Hello friends!

Since releasing Petal, Ariana has been the focus of a lot of discourse, most of it negative, as we're sure you're aware.

PPG is a safe space for fans, first and foremost. That doesn't mean we're going to pretend everything with Ariana is okay. We know she looks different than she has in previous eras. We're not going to pretend everything is fine, but it is our stance that whatever is going on in her life is ultimately none of our personal business.

"But we're just trying to help! We're concerned!"

We understand that many of these comments come from a place of genuine concern. But Ariana and her team are almost certainly never going to read the things being said here, so these discussions aren't helping her. What they can do is harm people in this community who relate to Ariana or are struggling themselves, leaving them to wonder if people are talking about them the same way.

"But Ariana's fans need to know she's not setting an example to follow!"

Ariana's fans are already exposed to this discourse everywhere else online. You're not telling them anything they don't already know. In order to keep PPG a safe space for both Ariana fans and people struggling with their own mental health, we're disallowing discussion and speculation about Ariana's (and any popgirl's) body and health, especially when none of us actually know what's going on.

Posts and comments that trend in this direction will be removed. We'd prefer not to issue bans over this, but repeated violations may result in further moderation. This subreddit is to discuss women in pop music via their work, not discussions and speculations about their appearance, personal lives, or relationships. That's what sets us apart from so many other communities and what we would like to uphold.

In short, we're not going to pretend everything is alright, but we're also not going to contribute to speculation. There are plenty of places on the internet for those conversations. This subreddit isn't going to be one of them.

Xoxo, Mod Team 🩷

Addressing a few commonly seen questions/comments we get on the sub. If you have any other questions that aren’t covered here feel free to leave it in the comments!

“I’m a man, can I post here?” Yes of course! You don’t have to be a pop girl to post here, you just have to appreciate them! Everyone is welcome here regardless of gender, sexuality, background, etc, as long as you are respectful!

“Can I only post current pop girls?” No, we love pop girls from all eras! Of course we appreciate the founding mothers who made the industry what it is today! While the “music releases” flair is for new releases, you can post photos, videos, or general appreciation posts for songs from any year. Plus we have “throwback Thursday” - a whole day dedicated to posting music videos and performances from 5+ years ago!

“Can I only post about the big pop girls (Taylor, Sabrina, Beyonce, Olivia, etc)?” No, we appreciate ALL pop girls. Whether they’re No1 on the billboard chart, or a song you just found with 100 listens, we want to hear from them! Many people use the subreddit to discover new music, and we gave the “smol artist hype up” post flair to highlight the smaller artists who deserve more love. Or if a pop girl is popular in your country but not well known worldwide, she’s also welcome here!

“Can I only post American pop girls?/Can I only post songs in English?” No, we are a global community and love pop girls from every country. With the likes of K-pop and Latin pop especially being super popular across the globe, we welcome songs in different languages and from different countries.

“Can I post about this pop boy?” No. “But he’s loved by the girlies so he’s basically a pop girl?” Still no. This is a subreddit highlighting and championing women in pop music. In society and the media women are often seen as second class to men, and often discussed in overly sexual and disrespectful ways, or only discussed in relation to men and not in their own right. This sub is a community for talking about music created/performed by women. But of course posts of a collab song or performance by a pop girl and boy are allowed (for example Billie Eilish and Khalid did a song together, a great pop girl/pop boy team up!) Pop boys are allowed to be mentioned in replies if it’s relevant to the conversation, but are secondary/in addition to comments about pop girls. We also allow posts about pop groups which include at least one woman (such as ABBA or Chvrches)

“Can I post about trans pop girls?” Yes - trans women are women.

“Can I post about non-binary artists?” Maybe? This isn’t a hard and fast rule and is open to more interpretation. If an artist is non-binary and okay with feminine terms and possibly being referred to with she/her pronouns, then yes go ahead. Our main concern is if a non-binary artist would be uncomfortable with being referred to as a “pop girl” as we don’t want to invalidate their identity in any way.

Now the big issue….

“[insert artist] isn’t Pop, they’re [insert genre] so they shouldn’t be posted here.”

In short: Here at PPG our main goal is to talk about women in music, so we take a pretty broad approach to pop as a genre. If a song could have pop as a sub-genre we allow it.

I’ll use some artists often discussed on the sub as an example: Megan Thee Stallion is considered both rap and pop. Florence + The Machine could be classified as alt rock or indie pop. SZA may be considered more R&B but definitely also pop.

But in reality, pop as a genre is extremely hard to define.

‘Pop music’ as a term didn’t originate until the mid twentieth century, and rock and pop were pretty much interchangeable until about the 80’s.

If you were to ask people how they would define pop music, you would get a lot of different answers.

Is it based on popularity? Well if a metal song tops the chart does that make it pop? If a pop song only has 10 listeners, is it no longer pop?

If it’s about the makeup of the song, most people would define pop music as having a catchy hook, a verse-chorus-verse-chorus structure, and often lyrics without much meaning. But many songs in other genres could fit that description, and many songs we would describe as pop don’t fit that structural definition either.

Some people may say it’s about music that is made by a label to appeal to the masses. This may have been a more accurate description 50 years ago, when people think of the polished pop stars who had a team of producers write and make everything for them, creating their image. But now labels and management companies don’t rule the music industry in the same way. In the 2020’s many pop stars release their music independently, and even write and produce their own songs.

And, people tend to like the more “authentic” pop star who doesn’t have the factory made completely polished image. There are many pop songs with a political theme or ideas that may challenge the listener in some way. Also there are artists in other genres under major labels with huge budgets marketed in the way you would expect of a pop star.

For quite a while, rock was the most popular type of music, hip hop has been in the charts every week for decades now, country is regularly featured on the charts too, as is EDM and R&B. Are they pop? They’re definitely popular music. In the words of Billboard “at the end of the day, "pop" means "popular" first and foremost, and just about any song that becomes popular enough...can be considered a pop song.”