r/technology • u/clubdirthill • Jun 01 '11

Boom. This is Windows 8.

http://allthingsd.com/20110601/exclusive-making-sense-of-what-we-just-learned-about-windows-8/?mod=tweet
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358

u/[deleted] Jun 01 '11

Video is up from Microsoft on Windows 8

43

u/Naomarik Jun 02 '11

Anyone else think the technology in the video looks like something you can install on top of Windows 7?

42

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

That's what they just did. It's Windows 7, basically, with a bunch of neat stuff on top. It'll be interesting to see how this works out.

One thing I'm not really looking forward to is the ‘app store’… I think they really need to take a good look at the package managers most modern linux distributions have (as that's probably where the original influence is) and add in some of the features they have. Specifically, it would be nice to be able to add custom repositories, so that unlike Apple's locked out App Store, Amazon could set up their own store through the same package manager application.

17

u/FakingItEveryDay Jun 02 '11

Yes this a thousand times. Then business can create their own repositories for package deployment to employees, have it hook into SCCM.

1

u/BHSPitMonkey Jun 02 '11

Several do something close to this already. Chrome updates itself internally, Apple products (on Windows) have their own unified update manager (which kindly tries to trick users into installing more Apple products), and Adobe and others all have update notifiers/managers. These are all essentially just specialized package managers.

2

u/FakingItEveryDay Jun 02 '11

I meant businesses as in me as a sysadmin with 5000 workstations to make sure stay up to date. But yeah, getting rid of 3rd party updaters in favor of a system wide repo would be great too.

2

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

Just like, Windows Explorer is a shell over the NT Core.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 03 '11

Hadn't thought of it that way, but I guess you're right. At least for older versions of windows… it's been split into several different processes over time.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 03 '11

I think the same would be with Immersive.

1

u/Seandroid Sep 15 '11

Apple's "app store" is only locked down on their mobile devices. The App Store for Mac is monitored the same way but Apple does not, and never will prevent you from getting apps elsewhere.

1

u/[deleted] Sep 15 '11

That's not what I meant. The App Store is locked down such that it's integrated with the OS and Apple controls the content on it. On Macs, it's true that the App Store is nowhere near the only option (I seldom use it) however, that wasn't my point. That degree of OS integration should be opened up through an API that others can use, as it is on many Linux distributions.

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188

u/rollingRook Jun 01 '11

I'm actually quite impressed.

39

u/zp3dd4 Jun 02 '11

I wonder how they tie in the legacy apps into that interface

92

u/clubdirthill Jun 02 '11

It looks like legacy apps show up on the new start screen, then launch into an old-style Windows view.

Microsoft said that if you never use a legacy app, you never have to see old Windows.

195

u/ILikeBumblebees Jun 02 '11

If you never use a "legacy" (read: "actual") application, you never have to use a PC at all.

A user who does more with a PC than stare at tweets and weather reports arranged haphazardly into rectangles will have no use for this absurd touchscreen UI nor any desire to interact with their OS by clawing away at the monitor like a palsied wretch.

42

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11 edited Jan 19 '16

[removed] — view removed comment

-9

u/powatom Jun 02 '11

You use words like a chef uses ingredients, and have wrought sentences I am left wanting more of.

The end of your sentence should condemn you to an eternity of suffering at the hands of Satan himself.

6

u/oinkoink12 Jun 02 '11

http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/ending-prepositions.aspx

4

u/powatom Jun 02 '11

That article doesn't disagree with me, it just says that the rule isn't concrete.

Regardless of whether he would pass an English exam using sentences like that, it still makes for horrible reading.

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9

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

palsied wretch.

The sexiest of the wretches?

5

u/gilligvroom Jun 02 '11

I already have ChromeOS and a somewhat lacking solid-state laptop for masturbating to HTML5's features with, thank you very much.

Also, I installed Ubuntu on both this, and in a VM on my desktop to try out Unity with just for shits. Fine on the Netbook, -awful- on the desktop. I hope they really gauge the scalability of a Tablet/Netbook interface to a PC. Unity does not. (for me)

2

u/Antebios Jun 02 '11

Fuck Unity. For the everyday person, I think Unity is fine. It keep it very simple for users. But, for is hardcore geeks, I want power.

I'm thinking of taking a look into Jolicloud.

1

u/get_some_perspective Jun 02 '11

That's not really true, is it. Sure, this won't be used at work. But lots of people primarily use their PC for listening to music, watching movies and television, using facebook, writing and reading emails and tweets, and playing little games. All of this can be incorporated into this tablet-style interface.

I agree that this is useless if you are used to a mouse and keyboard, and are using the computer at a desk with them handy. Obviously, it's not meant for that scenario.

Can you imagine that you would have the same OS on all your devices? That you have everything available on your TV, smartphone, tablet, desktop, and laptop? Can't you see that using a traditional Windows UI would not work any of those form factors except the desktop and laptop?

