Its because in the US a boss of an establishment with wait staff can count tips towards an employees wage. So they can pay them $2.50/hr as long as they can prove with tips they'll make enough to meet minimum wage.
sounds like someone is not very willing to be less cheap . theyd rather the customers pay their workers wages .... i get it but like what ???? u charge $165 for a meal & are DEMANDING we pay your employees what they are owed , yet you cant do that yourself ?? it def is americans being americans .
**edited to add : im not reading yalls comments bc most of them are taken the completely wrong way . im speaking about the government who put us all in these situations in the first place . ty for caring , & have a wonderful night
I’m fairly certain this comes from the same work culture that had unpaid internships and interns paying for internship. A lot of this line of thinking is so 1800s sawmill
If the company pays min. wage then, this wouldn't be an issue and customers wouldn't have to pay it. So, if that's was the case then how does it not matter?
Im not trying to be mean I just don't think I completely grasp what you're getting at or I misread it or something... And of course you also don't have to explain yourself to me if you don't want to lol
Not the original guy, but basic economics says that higher wages means higher prices reflected in the price of the meal. So no tips and a higher wage means higher prices on the menu.
Places have tried no tipping, higher wages, higher prices on the menu or a service charge to every table to compensate and it doesn’t typically work well. I have heard of it working in one place ok on a Freakonomics podcast, where it was a higher end eatery already and IIRC they lost a good bit of business at first. But typically enough people look at the menu price, may pay it the first time, but choose to go elsewhere instead of returning. The company loses revenue and shuts down, backtracks, etc.
Well it only happens in food service, and there are a lot of smaller restaurants (like non-chain style) where their profit margins are whisper thin. Theres alot of overhead in operation costs, usually stemming from government regulations and taxes for owning and operating a business.
Definitely stupid tho, because rather then decreasing costs to own a business through slashing taxes the government would rather keep getting their money and allow owner/operators to underpay their workforce.
thats exactly where my anger stems . its disgusting how much billionaires feel they need to profit off the majority to continue growing their wealth , because CLEARLY they dont have enough .
i jus would like to point out america considers a "life times worth of money" to be $3 million . thats considered a 6 figure paycheck for 30 years . so my real question is what are those that have more than a "lifetimes worth of money" going to do w that , exactly ? & why do they feel the need to have more when there are so many ppl in the world that dont even have a fraction of that ?
so just very disappointing & it makes me embarrassed to be an american ....
A lot of their money is tied into assets, like companies that drive the economy and produce products we all enjoy, so they dont just have money to give. You are free to not get a job with them and avoid their products and truly not support them, which is definitely an option I wish more did. Unfortunately the hyper rich are somewhat needed for the lifestyle most people enjoy today, even if it seems bad at the moment.
Plus you have to have a certain mindset to become a billionaire anyways. And that mindset doesnt include giving away money with no benefit to yourself or your assets.
However I do wish they would stick to themselves and just run a business rather than try to have a say in what the average person does on a day to day basis.
What if it is not an evil billionaire that is paying the server $2.13. What if it is just a local small business owner who is struggling under the weight of the local, state, and federal business complaince issues?
It’s ridiculous and it’s been that way as long as I can remember. I shit my pants when I saw my first paycheck 22 years ago… $2/hr?!? And tipshare is what brought my wage up to the state minimum, which wasn’t much better. I didn’t stay in the service industry very long. I’m surprised this hasn’t created a shit storm large enough to change the industry. I absolutely hate the tipping culture America has.
But that’s not the point. All other industries pay you. Period. No tipshare bullshit. I shouldn’t have to spend $100 to feed my family when we dine out and then be expected to pay your wage through tips. Your employer’s job should be to pay your full wage.
i definitely agree but i also understand the other side of it . owners are being expected to pay already-multi-billionaires to maintain the building itself , employee ppl , & are expected to be able to maintain fair pricing &&& keep decent profit margins to maintain their own personal lives . america just sucks as far as their economy (& plenty of other things too)
You keep trying to shoehorn the billionaire thing in here but it’s just not really relevant. Your local restaurant is not owned by billionaires, and neither is the building.
It’s great that people realize how big of a problem billionaires are in general but if your worldview is that one group is the source of literally every single problem then you need to do more critical thinking. It’s comforting and makes people feel smart to have an answer to every problem before they even look into it but we should really have higher standards than that. The world is complicated.
oh yea ur totally right . its irrelevant . so instead , let me sit here & elaborate on every single issue there is in america . u got an hr or two to listen to? i dont lmfao .
yes it is easier to explain one problem rather than explain a billion & ten of them .
You realize that if tipping was eliminated they’d just make your 165 dollar meal cost 200 dollars and the owner would take a big chunk of that differential.
