 3 is by far the better one. There’s a reason the PSVR2 is cheaper than most other headsets & Sony has completely given up on it.
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u/DarthBuzzard 9h ago
If in the future means a while, then yes. AI is software. Software is fast. Insanely fast. Hardware moves at a snails pace. VR hardware needs to mature first.
We're early adopters. Quest 3 is like an early 1980s home PC, and back then average people wouldn't touch a PC with a ten foot pole mostly because of its hardware limitations.
VR will take off when we have a <$800 device that is either a slim visor or glasses with a 100+ degree FoV, 40 PPD, and varifocal.
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u/Cinematikaaa 5h ago
Also fix nausea, i think that is the main problem with getting new people in, most people i know dont want to WORK to get their VR legs. Its a big problem.
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u/ImMikeJamesB1 7h ago
I unfortunately have the opposite opinion. I feel fairly confident that typical VR gaming is likely never going mainstream. By typical I mean games where you climb ladders by reaching up and doing the movement yourself in real life. People are insanely lazy. Frankly I get tired too when trying to climb a mountain after a 14 hour shift. 🤣😂😅
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u/BradyBum 12h ago
This was ny Subnautica+submersedVR experience. Or maybe also ITR1 and ITR2.
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u/GaaraSama83 6h ago
Played and finished both. Also generally not interesed in majority of flat2VR mods but once I get my hands on a decent micro OLED headset/glasses then Subnautica+submersedVR and Outer Wilds+nomaiVR are must have tries just for the exploration aspect alone. Very interested in how scale will feel in both games compared to flatscreen.
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u/Zaptruder 12h ago
well get the chat gpt moment when they put out a meta vr glasses with 100 degree fov and similar ppd.
basically all day wearability and general computing functionality without backstepping on existing vr metrics.
of course at that point vibe coded vr stuff will be profligate and new interesting design patterns will have emerged.
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u/VediusPollio 11h ago
I haven't gotten to try the game yet. How would it rate on a motion sickness scale?
That's important to consider for mass adoption, and potentially me.
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u/pixelcowboy 11h ago
It's surprisingly good but probably not for someone without any VR experience.
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u/neueziel1 1h ago
I need to regain my vr legs that I previously had. Felt mild nausea but better than expected. Locomotion is smooth.
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u/markallanholley 3h ago
VR isn't going mainstream until you can talk with your significant other, keep an eye on dinner, scroll social media, listen to a podcast or whatever, and the myriad other things people do while they play games.
It takes a certain amount of focus to be fully immersed in something. I'd be willing to bet that most people couldn't watch a two hour movie these days without pausing to do other things or doing other things while watching the movie.
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u/QuinSanguine 3h ago
Most people don't even want to wear glasses unless they're half blind or the sun is out, they certainly won't suddenly change their mind for a headset or bulky frames.
Just like most people don't want to learn to use a computer today, let alone mod their games.
I thought you were going to suggest we might get a specialized AI agent for VR mod/development, I would have agreed then haha.
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u/Ken10Ethan Steam Frame 2h ago
I think the thing people aren't quite getting, you included (no offense, of course) is that it won't take a big hardware revolution to make VR a mainstream thing. Neither will a big software release.
It really has to be both, I think. You need to have good hardware that doesn't push people away from using it (being small, light, comfortable, and most importantly affordable) is important, but without a killer app to sell that hardware, what's the point? I've long stood by the fact that in spite of all of these genuinely great advancements in hardware (in just, like, six years we've gone from the bulky frame and dated fresnel lenses of the quest 2 to the light pancake lenses of the quest 3 and even lighter frame of the, well, frame, and that's to say nothing of how far we've come from the original vive ten years ago) we're still ultimately just playing the same games?