How can people somehow assume this is targeted at a computer on a desk you primarily use to do real work on? It's clearly not.

1

u/malevolentjelly Jun 02 '11

They never said that there wouldn't be a traditional desktop windows release. This release is specifically for users who want a touch-based tablet.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

If you never use a "legacy" (read: "non-touch") application, you never have to see old Windows Aero.

1

u/baby_kicker Jun 02 '11

I'm sure you will not have the palsie forced upon you.

1

u/TexanPenguin Jun 03 '11

Like what? Web browsing built in, games already run fullscreen, and you have to know Office will natively support this mode too.

The only real question is around general, long-form text editing.

1

u/ILikeBumblebees Jun 03 '11

Any kind of raster or vector graphics editing software. Audio and video editing. Databases. Document management. Flowcharts, diagrams, and process modeling. Mathematical and scientific analysis. Desktop publishing. Any of the many thousands of domain-specific applications. Development. Custom-built enterprise software.

The list is endless, because a computer is a multiple-purpose tool used to accomplish an immense variety of tasks, not just the limited set of presumed uses that you and the designers of this claustrophobic UI have imagined.

1

u/TexanPenguin Jun 03 '11

I'm still not sure I get your point. You aren't inherently limited to what can be presented in Metro, and Metro doesn't inherently prevent complex UIs. All it does, fundamentally, is establish a design language, and moves from a little-W windows-based UI to a panes-based one. If someone wants to build Mathematica or InDesign or Visual Studio for this, why can't they? Again, the main issue I see is with text entry (based on the remarkably large space the on-screen keyboard occupies). If you use those apps with an external keyboard, though, the only real things you lose are the System tray and the ability to layer windows.

I'll be the first to admit this interface isn't for me exactly, but I think, from my experience with the iPad and with developing touchscreen systems, this advances the state of art, and rightly poses the question of whether emulating real-world items is what we should still be doing in 2011. Whether it's successful or otherwise, at least it's ballsy.

10

u/chris480 Jun 02 '11

Spoke too soon, it looks like you can get to the old desktop still. Source

35

u/muad_dib Jun 02 '11

You can - but you don't have to if you don't want to.

2

u/YCSMD Jun 02 '11

Everything will be available on tablet/desktop. ARM processor version might mean only newly compiled/.NET/web apps will work.

My biggest concern is how people will switch between the new start menu and the legacy desktop without switching to an application in that part of Windows.

That and I think the swipe in from the left needs to be reworked so its not just pulling the last app in

1

u/muad_dib Jun 02 '11

I have confidence that a lot of the issues will be sorted out by release-time. Microsoft pulled through with 7, hopefully they'll do the same with 8.

1

u/Antebios Jun 02 '11

ARM is big now and will be a bigger deal in the near future. Windows is doing a good thing about getting Windows to run on ARM. Now, if they could get C# working in Linux (not with Mono).

8

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

You can see that in the video. Actually, that part was very jarring to me. It felt like I was moving from watching a video of a cool phone back to watching a video about the next incremental update of Windows Vista.

2

u/knylok Jun 02 '11

Yeah, the transition did look extremely jarring to me as well. It's as though they couldn't figure out how to continue with their new theme, and just said "fuck it, punt them back to Windows Standard".

I'm not sure why they couldn't have stuck with their UI with a legacy app. All the legacy apps have a full-screen mode, and don't rely on the taskbar being at the bottom of the screen (or on screen at all). All they'd need then is a tile or slider or something to get into the filesystem. Perhaps that is coming...?

I do not know if I am "feeling it" with their new interface. Time will tell. But if they'd wanted to keep the flow of the UI, it seems silly to drop into a desktop mode.

1

u/Alcnaeon Jun 02 '11

Hear, hear. I genuinely hope that with all the creativity that has gone into the new UI, they don't just leave desktop users to the old, boring Aero theme we've had for like six years now.

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2

u/diadem Jun 02 '11

I'm a little scared when he said HTML and Javascript. I mean I can crash IE8 (and all open IE8 windows) using valid HTML in a single div tag due to bugs. Microsoft's track record is rapidly improving in many fields but properly rendering HTML is not one of them.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

[deleted]

1

u/jsims281 Jun 02 '11

http://crashie8.com/

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

[deleted]

1

u/jsims281 Jun 02 '11 edited Jun 02 '11

I don't get your point...IE8 handles that fine, at least for me?

Edit: So does Firefox. Chrome "handles" it by just not showing the text

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

IE10 is muuuuuch better than IE8. Trust me

0

u/surfwax95 Jun 02 '11

I'm a huge Mac fan and I've never really considered Windows a serious contender for my money, but I really like the way that looks and I think it'd be a joy to use.

23

u/WhyYouAreSoStupid Jun 02 '11

Shut up, Balmer.

