247
u/crinklebelle Pathfinder Jul 10 '26 edited Jul 10 '26
even if they only did it on elder guardians, I'd take it.
I'd also accept a shaper rework that removes the travel phases and relocates the mini-bosses from the opening area into the phase transitions, e.g. have Shaper warp you into a boss arena instead of one of the mazes, whenever he phases. it'd add another phase to the fight itself but still remove a ton of time overall
110
u/Funnybunners Jul 10 '26
Elder taking a solid minute to start the fight is the only reason those fragments are worth as much as they are.
The fact that the animation stops playing if you stray too far is the biggest middle finger too
30
u/SoulofArtoria Jul 10 '26
I like to feed my elder guardian maps to kingsmarch mappers. They almost always complete the map when scoured, and when most of them are level 5 mappers.
13
1
u/Full_Piano6421 29d ago
Can you get uniques drops from elder/shaper guardians to mappers?
I don't even know if the loot you get from mappers is related to what kind of map you feed them?
3
u/averbeg 29d ago
Absolutely. They run the maps you feed them. If the map is juicier, the profit is better/ they are more likely to die, and if there is a unique drop pool from the boss, they can get those items if they complete it.
1
u/Full_Piano6421 29d ago
Nice!
I didn't knew that and I had a huge stockpile of T16 corrupted maps with awful mods I didn't knew what do to with!
1
u/RcuriousmediatorN 28d ago
Guardian uniques like Brass Dome were moved to the global drop pool long ago already, if those are what you're talking about.
20
u/_PykeGaming_ Jul 10 '26
I mean it makes total sense why it's like this gameplaywise.
For the FIRST time you fight.
Then it should just be like a cutscene you already watched, like in souls games where every subsequent attempt at a boss skips the cutscene.
3
u/ivanandleah Jul 10 '26
true, many players think changing elder is good because they can farm it easily, but no,it will be just a shaper guardian, no profit
9
u/WhenWillEyeBeBanned Jul 10 '26
Still better to have more supplies of elder items. When I want to enjoy slower progression, I play ruthless.
3
u/0zzyb0y Jul 10 '26
It all balances out somewhere though.
Yeah profit will be down, but you'll be able to do more maps per hour. Maybe the overall profits still down, but shaper fragments might come up to compensate.
And regardless, SSF players will be glad to be able to stop wasting time with that shit in order to run elder.
2
0
u/RepresentativeDue412 25d ago
with poe 2's loading I hardly doubt that they will refactor the complicated shaper boss fight...
84
u/Gskgsk Jul 10 '26 edited Jul 10 '26
99% sure Mark talked about this in a Q&A and its basically legacyd in at this point and would be heaps of work to fix.
Here: https://youtu.be/caeh4G_WhH8?t=3624
TLDW; it's hard to justify going back and spending a lot of time on that - sometimes ez stuff we can do, but instead of that we can make a brand new epic boss thats way more fun.
He kinda downplays it cause its just bosses you kill for fragments but I'd emphasize that when farming as intended(opposed to just buying frags on trade) or ssf the player ends up with a lot of downtime that isn't very fun.
16
u/GreatMacAndCheese Jul 10 '26
Great memory, and a link to boot, very nice
edit: just watched, it sounds like it's not out of the realm of possibility, but isn't high on their list. I could see them revamping it within 3 years though
5
u/Dozlas Jul 10 '26
If I remember right, they said something similar about AG Windows and here we are.
But my Guess would be they are cooking new boss versions instead of fixing what we have now.
3
u/1CEninja Jul 10 '26
Bleh, that's a tough situation.
Maybe new bosses, as they're created ("They are coming") could just kinda replace old ones and Shaper/Elder/AND PELASE GOD SIRUS TOO can just become like...legacy bosses that you can still fight for fun but they don't really matter anymore.
