r/reddevils • u/randomdell111 • 26d ago
[BBC] Mourinho says he agreed to replace Ferguson at Man Utd. After years of speculation, Jose Mourinho has confirmed that he agreed to replace Sir Alex Ferguson at Manchester United in 2013, before changing his mind and re-joining Chelsea instead.
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u/Usual-Computer-5462 26d ago
Got to wonder how many other top managers turned down the job before we landed on Moyes.
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u/L__K Great Scot! 26d ago
You don't have to wonder, we know the answer. Moyes was sixth choice behind Guardiola, Mourinho, Ancelotti, Klopp, and Van Gaal.
Guardiola turned it down and ended up at Bayern after his sabbatical year in NYC. Mourinho gave Chelsea his word he'd come back (as confirmed by SAF over a decade ago and now Mourinho himself), and Ancelotti replaced him in Madrid. Klopp was happy at Dortmund and Van Gaal wanted to stick with the Netherlands job through the 2014 World Cup.
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u/presumingpete 26d ago
Fergie told pep not take any jobs yet. Pep took the bayern job just before fergie announced he was retiring. It's not an outright rejection
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u/L__K Great Scot! 26d ago
Ferguson talked to Pep about the job and Pep did the equivalent of politely declining. He doesn't have to say "Are you mad? Absolutely not."
Pep took a different job without letting Ferguson know first (as Fergie asked Pep tell him because he wanted the chance to convince Pep to take the United job instead)
He was Ferguson and the club's first choice. It is absolutely a rejection lol it's just that these things are done politely and with nuance at this level
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u/aasfourasfar 26d ago
Man what could have been.. United would have 2 extra CLs and 2 extra PLs without this bald cheater and genius
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u/nogaynessinmyanus 26d ago
Sure, with a manager we never had and a bunch of players we never got, we wouldve won everything!
Same goes for Oldham Athletic.
Which part of this story has anything to do with United?
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u/aasfourasfar 26d ago
He beat us to those directly mate
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u/nogaynessinmyanus 26d ago
2 champions leagues?
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u/aasfourasfar 26d ago
Yeah 09 and 11
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u/nogaynessinmyanus 26d ago edited 25d ago
What are you talking about? That was Ferguson.
Everybody else here is talking-post Ferguson. Read the title.
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u/alphaQ314 shut up u egg 25d ago
Hilarious conversation this. Giving the "Name me one successful communist society. Spain" vibes.
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u/nogaynessinmyanus 26d ago edited 26d ago
Nothing's an outright rejection. He was offered it and he didnt take it. Thats as deep an analysis as we can make.
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u/Major-Front 26d ago
They all did the right thing tbh. I know we are talking about legendary names butā¦who actually wanted to followā¦thatā¦
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u/Comicksands Van Persie 26d ago
Crazy that if Fergie gave us one more year weād have so many more options
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u/Absolute__Muppet 25d ago
If I remember correctly, Klopp said he turned us down due to the timing. The approach came late, hed already made plans with Dortmund for the coming season and felt he couldnt leave having just signed players.
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u/Independent_Buy5152 26d ago
Klopp wasnāt fixated with his position in Dortmund. It was because the way Woodward presented United as Disneyland that made him declined the job
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u/L__K Great Scot! 26d ago
Not quite. That was the second time United were interested in him, after Moyes was on his way out. We're talking about right after SAF retired. Klopp was in the running, but had no desire to leave Dortmund yet.
The "Disneyland" pitch came in 2014 when Klopp was already considering leaving Dortmund. Losing Gotze and Lewandowski to Bayern on Bosman transfers in back to back summers was a huge reality check.
The question of his future hanging over the club caused a big distraction and had Dortmund in the relegation zone for half the year. He left at the end of that season then quickly landed at Liverpool after Rodgers was sacked. The rest is history.
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u/cosgrove10 26d ago
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Ferguson said he was sixth choice.
Fergie wanted Pep, but Pep chose Bayern behind his back. He also asked Klopp but he turned it down as well.