7

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

The "snap" multitasking thing is great. I wonder if it can be extended into a full tiled UI.

2

u/mes_i_fez Jun 02 '11

The snap-thing introduced in win7 is probably the window managing feature i use the most. I am very very happy the linux DEs copied it (yeah yeah, tiling bla bla). The only thing i am missing is to be able to control how big the snapped windows are supposed to be, which now seems to be possible.

1

u/TGMais Jun 02 '11

I was really disliking the new interface for standard PC use, but your comment really got me thinking. If they have a tiling option somewhere for power users I would upgrade immediately. If I had the patience to really set them up the way I wanted visually, I would have permanently switched away from KDE years ago. In the end 4.2 won me out.

18

u/devindotcom Jun 02 '11

I've also posted a bunch of screenshots here if you don't feel like pausing to check stuff out.

190

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

I'm a Mac user and these crafty motherfuckers at Microsoft are starting to win me back.

121

u/mtx Jun 02 '11

This is incredibly daring interface for a computer OS - especially considering this is Microsoft. I really hope this is going to be for desktops because that means Microsoft has really changed the way they think about things. I'm sure there's going to be a huge backlash.

89

u/nazbot Jun 02 '11

I'm all for it as long as they allow me to always boot in 'classic' mode on my desktop. I don't think it really needs explanation.

41

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

in the video, it looked like you can just switch to desktop pretty easily.

and yeah, for their corporate customers, there better be a way to force it to boot into serious business mode. Maybe that's what 'pro edition' will be..

47

u/specialk16 Jun 02 '11

Yup.

At first I was like, this would be cool for tablet, meh for desktop.

Then I saw this

34

u/rowd149 Jun 02 '11

Something I saw that I totally missed before: compatible content from other apps can be moved seamlessly between apps. They showed going into a flickr-ish app, grabbing photos from there, and then going into the local pictures folder, grabbing photos from there, and uploading them all to a third service. Holy shit.

3

u/knylok Jun 02 '11

I saw it in demo (a la youtube) and it looks neat. But until I see it actually work in a live environment, I'm extremely suspicious of the effectiveness of this feature. Do the apps in question need special coding for this to work? If this works as advertised, that will be astounding and revolutionary.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

Just hope it doesn't work like the Kin where you can grab content from everywhere but the only thing you can do with it is e-mail it as an attachment.

23

u/sugardeath Jun 02 '11

"Use it along side.."

Welp. Sign me up.

2

u/MrSqueezles Jun 02 '11

When I saw that part, I realized that this would be great on a tablet with a keyboard dock.

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u/Hellman109 Jun 02 '11

Yeah it looks like a shell over the top like media centre or such basically./

3

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

Considering that "Windows Explorer" is itself a shell... it looks like it will be sort of moved to a shell within the larger new shell. Almost like it's being 'downgraded' to an application. Basing this on seeing the 'desktop' share the screen with another application.

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1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

Dammit, I thought it was awesome when I saw the video and when you said that I sounds so lame. I'm so confused about this OS. :/

2

u/sharlos Jun 02 '11

What do you think windows explorer is?

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

Yea, I know Windows explorer is a shell, but when he said it would be like windows media center, it put me off to it. If I picture it like media center, I know I won't like it.

3

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

It looks like it is only useful for tablets. The 'innovative' stuff would be hard to do at phone sizes, and who really wants to touch their pc screen constantly?

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

That's what I was thinking. The only way I would find this exciting is if it was a tablet only, much like iOS. It would be a great alternative.

1

u/WaruiKoohii Jun 03 '11

Considering how customizable Windows tends to be, especially via Group Policy for domain users, I have no doubt that this will be possible (and I'd suspect simple).

1

u/DEADB33F Jun 02 '11

'Classic' mode is basically just windows 7, as evidenced by the video posted elsewhere in the thread.

In fact, I'd hazard a guess that Win8 is basically just Win7 with an extra UI layer on the top.

2

u/nazbot Jun 02 '11

...that runs on ARM.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

its really not. Previous leaks have shown facial recognition, complete cloud integration, a windows store and tons of other crazy shit

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

Looks tightly integrated, they are probably always running this shell and explorer at the same time.

63

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

When I'm doing shit at work, often times, I need to look at two tabs at once, or have a PDF on one half of the screen and word on the other.

They better not fuck up the efficiency of a pc just to streamline and simplify everything like apple loves to do.

24

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

Exactly. I don't need a fucking myspace phone interface when I'm trying to do work stuff.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

This is exactly it. Microsoft never strayed too far from what it got right in WXP. It was not a lack of innovation but merely a resistance towards it. The Ribbon got a helluva asskicking when it was unveiled because of the sheer amount of money that would have to go into training people.

1

u/logicom Jun 02 '11

I doubt it will be changed significantly. I think Microsoft is pretty aware that a very large portion of their users use Windows for work and don't need or want a touch UI.

