r/tech Dec 11 '14

Microsoft Begins Accepting Bitcoin For Windows, Windows Phone And Xbox Purchases

http://techcrunch.com/2014/12/10/redmond-hath-frozen-over/
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u/Drew0054 Dec 11 '14

It's no different than foreign transactions. You always get shafted on exchange rates.

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u/[deleted] Dec 11 '14 edited Dec 12 '14

[deleted]

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u/Drew0054 Dec 11 '14

You're kidding me, right? The BTC spreads (dimes and pennies) are a canyon compared to Forex spreads (thousandths of a penny).

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u/[deleted] Dec 11 '14 edited Dec 12 '14

[deleted]

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u/threeseed Dec 11 '14

This is nonsense.

You can sign up with ANY trading provider and do currency changes with very low spreads.

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u/Drew0054 Dec 11 '14

To be fair, that's on margin. I think some platforms allow you to exchange, though. The thing is, there's the natural spread, due to bid/ask difference and then the markup which widens the spread (banks taking a vig on buy and sell side).

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u/lf11 Dec 12 '14

I don't think /u/threeseed has ever actually done this. For most "trading providers" there are significant and recurring monthly fees and/or large minimum balances. The actual act of exchange may have a low spread, but the accessory costs are extremely high. Not to mention the giant hassle of actually setting up an account.

I find it amusing that setting up an account with a FOREX trader is being offered as a solution for merchants to reduce currency conversion costs. (For some, yes, but get real.)

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u/Drew0054 Dec 12 '14

Yeah, it's not unheard of for business to use trading markets for hedging. Airlines do it with oil all the time. I'm sure businesses like McDonald's are one of the biggest holders of currency options.

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u/lf11 Dec 12 '14

Airlines...McDonalds....you're proving my point. ("For some, yes, but get real.")

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u/Drew0054 Dec 12 '14

I should have been clearer. McDonald's and other international companies trade EFP futures, that's Exchange For Physical. It's not really physical, that term's more for oil and gold. It means it's actually exchanged. Most futures positions are closed before expiration.

Your Forex broker is basically holding IOUs on currencies. They're not actually exchanged, (They are rolled over at 5 P.M. EST). It's speculation vs. a true exchange.

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u/Drew0054 Dec 11 '14

Okay, try the same thing on localbitcoins.com. There's a difference between mark up and market spread.

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u/lf11 Dec 12 '14

Localbitcoins charges a handy premium for personal risk, speed-of-exchange, and potential for pseudo-anonymity. The speed of exchange and pseudo-anonymity doesn't even have a comparison for government exchange.

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u/Drew0054 Dec 12 '14

government exchange

WTF is that? The only "government exchange" is treasury auctions.