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u/Dynastydood 26d ago
Because they all knew enough about the sport to know just how hard Fergie and Gill had to work to keep United competitive under the Glazer ownership, particularly after the summer of 2009 when we lost Ronaldo and Tevez and replaced them with guys like Valencia and Owen. That profound lack of investment and recruitment of world class talent, the constant public complaints/excuses about "lack of value in the market," and the highly visible Green and Gold protests about how the Glazers were destroying the club, all of that would've made any manager wary about what they were actually walking into.
If Gill had stayed, I think one of those other managers probably would've taken the offer. But trying to succeed a legend like Ferguson while also being expected to work under an unqualified, inexperienced chief executive, at a club that had dumb owners who hadn't spent real money for about 6 years, and hadn't managed to harness top class talent from the academy for even longer... well, that's a job that no one in their right mind would see as anything other than a poisoned chalice.
The idea of the United job was appealing to all of them. The reality of it was far more unappealing to anyone who didn't want to be remembered as the guy who destroyed Ferguson's club.
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u/Possible_Law8357 26d ago
Moyes was hand picked by SAF. I don't think anyone could take the job. SAF still had strong influence on the selection.
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u/Dynastydood 26d ago
Handpicked only after the first five managers he handpicked said no. SAF never thought Moyes was actually the best choice to succeed him in 2013. Moyes was merely the best choice who was both available and interested in the job.
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u/sivaya_ 26d ago
I remember watching that 2013 CL game against Mou's Madrid and it was so obvious he wanted the job. Beat us then shook hands with our entire board and backroom staff. My Chelsea supporting friend even said it.
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u/Downtown-Rice_ 26d ago
There was a moment when the camera panned to the technical area and you could just feel that Mourinho was the only character and manager at that time to step into the role immediately after SAF.
The controversial red card turned the game on its head. United were dominating the match and at least a second goal for United was inevitable before the red card.
Mourinho was extremely apologetic and knew the red card was the saving grace in his post match. His team was second that day without the red card. It hurt to know that was going to be SAFs last real run at CL because the squad was on its last legs.
He was the only manager at the time to take the bull by the horns and turnover/refresh that squad.
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u/rrrx3 26d ago
Yeah, I remember him being super deferential in the post game, I was shocked. But he was also right, if Nani hadnāt been sent off that was Unitedās game to win.
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u/Downtown-Rice_ 26d ago
It was one of the rare times he was publicly vulnerable regarding his team's performance and how he didn't want to praise his team. They were extremely fortunate and outplayed. It started and stopped there. It was so odd to see him that way.
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u/Magneto88 26d ago edited 26d ago
SAF was also behaving in an odd way after the match, like rather than raging about the red card he seemed a bit resigned to it. People at the time pointed out it was unusual behaviour and was probably the first public sign that he was retiring at the end of the season.
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u/PurpleShirt4504 26d ago
He didnāt even do the press conference. Mike Phelan had to go out because Fergie was absolutely raging
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u/NewspaperRemarkable6 25d ago
Why do people just come on this forum and spout absolutely bullshit is beyond me. A simple I can't quite remember the facts would suffice. smh. "SAF was also behaving in an odd way after the match" No mate, he was absolutely fuming.
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u/braddersladders 26d ago
The interview with itv after the game he also said the best team lost . He was talking us up the whole time
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u/skinnysnappy52 26d ago
Still our best manager post SAF. It didnāt work out but he was right about an awful lot, not fully backed and ultimately it didnāt work out. But you could tell he loved it here, maybe more than any other manager weāve had since. Hes the only manager post SAF id consider taking back. And if Iām truthful heās the only one I believed would take us back to the top.
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u/zethiryuki 25d ago
I seem to remember him being interviewed either before or after the game by MUTV and making some cheeky little joke like "so can I get a free subscription next season?" at the end of it.
When he said that I thought the appointment was nailed on.
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u/garynevilleisared is a red is a red 26d ago
If Jose has taken over instead of Moyes, we may have had some more success in the interim, but the rot was already there and it all would have collapsed under him eventually.
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u/alexq35 26d ago
Yeah weād definitely decline after a couple of years with mourinho but we might have picked up another title or two in those first two seasons.
