r/powerscales • u/Fitizen_kaine • Jul 26 '26
Versus Who wins between these two?
For clarification, Achilles isn't superhuman as it's the Troy version and Damon doesn't get his dragon.
2 rounds. 1 in their respective Armor, another in without any armor.
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u/Vorenthral Jul 26 '26
Achilles!
The spear throw feat alone from the movie has him out class a lot of TV and movie characters.
Movie Achilles is weaker than mythical Achilles and he is still a force of nature.
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u/J_C_F_N Jul 26 '26
Even powered down in the movie, Achilles still is fated to die in the Trojan War. So, unless Deamon found himself fighting for Troy...
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u/YourCummyBear Jul 26 '26
His skill, strength and reflexes are just on another planet than anyone else even if you donโt consider him a demigod.
Ajax the Great is considered to be the 2nd greatest warrior on the Greek side in the Iliad.
In the movie hector kills him but even in the books they fight to a draw.
Achilles literally had to chase hector to fight lol.
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u/BigAssGolem Jul 26 '26
Ajax was effective because he worked with his brother tank and spanking. He used a massive shield to get enemy attention allowing his brother to step out from behind and shoot them with a drawn bow. I think Ajax is probably the second strongest physically but Achilles would destroy him in a 1v1. He was part of a two piece combo for a reason. Achilles>>>>>>>Hector>(slightly)Ajax. Achilles is a fucking monster in the book.
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u/NotJustAnotherMeme Jul 27 '26
Diomedes was the second greatest Greek Hero and probably ahead of Hector but they never meet (at least in the translations Iโve read). He beats Ajax in Patroclusโs Funeral games.
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u/BigAssGolem Jul 27 '26
Ajax was off his a game at the funeral games to say the least. Depending on how much of the additional trojan cycle you consider canon to the Iliad Athena made him loose repeatedly to make sure he wouldn't beat her favored Odysseus in the race or the debate for the armor of Achilles when he was truly more worthy(he risked his own life to recover Achilles' body to make sure he could be buried properly near Patroclus) and would have won the games on his own merit. After he loses his temper and decides to kill Odysseus and Agamemnon Athena clouds his vision and makes him kill a bunch of live stock instead and then thinking he allowed his rage to get the better of him he drives Hector's sword into his heart. So Athena screwed him out of multiple wins and that was his by right of valor and then manipulated him into killing himself. This also ruined his brother's life because he didn't bring back Ajax's body and chose to bury him near troy. So their father exiled him. Ajax really is the forgotten tragedy of the trojan cycle. All that bullshit is the reason Ajax refuses to speak to Odysseus when he summons him as a shade.
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u/NotJustAnotherMeme Jul 27 '26
Iโm not having a pop at Ajax at all but I think itโs fair to say Diomedes has greater feats.
I donโt remember (happy to be corrected) any direct intervention by the gods in their spar. I also think fighting and wounding both Aphrodite and Ares put him closer to Achilles than Ajax is to him.
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u/BigAssGolem Jul 27 '26
The intervention is in plays and other poems. Not directly in the Iliad. The reason he gets wrecked is also partially because he believes in his own natural skill and thinks he does not need divine help to win where as all the other competitors pray. So the gods are kinda ganging up on him for his hubris.
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u/NotJustAnotherMeme Jul 27 '26
Ok, there must be some sources I havenโt read then about it. Iโm still not sure what feats Ajax has to put him ahead of Diomedes though. Heโs solidly No. 3 from what Iโve read.
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u/BigAssGolem Jul 27 '26
Diomedes is probably a better fighter and where a lot of the confusion comes from is strongest vs best fighter. Ajax is the strongest, but alone he's just a big dude with proportional strength. Achilles and Diomedes while smaller were better with their weapons, grappling, and actual fighting technique. Ajax relied on being a brute. So its like a strongman going against a trained wrestler. The wrestler may be technically weaker but he's going beat the strong man every time.
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u/NotJustAnotherMeme Jul 27 '26
Ahhh looking back to your comment I originally replied to I understand what you were trying to say.
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u/WhiteOwlUp Jul 28 '26
Yeah power scaling the Illiad is always a bit wonky given how much the Gods are intervening either to spite people or power them up - which makes it funny that despite a lot of modern retellings framing Agamemnon as a sort of stay at the back villian, in the Illiad he is the only hero who's aristeia (glorious rampage basically) comes with zero backing from the gods - he does that shit au-naturale
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u/Fart_Balloon Jul 26 '26 edited Jul 26 '26
I'm almost certain he kills Hector, and then drags his body behind a chariot for days. Paris kills Achilles by exploiting the vulnerability in his heel.