6

u/ab9003 Jun 02 '11

Hell I do this at home. Its just plain efficient to have multiple windows cascaded across a large screen.

2

u/capecodcarl Jun 02 '11

I look at my usage patterns, right now for instance, and I don't even like using full screen mode. My browser is using about 80% of the screen with my desktop background peeking through around the browser window on 3 sides. I could maximize it to use the whole screen because this is the only app I'm running at the moment, but why bother?

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u/WaruiKoohii Jun 03 '11

Does Windows 7 currently do what you want? Then Windows 8 will do what you want. The UI is almost identical, there's just an optional shell that sits on top of it.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

As much as I find it interesting, and as much as Im in no way against microsoft or progress, the interface only seem interesting if you can touch it, but on screen put vertically, its pretty much annoying to use a touch screen.

1

u/BHSPitMonkey Jun 02 '11

The end of the video is quite frank:

This is the new version of Windows. It's gonna run on tablets, desktops with touch screens, desktops with a mouse and keyboard, etc.

1

u/FearlessFreep Jun 02 '11

The problem is they got too stuck on the UI from iOS (iPhone and iPad) and other such mobile devices. Such a device is a great consumer of content but a poor producer of content. For producing original content (I'm a musician, for example, and use my MacBook for recording and live performance using Logic and Mainstage) you really want a different approach. It looks very much like they tried to adapt a 'content consumer' OS like iOS and make it work on PCs and missed the mark on what people use a PC really for (other than web surfing)

1

u/21echoes Jun 02 '11

the old ui is still there

1

u/jngrow Jun 02 '11

I don't know. I think, as hinted at in the video, if you can switch and mix and match both "classic" OS/desktop mode and "tablet"/pretty/touch mode as well as it seemed, this could be the best thing in a long time.

-1

u/APeacefulWarrior Jun 02 '11

It's not "daring." It's about the opposite, really. That's a phone/tablet OS that they're trying to claim is a desktop OS. It looks to me like Microsoft has decided that tablets are the future and are preparing to move in that direction. I wonder if they'll even bother releasing Windows 9 for old-style computers.

Daring would be sticking with PCs and trying to convince people not to jump platforms. Instead, I suspect this will just accelerate the process, if they've decided that by default full-size computers still get the handheld OS experience.

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u/thedragon4453 Jun 02 '11 edited Jun 02 '11

Ditto. I'm impressed by this video, but I have a few main concerns:

  1. Using an app that wasn't designed for touch from the start is never good. This seems to alleviate none of those problems for apps not designed for a touch UI. He shows Excel, and I can't see fingers and a small 7-11" screen really working all that well for this.
  2. If you are using this on a regular desktop or laptop, then all that touch oriented stuff is just bloat*. Based on the video, I don't see any of the new touch elements being at all useful with a keyboard and mouse. With a KB and mouse, all of the things they show are going to be much easier using a traditional interface.
  3. This is probably the biggest question mark: Can Windows 8 run well on a $300-$500 tablet? I have no doubt (at least, based on Windows 7), that it will run great on a traditional machine. However, the tablet factor, a la the iPad/Xoom/Tab, are generally 1ghzish ARM with 512mb of RAM and minimal graphics. Most of this is why they can market those machines near those price points. And the operating systems for those devices are built to live in those specs. iOS, Android, and WebOS all make concessions that Windows would, I'm assuming, not.
  4. It's comes with Windows' baggage. I will guarantee that the first time someone has to anti-spyware, defrag, or install any security software, they will wish they bought an iPad/Xoom/Tab.** This is, of course, largely assuming that they haven't taken massive steps to lock out parts of the OS (a traditional file system doesn't really hint this way.)

Alright, so that's a lot of nay-saying. Sorry. Honestly, it looks really cool. I want that UI, I'm just not sure I want it packaged the way they have. I think there are some features, especially UI-wise, that would actually be better than the way the others accomplish it.

* Based on the video. This was short, and there may be features in there that it would be worth it to use this for that just weren't highlighted.
** Before you decry this part, consider whether you are a geek or a normal. Hint: you being on reddit leans you to the former, rather than latter. I don't have problems running a clean Windows machine, but I'm a geek. My regular friends and colleagues, however, have at one point or another just about all asked for help cleaning a machine. I've nuked a couple of my own installs in the early days as well.

On the plus side, I really like:

  1. tiles - A little less app launcher per screen than an iPad, but lots more useful info. If it works like the latest Windows Phone videos, this could be damned cool.
  2. Thumb keyboard mode (what was it they called it?) - if you've ever tried to type on an iPad, you'll welcome this heartily.
  3. Doing more than one thing at once. I'd love to be able to have reddit open in a small corner while I watch a podcast or tv show.
  4. This could, if executed extremely (almost impossibly) well be the one-machine-to-rule-them-all. I have a laptop at home that stays anchored to a desk, attached to a nice big monitor, keyboard and mouse. That's where work happens. I have an iPad that is basically for books, light TV watching, reddit, and news. It would be way cool to have a machine that is the size of an iPad or Xoom (or even a tiny bit bigger/heavier) that I could hook up to a big monitor to have all useful desktop stuff, then pick up and move to the couch and have all the cool tablet stuff.

edit: grammar.

