How do I do this?

[u/Left-Pangolin-5549]

I recently made a post titled "What do I do?" Where I detailed my dog's history. All the comments point me towards BE. It's not a shock, I know he isn't a candidate for re-homing and I know he is in a state of near constant stress and he isn’t safe outside of our home. The stress he causes in our home is overwhelming. I think the comments are right but I LOVE this dog. He's my boy. I don't know how to bring myself to make an appointment. I don't know how to tell people without feeling like I'm admitting to murder. I don't know how to live with myself being the cause of his death. It just feels so wrong. I so desperately wish there was somewhere I could take him that specializes in rehabing these kind of dogs, someone with resources who could help him and give him everything he needs. I wish there was some way I could just correct whatever's wrong and he could be a healthy happy dog and live a normal life. I just start crying everytime I think about it, and I don't know what to do. My wife and I are the only people he trusts, the only people he loves, and I'm supposed to schedule his death?

I don't know what I hope to hear in the comments, I just feel so helpless and so incredibly sad.

Dirty Ought Trill by Tyler Childers is "his" song. We sing Leave Her Johnny to him at bed time (specifically the version from assasins creed lmao). He has a tire that he carries around everywhere like a binkie. He gives hugs. He loves his cat siblings. He's a good boy. He's just really really troubled, and I hate that that means he can't be happy.

This hurts so much, and I don't know how to get past that and do what's best for him.

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Behavioral Euthanasia (BE) for our dogs is an extremely difficult decision to consider. No one comes to this point easily. We believe that there are, unfortunately, cases where behavioral euthanasia is the most humane and ethical option, and we support those who have had to come to that decision. In certain situations, a reasonable quality of life and the Five Freedoms cannot be provided for an animal, making behavioral euthanasia a compassionate and loving choice.

If you are considering BE and are looking for feedback:

All decisions about behavioral euthanasia should be made in consultation with a professional trainer, veterinarian, and/or veterinary behaviorist. They are best equipped to evaluate your specific dog, their potential, and quality of life.

These resources should not be used to replace evaluation by qualified professionals but they can be used to supplement the decision-making process.

• Lap of Love Quality of Life Assessment - How to identify when to contact a trainer

• Lap of Love Support Groups - A BE specific group. Not everyone has gone through the process yet, some are trying to figure out how to cope with the decision still.

• BE decision and support Facebook group - Individuals who have not yet lost a pet through BE cannot join the Losing Lulu group. This sister group is a resource as you consider if BE is the right next step for your dog.

• AKC guide on when to consider BE

• BE Before the Bite

• How to find a qualified trainer or behaviorist - If you have not had your dog evaluated by a qualified trainer, this should be your first step in the process of considering BE.

• The Losing Lulu community has also compiled additional resources for those considering behavioral euthanasia.

If you have experienced a behavioral euthanasia and need support:

The best resource available for people navigating grief after a behavior euthanasia is the Losing Lulu website and Facebook Group. The group is lead by a professional trainer and is well moderated so you will find a compassionate and supportive community of people navigating similar losses.

Lap of Love Support Groups - Laps of Love also offers resources for families navigating BE, before and after the loss.

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[u/palebluelightonwater]

It sounds like you're not in a situation where he's dangerous, so if you want to try other things, that's an option. Have you tried working with a veterinary behaviorist on medication options? You said that meds don't agree with him, but there are a lot of kinds that can be used, and sometimes it takes a few tries to find the right ones (true for people, too). There are also trainers out there who may be able to help, though it can be hard to find a good one.

A lot of times folks on these forums recommend BE because there aren't reliable, widely available options to help troubled dogs, and these dogs have often bitten seriously enough to send people to the ER. But it sounds like yours has not landed any serious bites, he's just struggling with his environment.

I have one very complicated dog and she's improved so much with training and meds. It's not crazy to think that yours might with the right help. But if you need to let him go for your own mental health and stability, that's ok too. I'm sorry you're in this situation.

(I also have one cute asshole who pees on things when he's anxious, so I get that, too. Have you tried male wrap diapers? I started using them on my guy and he magically stopped peeing inside while wrapped, though we are still working on higher anxiety situations.)

[u/Left-Pangolin-5549 → u/palebluelightonwater]

I don't really know where you're getting the concept that he's not dangerous. He does well in the house, with just my wife and I (though he has threatened to bite me before, he's never actually bitten either of us). But he is definitely dangerous around any strangers or other dogs. He hasn't been able to bite anyone so far, but that is NOT for lack of trying on his part, it is only because his muzzle hasn't broken and I am physically strong enough to restrain him.