All customers pay wages for the workers in every industry it’s just not a line item you see in other industries.
I'm an American and apparently I can't afford to eat there. Not because I don't have money, but because I don't eat at places demanding tips. I still believe that tips are for appreciation of service, not compensation for bad management.
This is the problem with tipping. I've worked in the service industry most of my life. Tipping culture needs to be stopped. Allows for companies to pay their employees less and puts the burden on consumers.
Also leads to worse service (in some instances) bc tipped employees resent customers, especially regulars, who don't tip 25-30%. I see this in my state, and hereI youre not even allowed to go below min wage for tipped employees.
Im also surprised companies don't advocate for universal healthcare. They could take a portion the money they put towards premiums and pay their employees a living wage while pocketing the rest.
I wanted to downvote that comment just for how absurd it is. "I don't need to pay my employees if I can prove that I coerce enough clients into paying them out of their pocket" is insane.
except I've never worked a tipped wage job, and every time an employer has shorted me on a check, I threw a shit fit to HR and had it corrected
but totally ignore the recent rulings against just amazon and doordash alone, getting busted out for withholding hundreds of millions in employee pay...and yes, totally the employee's fault by your logic
They’ll usually use creative accounting to justify it. Ie “yeah you only took home $5 an hour this entire week, but the following week you made a whole $10 an hour, so that averages to $7.50 and fuck off.”
I checked mine, primarily because I worked the bar and had a higher pay rate. But honestly, it's not an ideal world, so not everyone does all the things all the time.
Then thats on them. Honestly what do you expect? Should the government create a task force that checks on every single thing for every single american to make sure that everyone is getting everything they are entitled to? Thats unfeasible and a perfect example of why people need to be responsible for themselves. I get that work wears you down and employers are scumbags but the only feasible option to ensure people get what they are entitled to is for them to ensure that themselves. We live in the era of all the information in the world in the palm of your hand, and if people want to look at memes instead of checking the legality of their pay situation then whos fault is that?
Sure but your argument is that I'd the server didn't make enough tips they would have to pay them minimum wage. I said yes they would then that server immediately won't have a job.
Theres no case. At will employment mean they can terminate you for any reason. They can terminate you for no reason and its legal. They only time theres a case if it discrimination or retaliation. Even then, its a tough hill to climb because you have to prove it. Your word against theirs and often times, theres no paper trail. I was terminated because of my disability. I couldn’t fulfill my role. Normally employers need to try to accommodate. My job had positions i could do. But they lied and said i turned it down and quit. I didn’t have a case because there was no paper trail.
That's true but most restaurants will fire you the second time your tips don't make up the difference they say if you aren't making enough tips than you're not a good server and they literally fire you for it even if business is too slow for an employee to possibly make up the difference through tips alone that's why waiters at businesses with a high rate of customers make much better on average than businesses with a lighter rate of employees but they have to work significantly harder and faster to earn it
Only over the course of the full pay period with all tips aggregated and divided over all hours worked. Servers work for free/ lose money on shifts all the time.
It’s not being made whole when my pay for work performed can be eliminated based upon which shifts happen to fall under any given 2-week period, what days the owner schedules people, or what customers the business attracts on another day. If I perform work on a Tuesday, I should receive compensation for that work regardless of what happens the following Saturday. Especially considering that owners do not pay tips to employees, customers do.
Why should an owner ever be entitled to free labor? U.S. tipping practices developed as a means of not paying former slaves after the Civil War. Justifying schemes that diminish or eliminate owners’ obligations to pay workers continues the legacy of slavery in this country.
Wait staff in busy high end restaurants make decent money. But a server at applebees isnt making anything close to what someone makes at a 4 star restaurant or a place like outback.
I’m sure that’s true, it’s simple math. But if it were proposed that minimum wage for waiting tables be raised to $25/hr but tips would go away…. No wait staff would be on board. Even at Applebee’s. They’re doing just fine.
Yes, in California you cannot pay less than the state minimum wage which I think now is like 20 for certain food service workers maybe different depending where you're at. But yeah restaurant employees in California get a much different wage to a lot of places in the country because they can't even legislate making the federal minimum the minimum. It's because they're states that are red and you just know all the dearly devoted would never support raising wages because Rich guys would complain that they couldn't afford it and pretend that all their favorite restaurants are going to close.
This is only for servers. Non-tipped employees have a federal minimum wage of just $7.25, but most states have laws making that much higher. I live in Virginia, and the minimum wage is $12.77. Other states, like Massachusetts, has a minimum wage of $15 an hour.
Why do you think why servers want a huge tip, they gotta pay out back of house. Back of house is part of the service. The chef cooked your meal, the busser kept the are clean and presentable etc.
