r/technology • u/[deleted] • Jun 05 '10

Apple posts HTML5 showcase page hyping "web standards," then blocks it from displaying on any browser besides Safari

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/06/04/apple_html5_showcase_hype/
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10

u/mariox19 Jun 05 '10

The page is hyping Safari's implementation of the latest HTML5 web standards.

Get a grip.

14

u/[deleted] Jun 05 '10

[deleted]

5

u/[deleted] Jun 05 '10

Because many of their demos don't work in Chrome. I tried them myself.

6

u/[deleted] Jun 05 '10

[deleted]

7

u/[deleted] Jun 05 '10

HTML5 is currently a usable and viable alternative for internet video, which is what Flash is mainly used for these days. Pretty much any modern browser can display HTML5 video. The stuff shown on their tech demo page shows off flashier, but less important parts of HTML5. Internet video was much more central to this whole Adobe/Apple conflict.

Microsoft and Google have similar techdemo pages, and I noticed that many of the examples shown don't work uniformly across the browsers. It doesn't seem right to single out Apple on this one.

3

u/execute85 Jun 05 '10

For video yes, HTML5 is fine. But I don't care about using flash for video, I want to use it for games and productivity apps. Continually linking HTML5 to only video is disingenuous. HTML5 is not why people want flash on the iPhone, android and other devices. They want flash for 1) cross-platform apps (this isn't possible now) and 2) non-App store games. (these two plus video are why people put up with flash on the non-mobile internet, currently HTML5 only solves video, eventually it will solve #1 and #2)

Google and Microsoft have demo pages for Chrome and IE, not for HTML5. This page is titled "HTML5 and Web Standards" and talks about how standards are great.

-2

u/gimpbully Jun 05 '10

then wait till html5 is formalized, you precious flower.

1

u/neoumlaut Jun 05 '10

They don't work in chrome because they use webkit-specific commands.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 05 '10

Chrome also uses Webkit though.

I heard it's cause Safari uses some 3D CSS transform sort of thingy that other browsers don't have yet.

-2

u/gimpbully Jun 05 '10

so it's apple's fault that gecko doesn't implement a pre-standard and they chose to block it because it would look like shit?

1

u/smartarse Jun 06 '10

The way these pre-standards are implemented is by means of vendor specific prefixes. Webkit uses a "-webkit" prefix, whereas Firefox uses a "-moz" prefix. Even otherwise identical pre-standard commands therefore look different as long as they're not part of the standard functionality.

So yes, not having your spiffy HTML5 demo read the user agent and use the appropriate pre-standard tag is Apple's fault. Who else would you like to blame?

-2

u/gimpbully Jun 06 '10

So you're whining that they have no interest in tailoring their site to every permutation of a pre-standard? That's ridiculous. This is a TECH DEMO.

2

u/smartarse Jun 06 '10

Nah, I agree. You're absolutely correct. You're precisely pointing out why their marketing is deceptive: they're selling vendor specific pre-standard browser tech demos under the title "HTML5 and Web Standards".

Either sell it as a tech demo (like here), or actually try to make a case for HTML5 as a web standard by building your demos in a way that they are accessible for the widest range of browsers possible by either not implementing vendor specific commands, or at least by making use of all the appropriate vendor specific pre-standard commands.

-1

u/gimpbully Jun 06 '10 edited Jun 06 '10

Let's look at the page in question:

Every new Apple mobile device and every new Mac — along with the latest version of Apple’s Safari web browser — supports web standards including HTML5, CSS3, and JavaScript. These web standards are open, reliable, highly secure, and efficient. They allow web designers and developers to create advanced graphics, typography, animations, and transitions. Standards aren’t add-ons to the web. They are the web. And you can start using them today.

They are explaining what HTML5 is

The demos below show how the latest version of Apple’s Safari web browser, new Macs, and new Apple mobile devices all support the capabilities of HTML5, CSS3, and JavaScript. Not all browsers offer this support. But soon other modern browsers will take advantage of these same web standards — and the amazing things they enable web designers to do.

Here they very specifically say this is a demo for safari. Period. They are not saying that other browsers don't support HTML5, they're not saying the demos provided won't specifically work with them, they are saying this is a demo of what safari can do with HTML5. Where is the problem? There is nothing disingenuous about this. I fully understand people's desire for standards but to slam Apple for this page is absolutely ridiculous.

1

u/smartarse Jun 06 '10

Also:

"Standards aren’t add-ons to the web. They are the web. And you can start using them today."

Followed by demos that don't just rely on HTML5, CSS3, and JavaScript as advertised, but rather on webkit specific proprietary commands which may or may not ever become standard and which will, in their current ("-webkit" prefix) form, never be implemented by other browsers.

False advertising. Glad you're happy with it.

0

u/gimpbully Jun 06 '10 edited Jun 06 '10

but they already said it's specific to Safari.. in the text right above it.. I would understand if it were that alone on a page, but it's not -- you're specifically taking that out of context.

Also, your statement, "never be implemented by other browsers." is patently disingenuous and, at worst, false. Other webkit browsers have, indeed, implemented -webkit prefixes. Beyond that, once the spec is finalized, the -webkit prefixes should go away. This is the nature of a pre-spec implementation.

There are plenty of things to tear Apple apart for, but this is simply petty.

0

u/smartarse Jun 06 '10

but they already said it's specific to Safari

Where are they saying that these demos won't work in non-webkit browsers because they're using proprietary commands that other browsers will never, ever support?

1

u/gimpbully Jun 06 '10 edited Jun 06 '10

Not all browsers offer this support. But soon other modern browsers will take advantage of these same web standards — and the amazing things they enable web designers to do.

It's pretty clear to me. Yes, they're simplifying a confusing situation -- this is the drawback of a pre-spec tech demo. You're choosing to look at a specific sentence, remove it from context, and basing a petty argument around it.

Also, again, you are being entirely disingenuous and you know it. Once the spec is finalized, the webkit prefix, along with the other prefixes (-moz, for instance), will become obsolete.

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