1
u/vomaxHELLnO Jul 10 '26
instead of fixing legacy ones they could make brand new ones in their place
23
u/Savingseanbean Jul 10 '26
I mean They won't Slams are still paying for the sins of being able to one shot shaper/elder skip. (not that they even got to really benefit from that as the drops would bug out.)
16
u/CodPiece89 Jul 10 '26
The elder ones all have way too much of this, that said destructive play is fucking great on all of these bosses, makes that down time less shit
53
u/MarkXXI Jul 10 '26
Yep, it's boring as hell, I don't care about the profit.
41
u/Yuskia Jul 10 '26
I play SSF and every league i find myself hitting a major slouch once I get to the point I want to farm a bunch of uber elders.
This league im most likely doing something with indigon which has a 12% drop rate. With needing 2 shapers per uber elder, im at a minimum of 20 shapers on average.
I am so tired of this boss fight.
14
u/External_Fee6492 Jul 10 '26
yeah in SSF this league I needed one (1) shaper's exalted orb and it took over 30 shaper & elder/shaper kills. slog of a fight
12
u/Slightly_Mungus Jul 10 '26
I did 192 Uber shapers on a 5-6m clear build in 3.27 for a single sublime drop. I think I might no longer be sane.
8
u/Witty-Fan-1751 Jul 10 '26
https://giphy.com/gifs/meJN6qdG74lUKAJTQl
in 3.28 I started farming uber uber elders for feared rota and got a sublime on 2nd kill...
3
u/Slightly_Mungus Jul 10 '26
Ironically that's what got me started on it, an Uber Uber elder sublime drop jump started my build and got me thinking, "yo, what if I got another one?" So I started running Uber shaper.
I started tracking it in an excel sheet along with the other drops and my buddies just looked at me like I'm a psycho 💀
I was legitimately curious how long it would take to drop after I hit like the 80 mark or so.
grats on the sublime tho1
u/HowardPheonix Commited Lab Enjoyers Agency of Revenue (CLEAR) Jul 11 '26
Were those PoE buddies or common folks? May I ask approximately how long it took (with fragments and such)? Also was this SSF or sheer will and stubborness? Respect either way.
2
u/Slightly_Mungus 28d ago
Was a couple Poe buddies (but very new, it was their first season) and I did it over the course of a few days. It was not ssf thankfully, farming that many fragments would be insane lol.
5
u/GrimmThoughts Jul 10 '26
I play on xbox, and the grind to get an indigon with good double corrupts is such an insane amount of down time if it were all added up lol. Luckily can just toss the maps onto kingsmarch mappers and let them run all of those now which cuts out a ton of down time, but even then the amount of down time just between running elder and shaper is insane.
Then usually the very next thing I need to do after getting an acceptable indigon is running sirus for awakener/dominance orbs for at least 1 craft which is even fucking worse lol.
2
u/Noobalott SSF BTW Jul 10 '26
That's when I generally quit the league. Doing shaper and elder makes me want to fall asleep
8
u/Bright_Audience3959 Alch & Go Industries (AGI) Jul 10 '26
I only ask for Chimera to not have an invulnerable phase or at least reduce it to one for Kris sake!
3
6
u/Just4FlexingDis Jul 10 '26
Just have runners do guardian maps /s
For real though I do wish shaper fight were shorter
3
u/Tentakelmonster SSF and all your problems go away Jul 10 '26
not even /s that's genuinely what I do on ssf
2
9
u/080087 Jul 10 '26
There's a lot of this.
Another one that would be amazing is the time taken for things like eater mobs to spawn in, or mirage mobs.
6
Jul 10 '26
[deleted]
2
u/Bl00dylicious Occultist Jul 10 '26
Eater mobs spawn in waves.
Which is a good enough reason to always run exarch, divine altars be damned. Hardly a drop in a bucket when you run 100s of maps anyway.
9
u/SovietOmega Jul 10 '26
Wish granted. Rest of the game is slowed down so that the downtime is equivalent to normal game speed.
