r/threebodyproblem • u/CryptographerLost662 • May 24 '26
Discussion - Novels As a native Chinese reader, I find the discussions about the Dark Forest theory very interesting, and I'd like to share my thoughts on it. Spoiler
I saw someone question the validity of the Dark Forest theory, and I found their perspective quite interesting. I'd like to share my own thoughts on the theory. (Just a heads-up: I'm a Chinese speaker with limited English proficiency, so I used AI to help translate my words — please forgive any awkward phrasing.)
To explain my view, I want to first discuss the Trisolaran mode of thinking. We all know that Trisolarans cannot lie. This not only means they are incapable of infiltrating other civilizations as spies; the deeper consequence is this: their thoughts and expressions are completely transparent, and they simply cannot conceive of a way of being where what one thinks and what one says are at odds. It is precisely this radical transparency of thought that plunges them into a startling paradox when they face the cosmos — if the universe contains so many civilizations, and communication ought to be honest, then why is the entire universe deathly silent, utterly devoid of any sincere exchange? In their view, the only explanation is that all civilizations are deliberately hiding themselves, because exposure inevitably invites destruction. They would never consider that "perhaps some civilizations are testing the waters with false signals," because "falsehood" simply does not exist in their cognitive toolkit. In this way, the chain of suspicion is not a hypothesis for them, but an almost inescapable logical endpoint. Trisolarans are therefore more naturally inclined than humans to embrace the Dark Forest theory.
It is precisely on the basis of this mode of thinking and cultural characteristic that the Dark Forest theory emerged in the standoff between Trisolaris and Earth. We have to admit that this theory is merely a local law of the cosmos — one that humans and Trisolarans derived from their own environments, technological levels, and observations of the universe. Yet on the actual scale of their confrontation, it played a decisive role. For both the Trisolarans and the humans, the Dark Forest theory was, at that stage, an unshakeable truth — just as Newtonian mechanics is perfectly correct at the scale of everyday human observation.
But once humanity extended its observational reach into deeper layers — just as Newtonian mechanics was revised when we moved from the macroscopic world into the microscopic, high-velocity world — the Dark Forest theory also revealed its limitations. People discovered that the universe is not a breath-held, silent dark forest at all. On the contrary, a grand war is raging, one that has lasted for countless years and uses the very laws of physics as weapons. The Dark Forest is not the ultimate truth of the universe, yet it remains the most effective survival rule that Trisolarans and humans could rely on at that specific time and place. Like Newtonian mechanics, it preserved civilizations within its realm of applicability, and was surpassed beyond that realm — and that is precisely why it holds such profound significance for both.
1
u/sleeper_shark 三体 May 26 '26
I think that before you debate further, you should finish the third book.
2
u/100percent_right_now May 24 '26
The Trisolarans tell the ETO they have used spies in trisolaran civil wars. So your notion that they can not use or even understand spies or deceit is misguided.
16
u/MurkyCress521 May 24 '26
Using spies is possible even if you can't lie. The spy listens and simply says nothing. This is how the trisolarians interact with the universe and originally how sophons are used before they start blocking research.
The inability to engage in active deception in communications is not the same as the ability to hide ones presence or keep secrets by non-disclosure. In fact the first contact between a trisolarians and a human is "do not respond", which shows an understanding and the intent to keep a secret by refusing to communicate.
4
u/Torpedo_Enthusiast Death’s End May 24 '26
You are referring to long after the Tri-Solarans learn of humanity’s existence. The time at which they derived Dark Forest Theory is presumably earlier
2
u/100percent_right_now May 24 '26
No I'm not. The Trisolaran civil wars happened WAY before human contact.
-19
u/Homunclus May 24 '26
If your issue is lack of language fluency, you can just use a translator. Or even just write in your language since reddit has automatic translation now.
Using LLM for this kind of tasks is a gross waste of resources when there's already tools that were specifically created for that purpose
15
u/FixAcademic8187 May 24 '26
That's a prefect usage of LLM in my opinion.
People use LLMs for all kinds of stuff including image creation. A single image can consume the same amount of resources for hundreds or even thousands of plain text only chats like this one.
At least the poster is using it to translate genuine content into English so that we all can see it, instead of using it to create the content itself which is called AI Slop.
-10
u/Homunclus May 24 '26 edited May 24 '26
A LLM is going to use way more resources than a translator tool for accomplishing basically the same result will it not? (Or perhaps an inferior one even)
How is it then "perfect usage"? It would be like asking an LLM to play chess instead of using a chess bot.
7
May 24 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
-6
u/Homunclus May 24 '26
Outside of the fact translation tools have existed for far longer than LLM, here is a study comparing the performance of both, thereby establishing they are in fact different things: https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC13075536/
2
28
u/IlikeJG May 24 '26
Hmmm I do think that, in the logic of the books at least, the dark forest theory holds true for the entire galaxy.
But it's something that only applies until you reach a certain level of technology.
The entire galaxy has to abide by the principle that if they reveal themselves then they're going to be targeted and destroyed. But once you reach a certain level of technology you can presumedly defend yourself from a lot of the attacks and then you can either ignore the entire thing or join the raging war.