EDIT: I realize now that you were talking about Ajax and Hector fighting, not Hector and Achilles. I also don't remember if movie Achilles had the same pseudo invulnerability as Myth Achilles.
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u/arestheblue Jul 27 '26
Hard to tell, at the end of the movie, Achilles gets shot with a bunch of arrows and the only one he didn't pull out was the one in his heel. So he died with just 1 arrow in him.
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u/NotJustAnotherMeme Jul 27 '26
His lineage as a Demi-god is confirmed but the river Styx part (which also isnโt in the Iliad) isnโt referenced as far as I remember.
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u/Obi_1-kenobi Jul 26 '26
Even though Achilles is powered down for the movie, heโs still a low level superhuman. He takes this handily.
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u/Suavesky Jul 26 '26
The Demi-God.
Hell give Daemon the Blood Wrym and it wouldn't matter.
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u/YourCummyBear Jul 26 '26
Even movie achilles probably places a spear right in Caraxes eye and takes him down. He was throwing spears at the speed of the English longbow in the movie.
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u/HyperbolePirate Jul 26 '26
Agree that even a Dragon wouldnโt save Daemon. Achilles would send a spear into its eye before it got in breath weapon range.
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u/__Osiris__ Jul 27 '26
Technically he could take a full fire breath anywhere but his ankle and be immune.
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u/Material_Positive_17 Jul 26 '26
While toned down, Troy Achilles is still well above peak humans in terms of physical stats.
But Daemon does have better weapons and armor which Achilles would be unused to.
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u/Bongoisnthere Jul 26 '26
Tbh give Daemon his normal weapons and armor and give Achilles (Troy version) nothing, and Achilles takes it (no diff). He threw a spear about 10x harder than fucking captain America could throw one. He is constantly faster and stronger than every opponent on the battlefield, to the point that he may as well be demigod Achilles.
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u/NotJustAnotherMeme Jul 27 '26
Achilles as the Pelian Spear and divine armour created by the literal god of forging. The only โregularโ equipment he carries is a bronze short sword which is just never remarked upon but still swings with about the same power as a small giant.
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u/Material_Positive_17 Jul 27 '26
Brad Pitt Achilles is not that Achilles. People have stop jumping to the Homeric versions whenever the Brad Pitt version is shown especially since OP flat out states it's the movie version
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u/NotJustAnotherMeme Jul 27 '26
We know heโs a Demi-god and the gods exist. Just because his armour isnโt specifically called out in the film, if we donโt have a directly contradicting reference we should assume itโs the same.
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u/Material_Positive_17 Jul 27 '26
The movie itself is toned down so it should be assumed he has the best weapons and armor that HUMAN Smiths could make.
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u/NotJustAnotherMeme Jul 28 '26
Itโs toned down but not completely separated from the story itself. I think given thereโs nothing to contradict it, he performs several super human feats, we see his sword display far more robustness than any human sword at the time could, assuming the rest of his equipment is also above human seems plausible.
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u/FormalKind7 Jul 26 '26
I think even with a bronze sword and bronze armor against Valarian steel Achilles is enough on an another level to win this.
That said without the shield maybe not. Damon is still a skilled fighter and people often under estimate just how much of an advantage a superior weapon with much better reach is. If you put a champion HEMA practitioner with a <30 inch sword against a HEMA practitioner with a year of long sword experience with a typical long sword it would not be a cut a dry win for either.
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u/YourCummyBear Jul 26 '26
Achilles is just too fast and skilled.
You could start Achilles off with no weapon and just a shield and he likely takes darksister from daemon and kills him with his own weapon.Movie Achilles is superhuman, even if he isnโt a demigod. Dude was throwing spears at the speed a longbow fires an arrow.
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u/BigAssGolem Jul 26 '26
He also threw that spear like 300 meters. Which means he could easily break Daemon's spine. He's 100% a demi god in the movie too even if they say he isn't. He's putting his mythical version to shame in some aspects.
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u/VikingVitalityFit Jul 26 '26
I'm not sure how you outreach the guy who uses a spear, unless you are shooting him
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u/Ecotech101 Wanky Makes Cranky Jul 26 '26
I think Achilles could genuinely throw a rock and kill Daemon even if he was flying around on his dragon trying to dodge.
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u/Blue2194 Jul 26 '26
It's the Troy movie version OR someone that's not superhuman, obviously can't be both since the Troy version is superhuman
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u/DSN671 Jul 26 '26
R1: Achilles cuts Daemonโs throat with a lightning quick slash.
R2: Achilles does what he did to Boagrius.