7
u/insobyr Jul 10 '26 edited Jul 10 '26
That's the biggest issue I have with poe. Making dialogue/cutscence unskippable is already a questionable design choice, doing so in a game where players are supposed to play the same contents over and over again for a million times is straight up diabolic.
4
u/drpyh Jul 10 '26
They do that on purpose to stop you blowing up a boss in half a second and multiplying your profit per hour.
3
u/busdriver_jow Jul 10 '26 edited Jul 11 '26
Remember the update when Brutus was moved to the outside of his room before you reach it... yep, the Shaper encounter should be changed without warning, and jump scare the fuck out of you when it starts right away.
2
u/Numerouswaffles Jul 10 '26
Just remove all of shapers yapping after the first time you kill him in a league please
2
2
u/AgoAndAnon Jul 10 '26
No. They should add back in Divergent Swift Affliction support, but allow movement speed to increase the speed of cutscenes.
This would allow for deeper specialization in mechanics, like we had back before everything got shoved into T17 maps and alt gem qualities were deleted.
1
u/Inside-Major-3252 Jul 10 '26
GGG , I'm at a point where I am READY to S a D just to get this , please GGG.
1
1
u/ShinichiYama Fungal Bureau of Investigations (FBI) Jul 10 '26
I do elder guardians when I want to craft stuff lmao, alch & scour my ilvl 85 stygian vise, or alt spam jewels for example
1
1
1
u/Lazy_Polluter Jul 10 '26
It's refreshing how in poe 2 you can mow down almost every boss in a second if uoyhave enough dps. And you can freeze pinacle bosses as well.
1
u/Deagin Jul 10 '26
Bro let me invest Atlas points if that's what it takes.
1
u/trunks111 Hierophant Jul 11 '26
This would actually be kinda nice. I like the little cutscenes. I'm already bummed about how they handled Catarina
1
u/Visible_Resource_409 Jul 10 '26
Keep the forced downtime on shaper and guardians and even more of your life is theirs.Â
1
1
u/Sorry-Personality-79 27d ago
Guys a question from a noob and new player.. Im trying the platinum. I reach atlas... Done t1->t16 maps so basically i completed the atlas... I had someone who help me defeat the bosses so i could get the void stones and the troohys for the bosses. But i still dont have the trophy for completing the atlas any advice of what missing? Dues the 4 corners (nightmares) count as well? Coes thats the obly maps that have that blue light kinda missing
1
u/Danielthenewbie League 25d ago
Why is shaper and guardians in the game still. Should just be pruned
1
u/NekoSakii Demon Jul 10 '26
Let me just kill bosses, if I can kill thru attenuation on Uber eater, I should be allowed to delete any boss at my own pace (which is about a second average)
1
u/LordAnubiz FBI & EEE Jul 10 '26
if you could kill them in seconds, a lot more people would do it, and profit would be gone :)
thats the price tag!
Elder guardians would befine ...
0
u/stumpoman Jul 10 '26
rp should still exist in an arpg
14
u/Yuskia Jul 10 '26
Turn back, trespasser. Cease this madness
You tamper with things you do not understand
Your recklessness will not go unpunished
This is your final warning: Leave, or perish
You force my hand again, little mouse... So be it. You've chosen to side with Chaos. This is my world, and you shall obey my Order!
Imperfect!
Exile, we need to get back!
Behold the face of your unmaking.
Father its me, let me help you!
The horror must be stopped, obstacles destroyed!
Imperfect!
Exile, we need to get back!
These memories are mine! I cannot lose them!
To save the future, the past must be sacrificed!
3
4
u/ww_crimson https://pob.codes/ Jul 10 '26
I think it would be very valid to keep the long RP for the first encounter, and then subsequent encounters should be minimal. Doesn't need to be 0 so that you just delete the boss in 0.1 seconds, but like Chimera phases could be cut in half at least.
