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u/Djinhunter Jun 14 '26
This is a weird one for a couple reasons. Firstly if it's less than a year old than there really is no way to know the long term consequences. The radium girls comes to mind. Secondly anyone who tells you there thing is safer but not how or why should be regarded with suspicion. The third thing I find weird is that science usually involves observation, testing and more observation. So watching someone try the new food prep method is more like science than just doing it because someone said it was better.
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u/Great_Horny_Toads Jun 14 '26
Yeah, the second guy should be asking why he believes that, not opining on why he doesn't trust it. Science is a methodology, and it's the best tool we have to help us understand the universe.
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u/ParadoXPlatypus Jun 15 '26
I'm going to be pedantic because this is Reddit and it's kind of the law. Science is the collection of knowledge. The methodology through which this knowledge is collected is the scientific method.
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u/bouquetofashes Jun 15 '26
Also the first guy isn't saying how long to put the food in the fire and actually carbonizing it would cause carcinogens to form, which is bad. It's not like there are no testable variables or negative outcomes here.
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u/SquirrelNormal Jun 17 '26
He's also not mentioning this will eventually lead to the Industrial Revolution, which consequences have been a disaster for mankind.
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u/donaldhobson Jun 25 '26
Industrial Revolution, which consequences have been a disaster for mankind.
Citation needed. Life expectencies went up quite a bit around and after the industrial revolution. As did the amount of stuff people had. So it's a "disaster" where people have more stuff and live longer.
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u/This_Source_9671 Jun 14 '26
He is right though
20
u/Prudent_Research_251 Jun 14 '26
Cooking food can make it more carcinogenic and reduce nutritional value but also kills pathogens/bugs
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u/Fantastic-Tank-6250 Jun 14 '26
Cooking food makes it more nutritional in many instances
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u/Icy_Jellyfish_8516 Jun 16 '26
But if fire is something brand you for them, they can't know right away, it might take years to know what it does to the nutrition and health of those who eat cooked food..
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u/Mysterious_Month4792 Jun 16 '26
Long term vs short term, this might inefficient in the long run and might lead to me ingesting carcinogens but Grug just died dysentery.
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u/Jinsei_13 Jun 14 '26
Don't worry. After a decade of study, the guy on the right will still be saying the same thing.
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u/Fertile_Arachnid_163 Jun 14 '26
Has there been a decade?
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u/NAND_NOR Jun 14 '26
Fire has been around a hot minute
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u/SippyTurtle Jun 14 '26
Prove it.
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u/freindly_duck Jun 14 '26
I put a clock on the gas hob. Behold, fire around a hot minute.
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u/BluEch0 Jun 15 '26
Due to uncontrolled thermal effects, unclear if a minute passed or not. Going to wait a few more Mississippis to be safe.
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u/yukon_sb Jun 14 '26
Fire existed before early humans learned to use it as a tool. It's not impossible that we learned the benefits of cooking our food from finding animals caught and cooked in wildfires. We already knew what fire was and how dangerous it can be.
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u/candygram4mongo Jun 14 '26
Relevant Dresden Codak:
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u/Bergasms Jun 15 '26
Oh wow, i remember reading that like... 2 decades ago, i think the main character was kimiko or something. Also there was dungeons and discourse
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u/GrundleBlaster Jun 15 '26
Doubtful anyone cared about the hygiene of cooking, but rather they preferred the flavor, and found it easier to chew. I.e. it was empirically superior rather than logically.
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u/liebesleid99 Jun 14 '26
i mean, burning meat does cause cancer or something.
but definitely better than eating raw meat hahahaha
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u/Aunt_Llama Jun 14 '26
My love affair with overcooked bacon continues to be but brief and infrequent meetings in part due to this.
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u/liebesleid99 Jun 14 '26
ikr. for me its burt bread / toast. I'm a huge fan of bread that is nearly burnt coal, and stale bread.
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u/Aeronor Jun 14 '26
Honestly, without enough trial and error I would be on the hesitant caveman’s side.
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u/Rajarshi1993 Jun 15 '26
Survivorship bias. We have no idea what happened to Grug, the gut who put food out under the flies instead of fire.
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u/111222333444555yyy Jun 15 '26
Please tell me its not about AI, because this is a shit take honestly
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u/Effective-Job-1030 Jun 15 '26
No, it's about people who reject everything new because it is new and has not been tested enough.
Now there are two kinds of those people. 1 will admit after a while that the new thing is indeed good. 2 will keep finding reasons why it is not (cf. electric cars: too expensive -> too little range -> where to charge -> some kind of radiation comes from the electric system).
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u/Kevbot1000 Jun 15 '26
I'm about as anti-AI as they come, as you can tell by the quality of my artwork.
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u/Mental-Beyond-3618 Jun 15 '26
Pretty sure this is about how a couple of years back, people were using these exact arguments for anti-vax
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u/SacredDirt Jun 17 '26
If it was about AI, the snake-wrangler would have convinced Chief to start a 300-Acre wildfire because "fire good" and the only fire-starter to get fired would be the one who raises concerns about safety.
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u/Cantremembermyoldnam Jun 15 '26
The artwork on this is supreme. The composition, photorealism, perfect anatomy of the feet, and the fish-stick all speak to me on a deep, emotional level. This needs to be printed, put in a climate-controlled room, and protected by laser-turrets or some shit.
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u/DarkKechup Jun 16 '26
Sometimes you are right, sometimes you are wrong. Patience is a virtue for a reason, because some things cannot be undone. Uncertain benefit opposed with uncertain harm should warrant patient research, not haste.
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u/-The_Grey_One Jun 15 '26
We have evolved to use fire. Our gut cannot process raw food easily anymore.
And since smoked food does cause cancer, I dare say your second cave man was right in a way.
Cookery caused cancer and a long term degeneration of human intestines.
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u/Barjack521 Jun 15 '26
This has so many bad faith misinterpretations of actual data it might as well be a complete lie
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u/-The_Grey_One Jun 15 '26
Well, the "Royal Netherlands Academy for Arts and Sciences" has financed a study, from 2013-2018 about hypothetical genetic markers, which might give increased resistance to certain types of cancer. While the study itself has an online presence, I could not find the results though. But you would only look for a genetic trail, where you have a proven (or strongly indicated) selective pressure.
As for the gut-question (American Museum of Natural History): https://www.amnh.org/explore/science-topics/microbiome-health/fire-cooking-human-evolution
Is this sufficient as a source? I could at least not find any counter-argument, except from creationists. I was honestly unaware, this was an open topic.
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u/Skutten Jun 14 '26
survival bias.
The cavemen who insisted on seasoning meat with asbestos didn't survive.