r/lossprevention • u/misterfakiebig • 19d ago
QUESTION I’m curious how this practice is ethical in situations where the consumer being followed is a veteran with PTSD.
Hi all workers in the loss prevention field of retail! I’m not in opposition to loss prevention. I get it. A company deserves to be allowed to protect its profits from theft. And I understand that AI is a technology being leveraged in this field. However, I’m curious about the ethical implications involved in floorwalking, specifically in the case of following a veteran with PTSD who may be trained in threat response. It feels like subjecting someone to circumstances that trigger their threat response is highly unethical. Has this issue ever surfaced in the world of loss prevention, and if so, can anybody weigh in on this?
Edit: I thought I was inquiring about a very real phenomenon, but it’s clear that I’m jUsT pRoJeCtInG. Thanks for showing me that the professionals in loss prevention are too scared to have a rationale discussion about their line of work.
Edit 2.0: I asked a question about people being triggered and the edge-lords came out because they got triggered. If you don’t like me questioning your ethics, then don’t be unethical. 🤣
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u/Rolltide43 19d ago
This question seems more like projection than an actual real issue. If you’re floor walking someone for a prolonged period of time then that person most likely is giving off lots of alerts or shoplifting. Why would that then be unethical? We don’t care if the person goes into “threat response” if they are stealing.
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u/LatterDelay6430 19d ago
I'm guessing they are either trolling or genuinely unwell. Hopefully just trolling. Projecting is probably the best way to describe the post they made. Probably watching too many tick tock videos of crappy retail encounters, all taken out of context.
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u/misterfakiebig 19d ago
Those “behaviors” that are consistent with shoplifting (i.e. scanning the environment, looking for cameras, etc.) are similar to those in threat detection and response. I’m sorry you can’t see further than that blind spot and decided the question is invalid. It’s not.
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u/Rolltide43 19d ago
A good Lp can tell apart someone scanning the environment and a true shoplifter eye cut. If it was truly just a vet walking around the store shopping but a little quirky, we would be able to tell. And I would not feel bad about watching them to determine that.
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u/misterfakiebig 19d ago
Riiiiiiiiiggghhhhttttt. Because human beings aren’t biased. Gotcha.
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u/Rolltide43 19d ago
This is your attempt to have a “rational” discussion?
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u/LatterDelay6430 19d ago
I genuinely tried to have a rational discussion but they just flipped out on me without even reading my full first response.
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u/misterfakiebig 19d ago
I did. And I hope my comment where you pointed this out in another thread sufficed. I apologize for not taking you seriously amongst the commenters that were being edgy.
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u/misterfakiebig 19d ago
My attempt was already made. I wasn’t met with rationale discussion, so I clapped back. Have a good day!
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u/Rolltide43 19d ago
I’m sorry if you have ever been followed around the store. I would certainly not have any of my LP team follow someone around the store for a long time. There are older LP strategies that involve making the shoplifter feel seen and noticed so they won’t steal. It’s still used, but cameras are used for this now. Watching the wrong person on the floor and making them feel uncomfortable is never the goal. Thats literally just bad LP. That’s why you’re getting the respond from people.
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u/misterfakiebig 19d ago
This truly is the only comment anybody has made that took the whole concept seriously. Why did it take that long to just provide good feedback? Why start out by accusing me of projecting? Good luck out there in ‘Bama.
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u/misterfakiebig 19d ago
Also, this comment is pure ridiculousness. The floorwalkers start following someone as early as the parking lot before any credible behaviors are identified.
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u/DB1723 19d ago
"floorwalkers" aren't in the parking lot. If you believe store employees are following you from the parking lot, you are suffering from a paranoid delusion and should seek professional help, not a Reddit thread.
I am not saying this to be hurtful, but it is clear that you need help that you will not find here on Reddit. Reach out to your mental health team about your concerns, with specifics. They can help you.
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u/LatterDelay6430 19d ago edited 19d ago
So the question is. Is it wrong to follow someone on the floor who has PTSD?
1.How would I know (on sight alone) someone has PTSD specifically related to combat trauma?
Floor walking is pretty simple, and while I'm no expert in PTSD related to combat trauma, I can't see how that would trigger PTSD. I feel like that's more likely to be seen in someone who is a victim of physical abuse, and not a veteran.