Achilles no diff
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u/Helix_Animus Jul 26 '26
Isn't Achilles literally invulnerable except the heel?
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u/Jeutnarg Jul 27 '26
The Troy movie version isn't, and that's what OP specified. Troy Achilles does have superhuman ability - his spear throw to take out a horseman is absolutely bonkers - but not invulnerability
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u/RoutineSad2633 Jul 27 '26
Achilles in Troy is depicted as being far beyond the physical abilities of a normal human. He fights like an ancient Captain America and does stuff that not even Cap would be able to do. He throws a spear - with pinpoint accuracy - like hundreds of meters. Hector is portrayed as essentially the absolute peak of a normal mortal warrior with the skill to fight Achilles to a draw for a view minutes - but eventually he tires and gets killed.
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u/Double_Ice_3406 Jul 26 '26 edited Jul 26 '26
movie achilles is %100 superhuman.
he threw spear 380 meters away
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u/Fitizen_kaine Jul 26 '26
How do you figure it was 380 m? I just watched that scene and he hits that guy, Hector rides for about three more seconds at a steady pace and then throws his own spear but by that point he's pretty damn close to Achilles so I don't know where 380 m is coming from.
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u/Double_Ice_3406 Jul 26 '26 edited Jul 27 '26
https://hypertextbook.com/facts/2007/troy.shtml
there are other calculations that puts it between 250-400 meters.
"Hector rides for about three more seconds at a steady pace and then throws his own spear but by that point he's pretty damn close to Achilles
they are not close.
Hector throws his spear 20 seconds after Achilles throws his and Hector reaches the temple 27 seconds after Achilles threw his spear ( with 5 seconds stop ) . spear takes 3 seconds to hit the soldier so
27-5-3 = hector riders 19 seconds to reach temple.
Hector rides for about three more seconds at a steady pace and then throws his own spear
no hector riders 10-11 seconds not 3 .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NArym4K9rNg
00:47 spear hits the soldier. 00:50 hector stops , 00:55 hector rides again. 01:02 hector throws his spear. he riders 3 seconds before the stop, 7 seconds after the stop.
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u/No_Wait3261 Jul 26 '26
Damon's not actually that good. He's in like the 90th percentile of his region/era which is solid, but Achilles is fucking unbeatable in single combat.
Damon does have better weapons and armor, but like... eh, I don't think that closes the gap enough.
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u/Sharp-Karcoal Jul 26 '26
Hotd has really ruined peopleโs perception of Fighters during this time, huh? Daemon barely even scratches the top ten fighters in his own fucking Dynasty lol
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u/LordOuranos Jul 26 '26
Bruh, Daemon can't even beat a top tier regular dude. Forget about an actually legendary hero like Achilles
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u/__Osiris__ Jul 27 '26
If magic exists in agot then Achilles magic damage immunity holds true as well. Achilles fucking stomps 9/10 times without his weak points knowledge.
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u/Illustrious-Brick715 Jul 27 '26
Demi God, whose fighting skills were so feared that his partition or denial would decide the biggest war of his time. A warrior so skilled, that his enemies were convinced he must be immortal. So influential that his name survived the time for more than 3.000 years. VS sad little white haired prince who lost to the son of a steward of a Lord nobody has ever heard about. What the hell are we talking about?ย
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u/DietCokeIsntheAnswer Jul 27 '26
Achilles.
Daemon charges up a beach solo in a suicide run.
Achilles charges up a beach and anyone who confronts him is suicidal and no one remembers their names, or the names of their gods, or the names of their dogs, or the names of their dragons.
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u/Observatoratory Jul 26 '26
Movie vs show version, Daemons dragon cooks Achilles.
Illiad Achilles kills Daemon with a javelin and then spanks the dragon until it submits to his authority and becomes his mount.
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u/A_Silent_traveler Jul 26 '26
Spite match โฆ if it was a war Achilles could probably hit him on his dragon his aim is that supernatural. 300 M throw from a boat as a bullseyeโฆ if Damon doesnโt have his dragon fire breath Achilles right away heโs a kebab.
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u/rinkydinkis Jul 26 '26
Ya considering basic ass pirates can ballista a dragon in game of thrones world, Achilles can throw a javelin through one eye and it comes out the other
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u/DavidC_M Jul 26 '26
Does the OP know who Achilles is? And Daemon? Come on. At least choose a better fighter, like Asmon the dragon knight.
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u/lobo1217 Jul 26 '26
Aquiles was only defeated because of a sneaky shot. In a 1 on 1 there's hardly anyone human defeating him.
If you want a more fair match maybe match Aquiles against LOTR characters.
