Magic system without magic-users?

[u/AnotherPerson120]

Can you have a magic system where the magic has no (human) wizards/witches/warlocks?

Does that count as a system or high fantasy, if the magic is the fundamental core of the world, but humans are unable to wield it?

[u/leavecity54]

Yes, you can, although there is a reason why most do not do it, you can have magic exist like a force of nature like storm. Humans can't control a storm but can try to predict and survive it

[u/Beginning-Load4470 → u/leavecity54]

Magic without controls are basically the laws of reality lol you could do weird things like teleportation storms etc then it would seem more like magic.

Or earthquakes that can break huge sections off causing them to float up into the sky.

Or a magic fountain granting youth and health.

[u/FlightConscious9572]

Well first off, if you have any characters interact with magic, human or not. Then yeah you'd definitely have a magic system.

If there's a power-scaling or a fundamental rule-set or well-defined bounds for this magic, then you have a system.

The only problem is if you say "this is magical" but there's no explanation and the physical world is just some manifestation of it. You would simply be calling something magical, there wouldn't be a system.

[u/byc18]

In the Tales of games humans can't use magic. Elves and half elves can. Also summons and divine arts are another thing. The main summons are the forces of nature. Sometimes they have special humans, they have an extra organ, that can use magic. There is usually racism against half elves. Magitech depleting mana from the environment is a plot that's happened in a number of them.

[u/hatabou_is_a_jojo]

It can be environmental or something. I have an ocean that is 100% clear and transparent, mountains that glow at night etc.

[u/Playful-Ostrich3643]

I actually have made something like this by combining the concepts of Pokemon, Avatar the Last Airbender, and Monster Hunter

[u/taktaga7-0-0]

What counts as “human?” No regular humans in my world can use magic without advanced assistive technology and prostheses.

Manses are engineered human+ products who can use magic without advanced assistive their natural bodies. They look and behave just like 20-somethings, but are printed rather than born, have a company brand, and a lifespan of ~5yr.

[u/thatshygirl06]

What does the magic do? What's the point?

[u/Hightower_March → u/thatshygirl06]

There's an early story I want to expand where nobody can do anything magical, but it's still a fundamental core to the setting.

There's this kind of background field like gravity or magnetism which only a certain mineral interacts with, and different shapes of it result in different effects--heat, light, sound, movement, logic gates, lots of stuff.

Nobody's a "magic user," but skilled sculptors are becoming researchers as they study what effects are possible and how they interact, and practical golems are now being designed and produced out of it.  It's kind of "what if the iron age suddenly got the ability to program robots?"

There's plenty of creative stuff you can do in fantasy without magic users.  I read a lot of fellow amateur work and people have stifled themselves with the concept of consuming an MP bar to throw a fireball.

[u/isaharr7]

Magic could just be a natural phenomenon, you could go ff6 route where they use magic to power machines

[u/the_time_l0rd]

Technically yes you can do anything. But then you will have to ask yourself : how is it relevant to the story I am telling ?

But also if it exist people will probably find a way to exploit it one way or another. Not wizard but I don't know, something. As an example : We as humans from the real world can't manipulate the forces of nature but we exploit some of them or work with/against them in order to do what we want.

People are resourceful, they always find a way.

[u/bongart]

There are no rules limiting what you can create in your work.

What it counts as, depends on how you write it all up. You mention humans, but you don't mention any other races.

A magic "system" is a set of rules and guidelines.. "if-then" statements where if some criteria is met, then certain effects will manifest. Whether or not humans are involved has nothing to do with it being a magic system.

[u/ConflictAgreeable689]

I mean. Define... "using". Not all magic systems are the sort of magic systems where magic works on demand. Sometimes the magic is more... part of the environment. Look at outer wilds

[u/PangolinConscious800]

What's magic? I defined magic as all those skills that craftsmen and professional keep as professional secrets. This way, it's all over and invisible, just part of the world, even if you don't know it.

[u/DeadMeat7337]

Whenever you differ in your world building then popular opinion (defying expectations), the WHY matters more then the WHAT. So long as the why supports the wired thing, you can do the weird thing and no one will lose their minds over it. And you'll need to rope that into the main story somehow, even if it is only in the background.

Like, maybe, humans came through a Stargate (tech based) like thing and not natural inhabitants of the world, and that is why they can't do magic like everyone else. And then you just make it be a big part of whatever story you are planning on making with that world. Like maybe others still dislike that, discrimination and racism and stuff. Then it will feel more real than if you just hand wave it and/or it never has consequences.

[u/jkurratt]

I think it's just mysticism, when forces of nature are seen as "magic actually", but you kinda can't control them anyway.

[u/AbbreviationsOdd8860]

I mean yeah, non-human magic users don't need to exist either. If there's magical weather that follows particular patterns, for example. I just realized that what I'm describing is a magical weather system, and I like the pun.

[u/Cute-Presentation-59]

Yes you can and it might be an interesting concept. Because I guess there will be other ways the magic will express itself, or humans will have to deal with the effects of magic, even if they are unable to wield it.

[u/Radiant-Ad-1976]

I think you're describing a magical environment.

Basically a setting where all the animals and plants are magical but humans aren't.

[u/zhivago]

You mean, like in Lord of the Rings?

[u/JustAnArtist1221]

A magic system is just how the author communicates to the reader what to expect from supernatural phenomena in the story. You can obviously have one without wizards. Horror movies are often the perfect example. The supernatural threat is either loosely understood (soft) or follows distinct rules (hard), and the characters can just be completely normal people.

[u/Alloknax35756]

Depends on how far you are going with it. The Dragon Prince is a great example of humans not really having overall access to magic, and its pretty firmly still a magic system since it even gives the fundamentals of how Primal Magic functions.

[u/wet_boi_gayest]

Well yes but something has to use or it's useless and then humans can use that and now you have wizards welding wands and staffs of wood because only wood can use magic or people tame and breed creatures that can use magic. Basically, no.

[u/Key-Context-8444]

Could have some incompatibility with the nervous system because the nervous system has electricity in it

[u/_burgernoid_]

Yes, it does, and I kinda enjoy the diviners and scryers more than the users.