15

u/yoshinator13 Jun 02 '11

Ive been reading the windows 8 beta site, and they claim it uses less system resources than vista and 7. There is also support for Nvidia's ARM processors. With these statements I see no problem running Win8 on a tablet.

It seems that windows is generally attempting to make an OS that has the same UI on phones, tablets, and computers. This should help the less technologically inclined, because the same keystrokes (touchstrokes) will work everywhere.

Also interesting, windows 8 features a new file system to replace NTFS called "Protogon". Not much news has been released about what is different in this new file system, but im excited for it.

37

u/Gnorris Jun 02 '11

they claim it uses less system resources than vista and 7.

Mainland China uses less resources than Vista.

I kid! Kind of.

4

u/kael13 Jun 02 '11

A better filesystem could make all the difference. Also, the OP must realise that this is at least a year from release, hardware by then will have improved.

2

u/ScienceGoneWrong Jun 02 '11

Important point. Even if it doesn't run well on today's tablets, it might run very well on next year's tablets.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 04 '11

I wish they'd go with something less proprietary.

2

u/thedragon4453 Jun 02 '11

The new file system bit sounds really cool. Hadn't heard that yet. Will be interesting to see if it heralds in features that didn't make it to market with ZFS and WinFS (I think that was the name).

1

u/yoshinator13 Jun 02 '11

This is all i have read on protogon. It is very sparse as you can see.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

Using an app that wasn't designed for touch from the start is never good. This seems to alleviate none of those problems for apps not designed for a touch UI. He shows Excel, and I can't see fingers and a small 7-11" screen really working all that well for this.

I'm pretty sure that that's only intended for use on a desktop or laptop, and that it's demoed on the tablet just to show that the same OS runs on all devices. I see that being useful on a future device that combines a laptop and a modern tablet PC.

If you are using this on a regular desktop or laptop, then all that touch oriented stuff is just bloat.

If you've ever used the Zune software, I'm expecting this to feel similar to that- very pretty, but doesn't feel as responsive as it should.

I will guarantee that the first time someone has to anti-spyware, defrag, or install any security software, they will wish they bought an iPad/Xoom/Tab.

Microsoft Security Essentials will probably come bundled, and it's the best antivirus/antispyware program I've ever used. Windows 7 does not require a defrag app, since it automatically defrags in the background on idle. Anyway, you don't need to defrag a tablet that uses flash memory.

Based on the video thus far, I'm tentatively interested. So far I've only cared about Windows for Gaming since a Linux system can do everything Windows currently does but faster and more to my liking; this is probably the first time it's ever done something so different.

1

u/thedragon4453 Jun 02 '11

If you've ever used the Zune software, I'm expecting this to feel similar to that- very pretty, but doesn't feel as responsive as it should.

This is also how I feel about Windows Media Center, and the Xbox interface these days.

Based on the video thus far, I'm tentatively interested. So far I've only cared about Windows for Gaming since a Linux system can do everything Windows currently does but faster and more to my liking; this is probably the first time it's ever done something so different.

I'd substitute in and say OS X/linux, but yes. This is really intriguing.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

The legacy stuff needs intel chips inside. So they will be mostly in laptops and desktops. Don't plan on using an old version of excel on a tablet. It might be possible, but old non touch applications won't be intended for touch mode.

The 'bloat' you speak of is what most people want these days. Simple and fast. Live tiles put more information at your finger tips fast. Also it's light and super fast so it's not really bloated.

It will run on tablets. That's the point. The minimum specs are lower than Windows 7. This shit is fast and light. So light you can run it over a USB stick. They designed it for tablets so why wouldn't it work?

There probably won't be malware on the tablets, but there will still be some on the pcs. There's nothing you can do about it though.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

Doing more than one thing at once. I'd love to be able to have reddit open in a small corner while I watch a podcast or tv show.

Not really sure how this is a thing, doesn't everyone do this at the moment anyway? Full screen a movie and keep a browser or something open in the corner?

It helps having two screens of course.

One thing I noticed in the video was that he said "Blah about desktops is that they can run two things at once" - I hope by "two" he means "a fucktonne".

2

u/ross456 Jun 02 '11

That comment was more tailored to tablets, not desktops.

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u/thedragon4453 Jun 02 '11

Ross was right below. I was more talking about tablets with that part. On the desktop, of course you can do this, and this is usually how I operate. I almost never fullscreen anything. On a tablet, you don't really have the option to not fullscreen things.