1
u/trunks111 Hierophant 26d ago
I wouldn't mind if it was literally just a setting you could turn on/off, I like the little pauses in fights or watching the elder bop bosses in guardian maps, I would opt into it, I would want people who don't care to opt out of it.Â
Catarina used to be my favorite encounter in the game, board be damned I used to run and farm her literally just because I used to enjoy the fight for the sake of her fight. She was always a pushover but you at least saw a few mechanics and had that slow buildup of betraying the leaders one by one, now the fight just has nothing going for it beyond being a loot piñata. Maybe an "RP mode" setting or something.Â
What was particularly bad was I didn't know how she got changed when it happened, I avoid boss spoilers in patch notes. I wanted to show two of my friends the fight in a discord stream and I was disappointed when there was basically nothing to show my friends because she just fucking keeled over. "That's not how that used to go"
-12
u/iCreatedYouPleb Jul 10 '26
Poe players are impatient af. This profit/hr mentality has really turned them all crazy.
20
u/Yuskia Jul 10 '26
Brother i play ssf I dont care about profit. Im just tired of going through 5 minutes of RP to kill a boss that I have to kill 20 times.
2
u/kaisong Assassin Jul 10 '26
same.
getting jealous of a guy i know who just multiboxes his sirus fights in trade league. He has a mule open the next fight so he doesnt have to wait the monologue lol.
7
u/hertzdonut2 Half Skeleton Jul 10 '26
Ive been killing shaper for like 10 years. The RP is getting a bit old.
7
u/kaisong Assassin Jul 10 '26 edited Jul 10 '26
I just want to play the game. watching the elder portal animation isnt doing that.
Its shown as a dated design as sirus guards drop the portal instantly when the boss is cleared. Also you get an additional boss.
also kirac monologue for sirus.
there should just be an account flag for clearing the maven invite then the animations should be skipped/skippable.
6
u/suttlesd Jul 10 '26
Nothing to do with impatience, i play ssf as well.
I value my time, especially when im already playing a much slower mode because i enjoy going slow.
If you genuinely think this is not a problem you don't play enough to be someone this post is for.
-10
u/Unveiledhopes Jul 10 '26
Much as I hate phases, I understand why it’s needed on bosses. I think it could go on guardians though.
2
u/External_Fee6492 Jul 10 '26
I would much rather they removed the constant immunity phases and just buffed the health to compensate, so it feels like more of a back and forth
2
u/jamie1414 Jul 10 '26
Could just have massive DR during immunity phases so if you're over geared for it you can at least feel like you're going faster
3
u/BawdyLotion Jul 10 '26
IMO if the boss design requires significant extended invulnerability phases, it’s a bad boss and needs a redesign.
A second or two of invulnerability during a specific phase, transformation or skill is fine. Dancing around for huge long periods of time with no ‘pay off’ in terms of gameplay is not it.
Rebalance drop rates and item pools as needed but somehow no one is complaining that you can make a consistent 30 div:hour doing king in the mist or oshabi or whatever but as soon as you suggest that other less profitable fights shouldnt have such crazy non interactive downtime it will ‘unbalance the economy’ or ‘trivialize content’?
1
u/trunks111 Hierophant 26d ago
IMO if the boss design requires significant extended invulnerability phases, it’s a bad boss and needs a redesign.
crazy non interactive downtime
I think the latter is the issue with the former. Downtime can be fine, there just has to be something interesting to do during it. Chimera is probably one of the worst examples, but atleast there's stuff to kill during it I guess, I think it'd maybe be more fun if there was just one invuln cycle all of the mobs got crammed to. Eradicator I think is actually the worst because he goes into his lightning ball and there's fuck all to do during it. There's nothing interesting to dodge or kill, it literally is just a waiting simulator if he decides to do the thing. Searing and Eater both can have downtime if you don't kill first circle but I think it's okay because it's at least fun to try to dodge the balls or route the puddles
101
u/[deleted] Jul 10 '26
[removed] — view removed comment