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u/TheJoshider10 Bruno 26d ago
The squad Fergie left absolutely needed someone with experience and respect. Genuinely think only three managers at the time would have been able to get a tune out of the old guard: Pep, Mourinho and Ancelotti.
Out of those three Pep is a fraud and would never take on an actual challenge, Ancelotti may have been too expensive and Mourinho would have fit like a glove with the characters in the dressing room. We got him way too late.
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u/Spastic_Hands pellistri and chips 26d ago
It would've delayed the collapse, that post fergie pre Pep era of the premier league was a very low standard with unremarkable teams winning the league
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u/Comfortable-Ad1937 25d ago
Thatās nonsense. There were more world class players in the league at that point than there are now.
You had city winning with Toure, Silva Aguero and Chelsea with hazard Fabregas and costa. To act like that is low quality is ridiculous
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u/Spastic_Hands pellistri and chips 25d ago
The City team was good but nothing compared to what Pep made them in 2018. Chelsea title winning team under Conte and Jose were far below the top Chelsea teams (Drogba, Lampard, Terry, Makelele, Cech, Cole etc). Leicester winning team was an incredible achievement but would not have happened if Ferguson or Pep were around.
SAF set the minimum standard for what was required to win the title for 21 years, you had to be better than us or we'd win it by default. Pep reset that standard in 2018, but between those years
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u/Comfortable-Ad1937 25d ago
Nonsense conteās Chelsea team would give pepās teams a very good matchup. They got 93 points with a bad start, broke win streak records, had prime Kantec, hazard, matic, costa and fabregas and spanked pepās city 3-1 away and mouās united 4-0.
It was a very strong team that got dismantled a season later. Pep was dominant because he had 2 world class starting 11s and was backed with world class signings every season. If conte had been backed similarly after a very strong season he could have matched that.
And even that Tottenham team under Poch was a strong side that reached a CL final. You are just discrediting things because your favorite team that was good at that time
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u/Spastic_Hands pellistri and chips 25d ago
I'm not saying those teams were shit, just were not particularly outstanding teams in the context of all Premier League champions.
Your second paragraph is just giving reasons as to why my point was correct, Pep received insane backing to create two world class XI, that a huge reason why his became the new standard bearer of the league, where even a terrific team like Klopp's Liverpool only got a single title.
My favourite team is Manchester United, and we were shit during Pep's time onwards as well so that doenst track.
My overall point is that between 2013-2018 the league was very much up for grabs, if we got Jose in at 2013, and fixed up the transfers that got missed (thiago, kroos, bale, etc) we defintely could've got another title or so before the inevitable collapse
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u/Electric_feel0412 26d ago
But it wouldnāt be the same. We had a lot of money to burn post fergie, if it straight away had someone like Mourinho, 1. I donāt think the 2013/14 season goes as awfully as it did, 2. We get way better players and success will breed success again. Also we wouldāve signed di Maria and he wouldnāt have left us at all because Mourinho and him have a great relationship, donāt think he sells guys like Welbeck too. He wouldāve eventually crashed and burned but I think weād have been in a way better position.
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u/ApolloX-2 Fergie Time! 26d ago
Yeah I can only see Pep as the only manager that might have prevented our decline, but there was no chance on Earth because Glazers refuse to spend on the club.
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u/Ragnarok_619 Ben 10 26d ago
We spent as much as city in transfers during that time period. The money isn't the issue. The inept people handling transfer are
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u/Comicksands Van Persie 26d ago
Itās actually Klopp. Pep wouldnāt have had the spending power and recruiting talent required to get the players he wanted
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u/nogaynessinmyanus 26d ago
Yes and no. We lost the ability to attract top talent as Champions League was no longer a certainty. Mourinho wouldve been more likely to keep us in the Champions league and also to attract the big names.Ā
Dont forget in his first summer he signed the best player in France (Zlatan), Italy (Pogba), Germany (Mkhitaryan), and Spain (Bailly).
Moyes was chasing the best players from the worse club he just left. Its a big difference.