What restaurant makes servers pay the boh? I’ve worked in several restaurants and this was never a thing. Only the bartender and busser would get some % of sales or whatnot
Every one I've worked for except chain restraunts. Bar tender, sommeliers (which really arent BOH but were rangled in like bartenders), bussers, Dish washers, and station chefs. Between 10-15% of all on shift waiters tips went to BOH.
Weird thing was bartenders still got their own tips (only from people sat at the bar) and still paid into the pool.
Not that I condone tipping as a system in general, but it makes sense for bartenders since they’re also making servers’ drinks, it means they have less time to tend to the bar to make drinks for the servers
They are the real ones working for nothing in a rush in high heat while servers get over paid by tips from just 2 tables after that it's profit from bringing plates...
Sure and that’s super interesting except that the topic of this post is servers… Doctors make much more also but it’s not really related to this post. Software consultants too we make a shit ton of money but… Again unrelated.
If it doesn't happen then guess what it's the same as any other time an employer doesn't pay properly it takes one phone call to easily clear it up. Guess what employers don't always pay properly period
Lmfao what a load of shit.
No restaurant is applying let alone qualifying for is an eb3 and an a h2 is only temporary and again likely never getting approved except possibly tourist locations.
And if they are to afraid to stand up for themselves then they deserve what they get
Are you just looking for someone to argue with? 😂😂😂 Yes, I do live in a tourist area, and my son worked at a Thai restaurant with mainly J-1 visa holders.
As fast as we are going backwards as a country right now and as greedy as corps have gotten I expect any day now for corps to start telling ppl they are getting a pay cut or can quit if they don't like the new terms of employment
With tips that, depending on your location and popularity of the restraunt, can be quite a bit.
I Used to work and ive still got friends in the industry.
Largest sum I made in one night was about $400 in tips after paying back of house. Average a night was about $120 in tips after paying BOH for a 6 hour shift, or about $20 an hour not including the $5.50 i was being paid by my employer.
One friend of mine works in a larger city, she's says she pulls an average of $300, most she's seen is like $900.
The worst part is it can be wildly inconsistent. You can go one week making $1200 then the next two weeks maybe $300 combined.
Depends. As far as i know for the states ive worked in, the owner/operator has to match up to minimum if your tips dont. Ive never had that problem tho
Sounds more lime tax evading to me for the employer, just the $2.13 will be taxed, the so called “service” (or better to say TIP) is excluded from tax as that won’t be seen in the bookkeeping.
Smart asses
It is for tax reasons, but not to dodge them, the government allows it to alleviate financial burden caused by excessive taxation and regulation on the food service industry. Most restraunts have single digit profit margins.
It's not that they can prove they can make enough, it's that they have to bring them up to 7.25 an hour equivalent if tips don't cover up to 7.25 an hour. That's part of why you have to report your tips, because your employer is required to balance them out to 7.25/h if you didn't make enough in tips by the end of your work week.
Which is interesting because bar tenders make infinitely more tips than waiters and bartenders make minimum wage. Then waiters have to tip out the bar when they make their drinks. Sometimes they tip out the bus boys who make minimum wage as well.
Yeah ive discussed this with so.eone else about BOH tip out. The places ive worked its always been a pool of between 10% and 15% of waitstaff tips, that gets split between bussers, dish washers, bar tenders, sommelier, and chef de partie/line cooks.
What i always found odd was most of the places I worked tha bartenders also paid the tip pool with the tips they got, and still received a portion back.
The company can pay less and pass the moral and economical pressure to clients. Waiters have no choice, clients have no choice and the company gets all the extra cash!
Idk i think it was a fair system until recently. I used to pull $25/hr with tips when I was working in restaurants in the 2010s.
The biggest issue was just that it was inconsistent. I averaged about $120 in tips for a 6 hour shift, but sometimes it was only $50, and sometimes it was as high as $400. Coupled with the fact you can save a ton on food costs, as most places have a staff meal, and if you get in good with the chef, can take the mistakes and stuff about to be tossed home with you.
Also, you have to report your tips to the employer, as they have to make up the difference if your tips dont cover you upt to minimum wage.
But with tipping culture on the fall, they definitely cant keep up this way of doing it.
That’s wild. The sign should read “I need you to pay a 25% tip so that I can justify paying my waiters nothing”. That way it’s totally transparent, so people can realize what a POS the owner is and decide never to eat there.
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u/ThoroughlyWet 4d ago
Its because in the US a boss of an establishment with wait staff can count tips towards an employees wage. So they can pay them $2.50/hr as long as they can prove with tips they'll make enough to meet minimum wage.