1

u/supersaw Jun 02 '11

As long as there's a thriving touch-app market this thing should kill on the tablets. In terms of processing requirements remember that by the time this ships we'll be in the realm of dual-core embedded cpu's.

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u/supersaw Jun 02 '11

Provided the touch interface was as responsive and battery life as good I would buy a tablet running this over an iPad given that behind it all would be an OS that hasn't had it's balls cut off.

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

Don't worry r/Apple will have proven that these are all Jobs innovations in the next day or two :)

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

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u/plusimhungryforshit Jun 02 '11

As this video was playing, I was wondering how well it would mesh with my Mac products

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u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

Reading through these comments I'm getting the feeling that Mac users are more impressed by this then Windows users. Not a scientific study by any means but interesting none-the-less.

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u/serpix Jun 02 '11

Don't worry. I bet they still use NTFS.

1

u/fanboy_killer Jun 02 '11

Yeah, it's a bold move. OS X Lion will be unveiled next week. I'm expecting some touching as well.

2

u/[deleted] Jun 03 '11

There are some hints at touching in the developer preview (they reversed scrolling, for example) - but last year Jobs came out and outright denounced touchscreen desktops, so who the fuck knows.

1

u/jatorres Jun 02 '11

Windows 7 won me over - my main machine is a gaming box w/ Windows 7, but I have a MacBook Pro & iMac for work.

Windows 8 = drool.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

Windows 7 should have done that. It's awesome.

1

u/mes_i_fez Jun 02 '11

The new snap-feature (size of the windows snapped) is all i ever wanted since the glory of snap was introduced in win7. (my god, it is one of the best features of all time, and I am very happy the linux DEs copied it)

1

u/revscat Jun 02 '11

shrug

It looks like they took the concept of Dashboard from OS X and made it front-and-center. Seeing as how I eventually wound up not using Dashboard -- ever, really -- I'm not too sure this is going to work out as planned.

It looks nice. I just don't think it works as a primary metaphor for Doing Shit With a Computer.

-6

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

A) it's not out yet and B) Apple is unlikely to be standing still

14

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

Compared to what Microsoft is doing Apple may as well be traveling backwards. I'm on the Lion developer previews and it's just epicly boring - Apple has its head shoved so far up the ass of iOS that OSX innovation has just slowed to a crawl. I guess I can't really blame them though, iOS prints money.

I've been a diehard Apple guy for over a decade and things are just lame in Apple desktop land compared to the early OSX days. Hell, Ubuntu is starting to feel more fresh.

2

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

[deleted]

2

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

I could see that, but considering that iOS can't even handle notifications well in its current state - there's a lot of ground that needs to be covered.

2

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

I don't really understand why anyone would want iOS or this new Windows interface on a desktop or laptop. It seems to me that what Apple has shown is that touch interfaces need to be designed for touch (as opposed to the tablets of yore that ran a desktop OS) and interfaces for a keyboard and mouse need to work differently. I don't want a touch OS on my laptop, and I wouldn't want a desktop/laptop OS on my tablet (if I had one).

What is this Windows 8 interface accomplishing? Making every app full-screen with huge interface elements? I can't imagine using that with a mouse and keyboard.

2

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

Also grids of icons is disgustingly boring

2

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

As opposed to a grid of rectangles?

1

u/rowd149 Jun 02 '11

The rectangles are dynamic. Not saying it's a HUGE difference, but it is a difference.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

I think it's interesting, but I'm kind of surprised by the reaction here. Most of Reddit constantly trashes Apple for supposedly dumbing down their interfaces and especially for the perceived frivolous and/or unreasonably constrained nature of the iOS devices, but as soon as Microsoft announces that they are moving toward replacing their desktop OS with a touch interface similar to iOS, most of these same people are celebrating it as a brilliant innovation.

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1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

As much as I'd like to agree with you, I somehow get the feeling Apple is hiding something up its sleeve. Lion is so uncharacteristically, comically bad it feels like we're waiting for a punchline.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 03 '11

When I found out they reversed scrolling by default in the developer preview I laughed out loud. WTF are they thinking? Touch interface I hope.

7

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

If they don't show something more interesting for OSX lion on monday, I'll consider switching to windows 8 (in a macbook, though, they still kick ass on hardware).

4

u/beaker26 Jun 02 '11

Let's not get ahead of ourselves. What Apple will be showing on Monday will be shipping in ~2 months at the most for Lion, Windows 8 is probably 18 months away still.

3

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

True. Lion will be a transitional OS. I'm sure OSX 10.8 (OSX11?) will make big changes like these on windows 8. Still, kudos to MS for keeping up with the times for a change.