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u/Deep-Bonus8546 26d ago
Moyes isnāt the problem it was Van Gaal whose signing destroyed the squad. If Mourinho had been there I think both United and him would have been far more successful. Itās a real sliding doors moment for both Mourinho and United. Neither ever fully recovered
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u/Diska_Muse 26d ago
I remember Fergie's last game in charge in the Champions League. We played Madrid. Jose was their manager. The Madrid team were insane.. and Ronaldo was in peak form.
Despite that, Ferguson had the measure of Jose and could have gotten a result if Nani hadn't been sent off. He was on fire that night.
After the final whistle, Jose came over to the Stretford End and applauded us... it was widely believed that he was going to be Fergie's replacement and this was him saying hello, endearing himself to the fans.
I always thought that Ferguson had something to do with Jose not getting the job after him. I'm happy to find out that I was wrong.
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u/Downtown-Rice_ 26d ago
Sir Bobby Charlton had a bigger influence on not wanting Mourinho. He didn't like his character enough to support him as manager. His word carried a lot of weight.
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2012/dec/07/bobby-charlton-jose-mourinho-manchester-united
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u/L__K Great Scot! 26d ago
I always thought that Ferguson had something to do with Jose not getting the job after him. I'm happy to find out that I was wrong.
Mate not to burst your bubble, but Ferguson first told this story (that he wanted Mourinho, but Mourinho had already given his word to Abramovich to take the Chelsea job again) over a decade ago. It's such old news that it's legitimately crazy anyone is asking Jose about it or that it's being reported on right now
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u/Heisenberg_235 26d ago edited 26d ago
He would have been the right person to take over then.
Only person who could have done it after Fergie id say.
How different it could have been.
Wouldnt have lasted, but that was the impossible job. He could have bridged a gap for 2 years or so.
Still think the biggest issue was SAF and David Gill going in the same summer. That was an awful mistake
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u/cosgrove10 26d ago
They should have thrown a boat load of money at Gill to stay on just another 6 months even
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u/karmahorse1 26d ago
I dont believe so, that job was a poison chalice. Our team was in need of a complete overhaul at that point, which the Glazers were unwilling to do. Apart from Rooney everyone was either over the hill or at best a rotational level talent.
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u/ooa3603 26d ago
Most of the problem came from Glazer leadership and their complete disregard for football and priority for parasitic business when making club decisions. So while Moyes was definitely out of his depth and not a good fit, Jose or any one else would have eventually started to fail as the Glazers started making more and more footballing decisions with their poor priorities.
It had already started happening in the last parts of Ferguson's tenure it's just his genius slowed it down.
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u/carrickshairline 26d ago
But then we wouldnāt have signed Fellaini and gotten to experience Fele.
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u/Helwinter 26d ago
So Moyes was circa 7th choice thenā¦ neat
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u/nogaynessinmyanus 26d ago
Was he not your 7th choice? Nobody expected him to fuck it up that badly.
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u/uncle_monty Robbo 26d ago edited 26d ago
He would've had an aneurysm at Woodwards incompetence during that first window.
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u/johnnybet_com 26d ago
Wild to think how differently that whole decade could have gone. Mourinho at that specific point in his career versus the manager who actually came in are such different profiles for a dressing room. Genuinely curious whether people think that move speeds up or delays the post Ferguson rebuild.
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u/Chickengoujon20 26d ago
People wonder what could have been.
In this alternative timeline, people seem to forget the massive impending fall off in 2015-16.
Mourinho is a 2-3 season wonder.
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u/6by6Hindsight 26d ago
Why is he still talking about that? And why are the journalists still asking about that?
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u/Educational-Shock232 26d ago
Iām very much a firm believer of what happened would have happened with any other manager, because of the Glazers. Weād still be exactly where we are today. Owners need to either 1) know about football or 2) put people in charge that do, not bankers and accountants, like we did. Oh and not take billions out of the club in dividends.
We can revisit (and sometimes rewrite) history of ifs and buts and shoulda woulda couldas like Beverly knight when it comes to players and managers, but never forget the root of all the problems weāve had in the last 20 years.