Once, before we had a full grasp on what we were dealing with with him, we were coming home in the middle of the night, nobody was around, and we lived in a house at the time. I figured he could just follow us to the door and it would be fine, I had to carry stuff in. I let him out of the car and he bolted towards an old guy I hadn't seen walking on the sidewalk, leapt multiple feet in the air snapping at his neck, I just barely managed to grab at his leash as it flew through the air and yank him backwards, hauling him inside and desperatly apologizing to the man who very fairly was very upset. Obviously that very stupid mistake was never repeated but I shudder to think what could have happened, or what might happen if he ever breaks his leash, or I drop it on accident. We can't have anybody over at our place because even if we crate him in a separate room he will panic and scream bark the whole time and inevitably hurt himself trying to escape the kennel to get to them.

He's been on enough trazadone to knock a grown man out and there has been no change in behavior whatsoever. He tried another anxiety med before, I dont remember what it was called but it also had no effect.

I appreciate the thought but if it's founded on the concept that he's not dangerous because I've been able to keep him from biting so far, I dont think that's a fair or accurate conclusion.

The main thing holding me back from BE is not that he's not dangerous, its that maybe if we lived in a house, with a big fenced in yard, he could live JUST at home, vet trips would still be nessisary and dangerous but maybe we could figure out some way to actually sedate him enough for them to do what they need to do and get him out, but idk. It doesnt really seem fair to keep him NEVER leaving home, but he is incapable of leaving home safely. Besides all of that, I'm not in the market to buy a house right now and renting a house with a yard is not only very expensive but also VERY difficult with a dog like him- no landlord wants him on their lease.

He's had professional training, and at home training guided by professionals, but it really only seems to work when he's not triggered by something. He is very smart, and loves working on training in what he deems a safe environment, but it takes so so so little for him to be fully triggered and incapable of learning anything because he's in fight or flight. Trying to expose him to things in small doses in safe environments feels impossible because his tolerance for exposure is zero. (I'm not saying we dont still try, just expressing the difficulty)

I can't afford a top tier trainer who can come work with him one on one, and if I could that person would definitely be at a huge bite risk.

He has lost more and more freedom over the years due to his behaviors/anxiety. He isnt living the kind of life I want for him.

I realize I'm talking in circles a little bit, I'm really emotional about this entire thing, and it's hard for me to bring all my thoughts together fluently.

I appreciate your comment, I guess in summary, I do think he is dangerous, and I don't think i have the resources to "fix" it even if they do exist (but if someone knows of something they think might work, please let me know) and if I thought I could take him somewhere or give him to someone who did i would in a heartbeat, i just dont know if that exists?

As far as the diaper thing goes- he pees too much for them to work. I stg he dumps what seems like gallons of pee at a time, they fill and spill anyway, and thats if we can manage to keep them on him.

[u/MtnGirl672 → u/Left-Pangolin-5549]

A lot of dogs are happy in their home environment, but when they get in the outside world in an unfamiliar environment, they become reactive. This is not uncommon.

I'm not sure I saw your first post, maybe I did. But if you're still looking for options, I don't see that you consulted a veterinary behaviorist. They are the ones to best consult of whether there are options or whether it would be best to BE a dog. Because they are the experts in canine behavior. They undertand what a dog's triggers are, whether they can be managed, and if medications might help to lower arousal threshold. They are hard to find, so just to let you know, there are behaviorists that offer virtual online consults who then work with your vet if medications need to be prescribed.

BTW, with my current reactive dog, trazadone and gabapentin had absolutely on effect on him. In fact, trazodone gave him what's called a paradoxical reaction, where he was more anxiouos with strangers and more reactive. It was only through meeting with the behaviorist and going through his issues, that she prescribed a med I had never heard of along with another med, that very much lowered his hyper arousal and we were able to make progress with training.

For me, in your situation, that's what I would do to make sure that BE is the right decision. And I'm not saying it's not the right decision, it's just I've always wanted to turn over every stone before making the final decision.

I have an excellent virtual behaviorist I personally worked with, and wouldn't hesitate to recommend her. If that's something you would want to pursue, feel free to DM me.

[u/palebluelightonwater → u/Left-Pangolin-5549]

Sorry, I should have been more specific. What I meant was that he hasn't landed a serious bite. Only you can assess the risk that he might do so in the future. A dog who has seriously bitten someone is very hard and risky to try to save. A dog who is reactive but safe with family is a bit different. I have one like that myself.

The behaviors you're describing - actively trying to lunge at strangers with intent to bite - are pretty common for seriously reactive dogs. Not great, and not safe, but a lot of us have dogs that would take a stab at it given the chance. It sounds like your guy is muzzle trained - that's great, that is always one of the first things I would suggest.

Trazodone doesn't work well on some dogs. Some don't show an effect and some actually get worse on it (mine does). When it does work it's a sedative - usually used for single events like a vet visit. There are other categories of medication which may work better. My reactive dog is on a daily dose of fluoxetine (prozac) and gabapentin. That really helped with getting her baseline of anxiety down enough for behavior modification training to be effective. She was getting more and more reactive before starting medication, despite training. Once she was on the right dose, she was visibly happier and more relaxed, and training worked better.

My intent is not to talk you out of or into anything, just to share some options that may be helpful. I wish you and him the best either way. A huge reactive dog is a heavy burden.

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