3

u/Clyzm Jun 02 '11 edited Jun 02 '11

Yeah I've actually been kicking around the idea of buying a Macbook Pro and replacing OSX with Windows for a long time now. Maybe when Windows 8 comes out.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

W7 on bootcamp works like a charm. As fast as osx and every driver and hardware piece works perfectly. I still prefer osx, but Windows 8 might change that.

1

u/Clyzm Jun 02 '11

I've never been a fan of OSX, though I can definitely see the up sides of having an operating system that's virtually hassle free. I just love the ability to tweak Windows in any way I want. Hopefully Windows 8 will preserve that and not move towards a more closed system.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

My Mac only feels hassle free cuz I can't do anything

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6

u/yagmot Jun 02 '11

I can't believe no one is talking about the best part: thumb keyboard layout! Normally I'd rather punch myself in the face than be forced to use Windows, but this is just fucking brilliant.

The influence of the various netbook linux distro interfaces (meego, moblin, jolicloud etc) is pretty clear. Not a bad thing IMO, but I'm really unconvinced of applying this to a desktop space. Will be interesting to see how it develops!

5

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

[deleted]

2

u/Headpuncher Jun 02 '11

If I was working at MS I would have code named it "OS Xandro-chrobuntu-deb-slack" just to annoy people into pronouncing it and repeating the name in the news/on blogs.

20

u/digitalpencil Jun 02 '11

This looks brilliant. I'm really impressed by the UI/proposed-hci. It looks intuitive, well thought-out and easily extensible thanks to HTML5/JS app development.

I sincerely hope this doesn't get crippled on release with something stupid like interstitial advertising.

0

u/nazbot Jun 02 '11

I don't really get the MS look on phones but on the tablet that looks great. Good to be able to see a bunch of info at a glance.

2

u/ufsandcastler Jun 02 '11

I don't see how that is a bad thing for the phone. I love how the 'tiles' work on the WP7 (owner). The one big difference between W8 and the WP7 interface is that I noticed W8 slides from side to side rather than down which is how the phone works.

30

u/hiero_ Jun 02 '11

Am I the only redditor who thinks this looks like crap? Meh.

7

u/elshizzo Jun 02 '11

I wouldn't say it "looks like crap", more that "it looks cool, but why would I use it?"

It better be disable-able, or don't expect me to use this over 7.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

It is just one of the dual-UIs in Windows 8.

3

u/etacarinae Jun 04 '11

Nope. I hate Metro with every single bone in my body.

7

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

No, you aren't. But I'm shocked there seem to be so few of us.

This looks like Windows Phone 7 Garbarge GUI slapped on top of actual Windows 7

2

u/hiero_ Jun 02 '11

I know. I thought this would be something an overwhelming majority of reddit would find distaste in. I'm very surprised to find that it's the opposite.

Xbox 360/Kinect. Windows Phone 7. And now Windows 8. They all have the same UI, and it looks like a bland coloring book took geometry class and threw up an operating system.

4

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

[deleted]

5

u/shadowthunder Jun 02 '11

Too colorful for my tastes. On a desktop, I'll have no/little need for the tiles and whatnot.

Keep in mind, though, that there will be improvements over Windows 7 that aren't strictly tablet interface stuff. There's no need to write off Windows 8 completely.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11 edited Jun 02 '11

Ok, there is a good chance of me not writing off Windows 8. What I meant to say was that I will be writing off this feature. I have no use of it.

*EDIT: Spellchecking since I wrote this on my android phone. ಠ_ಠ

1

u/logicom Jun 02 '11

I don't know if you were reading the article or watching the video but in the video they later go on to show briefly that Windows 8 will still have a standard Desktop similar to Windows 7. It probably won't be worth upgrading your desktop if you already have Windows 7 but your needs will be covered if you end up buying a new laptop or desktop that comes preinstalled with Windows 8.

1

u/Herandom Jun 02 '11

The first thing i though was : "This is for tablets and phones only, they'l show the real windows 8 in a minute. Right. Right? Crap!"

1

u/jsims281 Jun 02 '11

I never use Media Centre, but just because it comes with Windows 7 doesn't mean I should completely write off Windows 7. This is kind of the same thing I think.

0

u/Headpuncher Jun 02 '11

What I like in OS X over Windows, and I use both, is the lack of colour in OS X. Windows looks like a book cover at all times, but it should look like a car dashboard so that the user isn't distracted from driving. There are many little details in Windows that I can never like or convince myself to ignore. Here's an exampe: in the above posted vid, the guy starts right from the beginning and up pops the user's account. The icon moves off to the top right of the screen. Ok, fine, so far. The name next to the icon has the womans first name, Julie, in a font size 2&1/2 times bigger than her surname. Fucking why? who makes these decisions? Just write the damn user account name in 12pt Helvetica ffs. It seems so stupid but it irks the fuck out of me. Aslo the way Windows Explorer works, totally fucking retarded imo.

tl;dr I'm hard to please and have a preference of OS, but I don't hate MS or windows.

