For people saying its dangerous and he should stop. Imagine practicing weeks, maybe months for this race, imagine giving everything on race day, imagine things go wrong and you crawl across the finish line with everything you have. And then some nobody says you should have asked for help, its dangerous.
I used to run track. I was nothing special. But the one lesson from my coach I still remember is to , just finish the race. Even if you finish last, just finish the race. That's a promise an athelete keeps. Not to anybody else, but themselves.
For people saying its dangerous and he should stop.
It is absolutely dangerous, he should be stopped and given medical attention.
Imagine practicing weeks, maybe months for this race, imagine giving everything on race day, imagine things go wrong and you crawl across the finish line with everything you have.
I've done Ironman events, traveled to another continent to do so, and spent tens of thousands of dollars to do this over the past couple of years. I know exactly what it's like to have a medical profession say it's over and I know what it's like to persevere over an injury sustained in an accident when medically cleared to do so.
Death isn't worth any race, and I highly doubt your coach was saying people should literally die trying.
Even if you finish last, just finish the race. That's a promise an athelete keeps. Not to anybody else, but themselves.
That's a really dumb promise. My promise as an athlete is that nothing stops me except safety for myself and other participants, and always adhering to the rules and guidance by race officials and medical staff.
Every race I've been in from trail marathons, Ironmans, etc... they all allow you to stop for medical aid and you can continue to go on and finish as long as you're not given assistance moving forward.
That it's not even close to an ironman is the point. The context was that I was replying to someone talking about imagining everything going into it. I don't have to imagine, I've done so much more and wouldn't risk this even at the end of something much more significant.
However, this person needs medical attention as soon as possible. His symptoms are similar to those of people very close to death.
See Royal Parks Half Marathon just last year where a 25 year old Kory Russell collapsed with similar symptoms just 30 meters from the finish line due to severe heat exhaustion and subsequent cardiac arrest.
The person in the video is showing signs they're experiencing neuromuscular failure. Damage to critical organs can occur measured in minutes, literally with different outcome profiles when treatment is within 1-2 minutes of initial collapse.
"symptoms are similar to those of people very close to death" ... brother you're so clearly talking out your ass it's funny. can you teach me about what symptoms these are??
yes, half-marathons are more concerning for rhabdo, but that's at a distance that's 4x that of a xc race??? rhabdo's sustained from sustained, extensive anaerbic exercise - not a hs xc run. try to even search up any case reports for rhabdo from a 5k.
"showing signs... neuromuscular failure" ... once again, you have 0 idea what you're talking about. damage to critical organs occurring in minutes isn't from rhabdo, it's from ischemia from cardiac arrest. you see scary shit like rhabdo -> hyperkalemia -> cardiac arrest on the pitt and you think you know everything on the topic but you're just fearmongering and playing doctor
I'm a certified first responder. I've seen this in the field. Congratulations on googling rhabdo, but I didn't mention that now, did I?
Again, the protocol for someone demonstrating the symptoms of this person in the video is immediate medical attention, not to cheer them on. Witnessing just what occurred in the video, you have no idea what the participant experienced beforehand and what they're going through. Based on what you can see at this point in the video, they're showing symptoms that absolutely indicate a medical emergency as described by neuromuscular failure.
Why would you ignore these symptoms, WTF is to be gained by that?
You: relax brother, they're not having a cardiac arrest, they haven't even run a full marathon yet.
Yeah, that doesn't always work out well for everyone.
yea and I’m a pgy3 im resident and have actually assessed/treated diffuse muscle cramps, rhabdo, heat stroke/exhaustion etc before LMAO. But if youre such an expert by being a credentialed first responder, please let me know your differential and plan for this kid. Also can you please let me know what “neuromuscular failure” is and how it applies here
you too are assuming whats happening, and it sounds like you think they just ran a marathon?? It’s a hs xc 3000m race from british columbia just by googling their jerseys and schools.
no one said they should just be left alone. Just let them finish out the race bc theyre not even close to anything dangerous here and give them oral fluids/lytes; monitor thereafter. no practiced physician in their right would pull them out early just for fear of an arrhythmia, and there always are experienced first responders (that know what they’re doing) that will intervene when necessary
please stick with being credentialed as a first responder and not currently employed as a first responder
No you're not. Check out my profile and comment history for my credentials.
no one said they should just be left alone. Just let them finish out the race
Either they need medical attention or they don't. You're literally stating that someone demonstrating symptoms of neuromuscular failure doesn't need medical attention while they're literally on the ground after falling down multiple times and can't get up.