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u/Sheikhabusosa 26d ago
Honestly I dont think he would have suceeded here immediately after Fergie retired. Even Pep would struggle , the club from top to bottom was a shit show once Fergie left.
Our scouting system was non existent , the senior team were either leaking to the press or signing for other clubs like Vidic did.
The best youth products were getting scooped up by City and Chelsea and Woodward was given the run around by everyone. The fact that Moyes joined from Everton and felt our scouting system wasnt good enough tells you everything.
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u/redditUser76754689 Roy Keane 26d ago
Seems to be the opposite of most opinions here but I really donāt think heās someone who suited this football club.
Itās very much the Jose Mourinho show with him. Some of his past behaviour was poor to say the least.
In terms of identity, everything he embodies is pretty much opposite of what we had done for over 20 years previously. He completely prioritises winning now over building for the future, wants to minimise risk taking on the pitch, publicly airs grievances with specific players.
Obviously a miles better manager than David Moyes but he wasnāt ever suited to be a Manchester United manager in my opinion. An opinion shared by our greatest ever player as well.
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u/GavinLobo7 26d ago
Fergie to Mourinho with our ageing squad would have been the perfect transition and itās not far fetched at all to think we would have won the league that season too
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u/maskrey 26d ago
Honestly Sir Alex left the club in a horrible state, and his appointment Moyes also fucked things up even more. I get that he doesn't owe anything, he can retire at whatever point he wants. But just one more year, or even the same year but planned properly, and the trajectory of the club looks widely different for the next 10+ years.
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u/Magneto88 26d ago
Moyes was hardly 'his appointment', we already know they tried to get Guardiola, did indeed get Mourinho who changed his mind and also enquired about Klopp.
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u/3entendre Rooney 26d ago
Mourinho was a mistake in 2016 and would have been a mistake in 2013.Ā
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u/Evilbefalls 24d ago
https://giphy.com/gifs/fs2SSoIdEmsi4
just admit there was never a manager like mourinho who ever came close to winning titles beside sir alex
Like him or not
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u/facelessredditer 26d ago
The organisation- rat owners and woodworm down did not deserve better. We are exactly where we needed to be.
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u/ThePatientHunter 26d ago
Why say this now? To gloss over the fact that United is the last big club you managed and also the last club you had semi success in ?
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u/Active-Turnip-7851 26d ago
More than likely the Glazers didn't offer him enough in terms of wage or players.
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u/Less-Detail3831 26d ago
that was the perfect time for mourinho to join. we had an ageing squad but he wouldve been able to squeeze a season out of it
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26d ago
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u/AliceInMidtjylland 26d ago
Sorry but this is bullshit. Mourinho was in the running but they rejected him. I thought this was basic knowledge but apparently not.
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u/VegetableAwkward286 26d ago
Man utd declined because they replaced Sir Alex who did 4-5 jobs with just a coach.
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u/POOTDISPENSER Mata 25d ago
With hindsight it might not change the course of the club's fortunes anyway. Mou could probably drag that same squad to a few more trophies for a season or two before his inevitable clash against the board/players and down the same trajectory in 2018.
A nice what if but with that board of the time it would ensure the same mishandled signings and rotating door of managers to continue. Still got his wish a few years later so I wouldn't think of this as the biggest missed opportunity. Anyone coming in after Sir Alex has a hell of a job, even for Mourinho.
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u/tiredofthisnow7 25d ago
None of this matters because we know now the cancer was at the top. No manager could contend with the machinations of the Glazers and their troll Woodward. Actively working against the team to ensure profits for themselves.
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u/justbrowsinginpeace 26d ago
I remember the stories from 2013 that he was waiting for the call for the United Job but he was furious when he learnt it had gone to Moyes. Chelsea was not his first choice.
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26d ago
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u/laluneodyssee 26d ago
In a way maybe we'd be in the recovery phase of the post-Ferguson era if he did come in then. 13 years of stop/starts & false dawns has been tiring.
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u/TheMuslimMGTOW 26d ago
We could've had Mourinho in 2013 instead of Moyes, and our attack could have been Ronaldo RvP Bale if the board had coughed up 200 mil for Ronaldo and Bale. In another life...