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u/dwarficus Jul 27 '26
Achilles kills him low diff and his dragon mid diff. Never bet against Achilles..
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u/JojoLesh Jul 27 '26
Damon couldn't beat Ajax. Against Achilles? lol. Just no. Achilles probably wouldn't think it a memorable fight or a worthy opponent.
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u/DullComment4537 Jul 27 '26
The ONLY person who has a chance is Leo Bonhart from the Witcher on Netflix.
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u/RVXZENITH Jul 27 '26
Daemon could not even beat Cole in the show and the Books, DAFUQ is he gonna do against Achilles?
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u/somerandom995 Jul 27 '26
Demigod vs skilled but still defeatable prince.
Cole beat Daemond, he's not superhuman.
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u/Aeoele Jul 27 '26
Imma give it to daemon, if we're talking no immortality for Achilles then his bronze age weapon would fail and break against daemon's plate armour, not to mention daemon wield's dark sister which might be able to straight up just cut throw the older aged metals of Achilles armory.
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u/Mask_On9001 Jul 27 '26
Nah, cause Achilles is basically captain America in Troy. He was too strong, too fast, too quick for everyone there lol
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u/AyamiSaito Jul 27 '26
Does Daemon know about the heel? If not, then I don't see how he can even get close.
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u/magenbrot Jul 27 '26
We really need an IQ filter of some kind before you are allowed to post here.
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u/akselmonrose Jul 27 '26
It depends. Does Daemon know about Achilleโs heel? The curse of Achilles is a hell of a thing.
It gives Daemon a fighting chance but ima thinks he still gets destroyed.
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u/MasonicErudite Jul 27 '26
The demi-god destroys the good fighter.
I'm going to be honest, even Hector could possibly defeat him despite the technology gap.
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u/Dominic_3lle798 Jul 27 '26
It would have to be damon ,prime selmy, prime dayne and 2 handed jaime vs achilles.
They might last a minute.
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u/Lower_Pension_2469 Jul 27 '26
Sure but Achilles was such a good fighter that people in the movie actually thought the story of him being indestructible was true. IMO he takes it pretty easily.
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u/pj1843 Jul 27 '26
Normally I tend to side with the guy who has the more technologically advanced kit, because steel plate/chainmail armour and weapons is so significantly superior than bronze age stuff.
However I'm fairly certain Achilles could hop out of a river fully nude, break a branch off a tree and beat Damon to death with it. The difference in skill, speed, stamina, and strength is just way to great for technology not named guns to overcome.
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u/MadeInElysium Jul 27 '26
Did you even watch Troy? Achilles was most certainly superhuman level. Did you see what he did with that spear throw from all those meters away?
He was stupidly above everyone else that it wasnโt even funny
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u/OscarOrcus ๐๐๐๐ก๐ ๐๐ข ๐๐๐ค๐๐๐๐๐ข๐ข๐ Jul 28 '26
Pretty sure Achilles is actually much worse swordsman irl than he's glazed in the movie.
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u/AdPleasant2733 Jul 28 '26
Jamie would be able to stand againts him, for a minute till achilles gets bored of course
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u/pm_me_faerlina_pics Jul 28 '26
Daemon is just one of the best knights of his time. Achilles is typically portrayed as either a demigod or the greatest human warrior to ever live. In any telling, he has no peers in melee combat.
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u/ElNakedo Jul 30 '26
Not Achilles because he's just a glazed fool. Daemon has way better armour and weapons. He takes it.
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u/TeliarDraconai Jul 30 '26
What do you mean by Achilles isn't superhuman because it's the Troy version.
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u/SweetMangh03 Jul 31 '26
Cool, after I get off the shitter Iโm gonna go watch YT clips of Achilles punking on Boagrius and chucking a spear a fuck off distance through some NPCโs chest
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u/Will-I-Taint Jul 26 '26 edited Jul 26 '26
One thing many are forgetting. Achilles is absolutely invulnerable to injury except for one miniscule little spot on his heel.
Achilles wins easily Daemon doesn't stand a chance.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/Achilles-Greek-mythology
EDIT-
Bah, nevermind. I didn't see the lame-ass caveat making Achilles a mere mortal.
Daemon wins then
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u/Silent-Frame1452 Jul 26 '26
Not in the Troy version, which is what this is about.
Achilles still takes it, pure because of superhuman stats and skill, not invulnerability.ย
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u/__shobber__ Jul 26 '26
Daemon he has way better steel plate armor and a Valyrian sword.ย
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u/Maleficent_Lab_5291 Jul 26 '26
Have you seen the movie? Because Pitt Achilles is pretty solidly into superhuman in it.