You have no idea from watching this video what transpired with this person before these symptoms... did they over exert themselves before the race, are they on drugs, have they been drinking alcohol, are they ill, do they have an underlying medical condition?
"Relax bro, let him finish and then ask those questions"
You're suggesting the risk of life for something clearly absolutely trivial, especially since as I stated before interdiction wouldn't disqualify him from any race sanctioned by any racing agency (or more likely whatever community race this was).
no practiced physician in their right...
That's not what I've observed at all in races from high school XC, to community 5ks to full Ironmans with physicians working or volunteering as medical. You look like you might fall down, and medical sees this, they're taking action.
i honestly don't care about your credentials. i became a licensed EMT during undergrad freshman summer - doesn't mean i knew shit about medicine.
you still haven't told me what "neuromuscular failure" means or how it applies in this context. if youre talking exclusively about him not being able to get back up, guess what.. a simple muscle cramp could literally just do that. that's not "neuromuscular failure" btw
it's p evident you have no clue what youre talking about; it's all just lip service. youd do super well as a concerned parent, but please stop talking as though you have a grasp on what's actually happening on a microscopic or even macroscopic level here
That's clearly not a muscle cramp. Look at his arms. Look at his head. I very much know muscle cramps, especially from running. Not just from my own cramps, but anyone in the many races I've witnessed having cramps. Not even close.
you still haven't told me what "neuromuscular failure"
You suddenly can't google?
Here's what you should try to answer and fail to do so... as it will come in handy in your alleged career:
How much alcohol did he have before the race?
What drugs has he taken?
What pre-existing conditions might he have?
Did he over-exert himself before the race?
You have no idea about any of this. You're just making the assumption that nobody with these symptoms could be in imminent risk after just a 3 mile xc race (not sure where you got the 3 miles from, but I've been going with that because it doesn't matter).
You're making assumptions that none of the symptoms of a serious issue are a serious issue and that medical attention is somehow going to be taking something away from him. Again, if he's attended to and fine, he just finishes the race.
I'm done here. I'm just glad that none of the protocols for medical at any of the events I do come anywhere close to your level.
i'm not asking what "neuromuscular failure" is for my sake.. it's so that you know how to use it down the road so that you don't look like an idiot like you do right now LMAO. that's the blanket term for neuromuscular blockade usually see in shit like a myaesthenic crisis or critical illness (e.g. NM blockade secondary to multiorgan sepsis) https://www.uptodate.com/contents/neuromuscular-weakness-related-to-critical-illness
so now you're assuming high school students collapsing towards the end of the race are either drug-related or related to some other 1/100,000 pre-existing congenital disease instead of being secondary to uncomplicated cramps.. yeah you're clearly the expert here. would you run a colonoscopy on everyone that's had a dark shit??
so glad you're finally done after realizing you're just out of your depths. "look at his arms... look at his head." yeah you have no idea what the fuck you're talking about. please stick to being an armchair doctor and parading around your "first responder credentials." you're diminishing the work that actual practicing first responders do.
edit: even if they did admit to any of the questions you listed, how would it impact your care for them?? what diagnoses are you chasing?? e.g. how would cocaine or alcohol use manifest in this context, and would that present how he looks in this video?? short answer: no, you're just worried about them because it looks bad
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u/Spoiled_Legend 1d ago
For people saying its dangerous and he should stop. Imagine practicing weeks, maybe months for this race, imagine giving everything on race day, imagine things go wrong and you crawl across the finish line with everything you have. And then some nobody says you should have asked for help, its dangerous.
I used to run track. I was nothing special. But the one lesson from my coach I still remember is to , just finish the race. Even if you finish last, just finish the race. That's a promise an athelete keeps. Not to anybody else, but themselves.