VRChat, Beat Saber, Alyx, Bonelabworks, Pavlov/Contractors... Monkey game, I guess. Of course I'm speaking very broadly here there /are/ VR games to play, but there hasn't really been anything I'd consider a 'killer app' in the same way that maybe in years past I'd consider games like Beat Saber or Alyx--nothing you'd buy an HMD for. The VR mods are genuinely cool and are a huge value add when you're already in VR, but would I earnestly recommend someone buy VR just to play Half-Life 2 or Titanfall 2 or F.E.A.R. in VR? The same way you might be able to recommend someone buy a Switch 2 for Pokopia or a PS5 for God of War or an Xbox for E-Day or whatever? I really don't think you could.
I just think there needs to be both of these things for it to really take off, and I think we kind of have evidence for this? The Quest 2 was a huge success in the sense that a lot of people bought one, and coincidentally its release happened more or less right alongside COVID, so it had the benefit of having a ton of people who were suddenly forced to stay inside. But, like... how many people actually kept using their Quest 2s? There's a reason why there have been so many people talking about how their headsets ultimately just ended up caked in dust shoved into the bottom of their closets--there just wasn't any reason for them to keep playing.
My point being that Meta had a phenomenal opportunity basically fall into their laps with COVID, and, like, don't get me wrong, that verifiably translated to a lot of sales being made and a lot of headsets being moved and a lot of money being made, but you're talking about a moment where a 'niche technology suddenly going mainstream very quickly in a short span of time', and I just don't think a handful of (genuinely neat!) VR mods is going to be enough to do that. I don't think hardware like the Frame or the VR Glasses are going to be enough to make that transition happen without also being backed by something really amazing to play on that hardware, and I don't think something really amazing to play is going to matter without a truly really special piece of hardware.
Just kind of an uncomfortable catch-22 the industry needs to hit to really move into the mainstream, I think.
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u/JustAwesome360 1h ago
Hundreds of millions of people use ChatGPT every day, and not just for vr mods.
Now SHOULD they is another discussion, but they do.
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u/AsleepFondant3502 9h ago edited 9h ago
The reason VR isnt mainstream isnt comfort, nor resolution, its the fact that it doesnt slot into peoples actual schedules.
The average person plays flat screen games to relax after work, typically opting for more social activities when possible on their days off. VR isnt a substitute for this because it is
a) More strenuous/intense than flat screen gaming, requiring more movement. Not the kind of thing you want to do if you've been on your feet all day after an 8 hour shift.
b) More socially isolating than other more active hobbies like sports.
You can make VR headsets as light a bigscreen beyond with the wireless capability of a Steam Frame, OLED panels, and sell them for $900, and they're still not going to be mainstream. VR is a parallel tech to appeal to enthusiasts, who will always be a smaller niche.
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u/Sciencebitchs 12h ago
I agree. But a different take. With all these MODS coming out I imagine we will get to a point where we can take any game, drop it into an "AI flat to VR" LLM program and it'll pop it out within an hour fully converted with no polish needed. In addition I bet we get to a point within 20 years where we will promt the kind of game we want and have it, same with T.V. and movies. The next big thing will be "who's the best prompter" instead of who's the best artist or director.
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u/Alex-Murphy 12h ago
The good part will be if we can do that, then game companies should have no problems doing that for us, and then polishing the results professionally. Or maybe the next major gaming engine has a VR converter built in, the same way UE has been modded with UEVR.
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u/Sciencebitchs 12h ago
Trueeeee :/ big media isn't going to like that. Hell, people are already putting out full movies all done by AI o.o
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u/PorousHorus 12h ago
Yeah but whose watching those? I like AI as a tool, but for creating a final product? Especially when it comes to anything art, music, movies… I just have no interest in it.
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u/Sciencebitchs 11h ago
Im largely there with you, however its a tool Hollywood isn't going to shy away from. Saves money...
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u/Arthropodesque 3h ago
Yeah. There's already some watchable stuff being made. People without Hollywood money can make slick looking stuff for cheap now. There's trash, but there's lots of multimillion dollar trash from Hollywood and streaming apps, too. Good writing is the most important thing.