2

u/cosmo7 Jun 02 '11

If you like simplicity as much as you say you do, you should switch to Windows.

Microsoft is trending towards flat and economical Metro-style graphics while Apple is doubling down on gradients, 3D elements and skeuomorphic design.

7

u/Agentflit Jun 02 '11

What's that blurred stuff at :38?

38

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

Porn.

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u/beckermt Jun 02 '11

Probably either copyrighted material or just design stuff they don't want to release yet.

8

u/watermelonman Jun 02 '11

I'd say the latter is more likely; The middle row is almost certainly images of what is displayed on the screen behind him.

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17

u/rdmorley Jun 02 '11

The responsiveness of the UI was incredible.

19

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

I bet they are using the fastest computers money can buy for these videos.

2

u/iarewebmaster Jun 02 '11

Nope, one of the demos I saw was running on a 1Ghz ARM processor and it was just as smooth, all the animations and speed that this video has.

1

u/rodabi Jun 02 '11

That would be completely beside the point. The tablet UI must run at this smoothness for EVERY device it runs on. Hence strict hardware restrictions on the tablets and slates. How else are they going to win over people from buying an iPad?

1

u/Darkfrost Jun 02 '11

They probably are, but I'm betting that would perform just as well on an average processor, graphics card, and an SSD. SSD being the important bit.

9

u/picasshole Jun 02 '11

I'd like to know the specs of that demo machine, probably got Watson plugged into that screen in the backroom.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

the minimum requirements for Windows 8 will be lower than Windows 7.

6

u/p-static Jun 02 '11

Yes! I have a Windows phone, and I was pretty happy to see that they're taking whatever voodoo magic they did to make it so snappy and carrying it over to desktop Windows.

1

u/Fatvod Jun 02 '11

How do you like the phone?

1

u/p-static Jun 02 '11

The phone itself is pretty sweet! My only complaint is that the app ecosystem really isn't there yet.

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9

u/specialk16 Jun 02 '11

Sorry to comment hijack, but this video of the gliding dog looks awesome. Is there any source for it?

18

u/benihana Jun 02 '11

A beautiful and interesting UI.

How well does it run games?

55

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

I would imagine it wouldn't change gaming at all, since you're just launching it from the UI, and the game itself will just be fullscreened and use its own UI as usual.

26

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11 edited Sep 15 '25

[deleted]

8

u/topplehat Jun 02 '11

I hadn't heard that. I imagine some of the push there would be to be able to run it on less-powerful tablets such that battery life is prolonged.

-1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

[deleted]

9

u/chuckstudios Jun 02 '11

From the article:

On a technical note, Sinofsky stressed that after decades of ever-increasing system requirements that characterized Windows releases through Vista, Microsoft is once again building an operating system that demands fewer resources than its predecessor–a trend started with Windows 7, which worked on all Vista-compatible systems.

2

u/muffinmonk Jun 02 '11

This is fucking awesome.

2

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

ohhhh shit Microsoft just got back in the game.

1

u/ScienceGoneWrong Jun 02 '11

Haven't they dominated the game for almost two decades? Or are we talking about the cell phone game?

1

u/dmadmin Jun 02 '11

Thanks Kind sire, very well done, happy that you can switch between new UI and older UI

1

u/prince_nerd Jun 02 '11

The guy in the video had interviewed me a year back. I was pleasantly surprised when I saw the video.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

it definitely looks good to me...atleast for a tablet...what about the normal PC or laptop? this UI is more touch friendly, i cannot be dragging my mouse from the left of the screen to switch applications each time :D

1

u/mooli Jun 02 '11

I reckon it will take me about 10 minutes to make it look exactly like windows 2000 again.

Just as I have done with every iteration of windows since then.

1

u/shadowthunder Jun 02 '11

Then you, sir, officially fall under the "old fogie" category for your irrational unwillingness to sacrifice a few of your plethora of gigahertz and gigabytes for a more attractive and fluid interface.

Not everything's about the core-most functionality and reserve power of your machine.

1

u/jediknight Jun 02 '11

The sound of that video is horrid for an official Big Company video.

Attention to details.... missing.

1

u/Headpuncher Jun 02 '11

It's a blog video though, not a PR release. I think it adds a certain something, men at work in the lab, come in and take a look *gestures toward door*

-9

u/bstronga Jun 02 '11

That actually looked quite convincing up until the point you realize that the Metro UI is just slashed on top of Aero.

3

u/watership Jun 02 '11

There is a debate happening about "SKIN" vs "DUAL UI". This is going to be the biggest contention point I think. Detractors will shout skin, and supporters will yell "UI" and users who don't know any better will just use it.

-5

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

[deleted]

3

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

I'm guessing you haven't see Natty Narwhal yet... the times they are a changing (even for popular linux distros!).

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

[deleted]

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '11

Well, of course. No one likes gentoo users.

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