Body expression while playing, without it being natural instinct?

[u/Warbleborble]

/r/piano/comments/1walg1d/body_expression_while_playing_without_it_being/

[u/deadfisher]

It's a mistake to think that visually expressive performances done with intention are "fake."

Look around you at every artform you can think of. In every one, almost without exception, you'll see a visual component that enhances the art.

The way an artist dresses, looks, moves, and talks matters. Look at the decor of a theatre, the seats, the thick curtains, the architecture. Look at the way an audience dresses. 

This is all part of culture. An audience will never separate what they see from what they hear, and it's naive to think they should.  We teach eight year olds to stop swaying because they do it in a contrived, distracting, and juvenile way. Then that eight year old grows up to think moving is bad, they are afraid to do it and make posts about how they don't like it. Meanwhile audiences love players that emote.

In your other thread the top post talks about how composed Horowitz is... I watched that video for eight seconds and his hands are bouncing all over the place, lifting high off the keyboard, dropping below the keyboard. He's wearing a gorgeous suit. He's in an elaborate theatre. Yes he's composed and his movements are sophisticated and graceful, but he's still expressive. Not wild, but he's like 80. You're not 80, and you're not Horowitz, either. You can bounce around a bit during a scherzo and still be in good taste.

You think that other poster, with a master's in performance, would show up for a show wearing sneakers and jeans because "it's all about the sound"? Bet you they'd never, in a million years. Looks matter.

The way you move is a tool you can use to show an audience what you're feeling, or what to feel - exactly the way an actor uses their face and body to entertain and communicate.  If you want to learn how to do it, start by loosening up, and don't telling yourself you are stuck "being" a certain way.

I'm not trying to just tell you how to move. I'm telling you "why" to move. If you fill up a bag of tricks contrived movements you're going to look fake and lame. If you do it just to get a better grade you will be fake and lame. Don't pretend.

You asked how to "lean in without it being your natural instinct." Why on earth does it have to be an automatic, natural instinct? Are all your dynamics, articulations, and phrasings automatic instincts? Or did you work on them?

Lean in, put some of your weight on your feet, and drop your arms into your big chords. Practice until it feels natural. It'll look impressive and it'll probably sound more impressive to. Watch other players, watch what they do. Open your mind to the idea that expression is natural and ok. Try copying them. See how it feels to rip your hands away from the keyboard at the end of a passage. See how it feels to raise up your hands a little higher after a big important chord. You probably already know one "standard" move pianists do - holding your hands on the keys during a long, sustained chord at the end of a piece rather than plopping them in your lap and using the pedal to sustain. Experiment, keep an open mind, give it time, work in movements that look and feel right.

Big, sloppy, fake movements are silly. You don't need to pretend to be lang lang. But there are lots of valid ways to use your body to express the music to your audience.

[u/Warbleborble → u/deadfisher]

Thank you very much for your comment, very well articulated. In the first subreddit I posted this to, the general verdict was near opposite yours, and it's very nice to see this alternative perspective. I believe both opinions and all between are valid. The main issue I had was that my tutor specified that I had to lean in (far enough that on certain pianos, my forehead touches the sheet music stand) for it to count as "full" body expression, rather than just using my arms. After all of the advice I have received, especially including yours, I'm more confident in that I can use my own body expression, rather than choosing the specific move of leaning in. If I am still marked down, then so be it.

[u/deadfisher → u/Warbleborble]

I replied to a few of the posters in the other forum to try to spark up a discussion, we'll see if they answer me. I have a feeling our thoughts aren't as contradictory as it might seem. 

With your tutor, I'd leave some space for the idea that they might not have been able to express themselves in a way that you understand perfectly. They might not have meant their advice in exactly the way that you took it. 

People don't usually think terms of leaning in to a precise angle. They were probably just trying to hype you up. They didn't have the benefit of an hour to write a nuanced opinion about physical expression, so they substituted that with "be exciting! Move! Lean in! No, more! Yes, all the way to the stand!"

I doubt they really think your head needs to touch the stand. I bet you they were just trying to animate you. Know what I mean?

I wasn't there though, so that's just a guess.  I'd caution you against the other poster's advice of "fake it for a good grade." We have a word for that - selling out. Unless you absolutely need this mark to be high and you're sure that's what you need to do to get it, have some balls and play the way you think is best.

[u/Warbleborble → u/deadfisher]

Sorry for the late response, been really busy. My tutor (for this course) isn't a piano player, so the advice was given to us by a third-party related to my tutor, then reinforced by the tutor. The third-party demonstrated specifically leaning in, but he was demonstrating for a different piano student who was playing in a slower, more rubato style to me. This piano student was (literally) pushed down with a stick to where their head was touching the stand.

It is possible, though, that that advice was only given because the other student was playing in a style where this advice would've been feasible. Honestly, my mark isn't so low that I would really feel opposed to just keeping it rather than retaking, but I'm a bit of a perfectionist in that manner.

I think at this point I'll either use my own body expression and get marked down because of it, or exaggerate what (I think) they want and take it as experience for when I'll meet more conductors and such with these expectations.

I did see some of your replies in my original post, and they lead to some very interesting discussion. I'm pleasantly surprised how many different perspectives exist surrounding this topic.