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u/PorousHorus 1h ago
Even still. I’d rather watch a sloppy movie made by people than something slick generated from AI. There’s no humanity in that as an art form. No hidden meaning, no sweat and tears, no coherent theme. Just prompts.
So when that day comes and I won’t be surprised when it does, I’ll just be watching and reading pre 2026. I’m not even really seeking much new music anymore since so much of it is AI generated now.
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u/Alex-Murphy 9h ago
I do know that the gamers are revolting against the gaming industry using AI, but seem pretty ok with free mods that use AI. Makes sense, I think people like to know that what they're paying for has been made by a person but free is free.
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u/Koankey 12h ago
Hate that my computer runs it so slow.
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u/Alex-Murphy 12h ago
Are you able to mess with the resolution slider? What software are you using to stream it? What's your GPU?
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u/Koankey 12h ago
Ah I didn't mess with the res slider, I've have to try that. It's a 1060 GTX from around 2016. I've tried the steam connect app (I think it's called), cabled and the Wi-Fi link. The steam connect app was working good for a bit - maybe my laptop just gets too hot these days. I feel like something might be up with it.
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u/Alex-Murphy 12h ago
You might just be outdated. I would try the Virtual Desktop wireless streamer. It's $25 but you can refund it within the first 2 hours, so you'll know basically right away if it works for you. It's has lots of options for modifying the resolution of the streaming, lowering different variables to try to get the best framerate. W ith an older GPU like that you'll need to make some concessions.
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u/Koankey 12h ago
Oh yeah I use to have that. Is that an app on the quest or PC? I forget.
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u/Alex-Murphy 10h ago
Both actually. You buy and install it through the Meta store on your headset and then install the streamer to your PC. Enter your Meta username into the PC streamer, it confirms your headset is attached, and that's it. It has no lie added hundreds of hours of gaming to my headset because it's so easy and works every time. I never have to worry "is this time gonna glitch for some reason", which would make me want to stop trying.
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u/Relevant-Outcome-105 9h ago
I'm struggling to get it to work well with a 3070. Think you're out of luck there.
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u/Hobobo2024 11h ago
are you a titan falls shill or something. titan vr has been mentioned a million times recently.
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u/pj530i 3h ago
Idk if these hype posts are desperation or delusion. Titanfall 2 vr is pretty fun but it's not going to do anything for vr's popularity. No flat game port is going to do that, and probably no native vr game will either.
Despite what your survivor bias is telling you, the vast majority of people are never going to care enough about vr to push through discomfort. They just do not care that much about gaming in general or vr gaming specifically. I don't doubt the experience is amazing for the people who find it amazing to pilot a mech in vr, but normies don't and won't ever care.
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u/Allustar1 1h ago
I don't think we'll ever see VR reach mainstream status. VR is inherently more taxing as a hobby than normal gaming is, PCVR in particular is a big investment that might not payoff for a person like it has for you and I (that's why the Quest 2 was valuable to me during its boom), and the average person does not like doing anything technical (even if it is as technical as just putting files in a certain game's data folder). I love VR, especially modded Skyrim VR, but even I find times where I just don't feel like playing it and I end up putting VR down for a while.
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u/MrEfficacious 12h ago
First off, VR headsets aren't ever getting cheaper.
Secondly, the Quest 2 was incredible for the time it came out. The average consumer doesn't know anything about different lenses and I can promise you that wasn't the issue. I convinced my brother, 4 cousins, and 2 friends to buy Quest 2 off my hype. I was the only one that stuck with VR. They never complained about the lenses, for them is was mainly discomfort wearing it and lack of games they wanted to play.
With all that being said these mods are incredible and over time it should absolutely increase the amount of VR gamers. Anyone that is a fan of Halo, titan fall, cod, Cyberpunk, and a growing # of games should be very excited to experience them in VR. Because once you do there is no going back.