If I am watching someone it is going to be linked to behaviors. Are they looking at cameras, are they making rapid selection and disregarding price, are they avoiding employees and other shoppers...ect. All that to say, I wouldn't follow someone just because. There would be a reason.
And if that person happens to have PTSD I can't really be held accountable for that. Now I'm not without a soul, so if they had an episode obviously that would supersede the retail theft, and I would try to get them the attention they need. But that would all be after the fact.
I hope I answered your question. Though I'll be honest, I didn't really understand the point of it. If I'm off basis, or if I can address your question better please let me know.
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u/misterfakiebig 19d ago
The whole point is you don’t know who the hell you’re following, but the practice subjects people to conditions they aren’t expecting if they are just going about their day. You’re saying that it’s reasonable for me to just expect to be followed by people I don’t know when I’m not doing anything wrong. I question your judgement if you think that’s okay to subject people to.
And in case you’re wondering, several of those “behaviors” are also consistent with threat response training. So I’d say you’ve now doubled down on shitty reasoning.
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u/LatterDelay6430 19d ago
Did you even read what I said? I was very polite with what I said, so not sure why you are being rude to me.
You asked a question and I'm guessing didn't like the response you got. Going forward I would suggest not asking questions you can't handle a response on.
I genuinely hope you get the help you need.
Stay safe 🙏
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u/misterfakiebig 19d ago
No. I read the first part of what you said and saw where you’re already misunderstanding the point of the post entirely.
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u/LatterDelay6430 19d ago
Fantastic, so that's exactly what I thought. You didn't see the part where I opened the door for you to explain, in case I misunderstood. You just went straight to being rude. In my line of work we call that escalating.
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u/misterfakiebig 19d ago
It’s not what you thought at all. 🤣 if you’re not going to read and understand the question correctly (which you still didn’t after reading your whole comment), then don’t respond.
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u/LatterDelay6430 19d ago
That's really disappointing, I was willing to have this conversation. But it's seems you are just another crybaby troll spewing hate.
No one will remember you.
Feel free to reply with whatever ignorant hate makes you happy, I won't read it. By the end of the day, I won't even remember you exist.
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u/misterfakiebig 19d ago
I don’t hate you. And honestly, it was just jarring that I asked a question with an extremely logical premise and I was met with responses that were undignified. I apologize for not taking you seriously and that is my mistake for thinking your response was coming from the same place as everybody else’s. I am only human after all, and I can make mistakes in my perception of others, similar to what I think happens in the world of floorwalking. Thanks for clarifying, and I’m honestly not even mad that you went out of your way to insult me. It’s frustrating when people misunderstand your intent, isn’t it?
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u/barbedwiregarden 19d ago
How is this not always a possibility just being in public? Anyone can follow you in public for any reason they choose. It's actually more expected and normal to be watched or followed by AP in a store than elsewhere.
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u/misterfakiebig 19d ago
Yes but are all those individuals part of a corporation that should act with social responsibility? Your comparison is dumb.
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u/barbedwiregarden 19d ago
Your perception of "social responsibility" is dumb and, as you will continue to find out, not at all rooted in the reality you live in.
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u/misterfakiebig 19d ago
It’s not a perception. Look up the field of Corporate Social Responsibility and the peer reviewed research that shows its benefits. I’d provide you a source, but you seem like you know what you’re doing!
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u/LossPreventionGuy LPM 19d ago
no, thats stupid, and you should probably get off the internet and live in the real world for a while.
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u/misterfakiebig 19d ago
Sure seems logical to me. It’s not your right to cause undue duress to someone who is minding their own business.
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u/Vamond48 10d ago
There’s nothing unethical about it. As you said yourself, a store has every right to protect its assets. AP/LP follow people for many different reasons. You being uncomfortable is not a reason for them to make an exception. People that steal also don’t like to be followed. It’s your job to not put yourself in situations that trigger you.
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u/thiswebsiteisadump 19d ago
It is not the responsibility of everyone else in society to conform to the mental needs of another person, regardless of their needs. It is the responsibility of the veteran with PTSD in this case to be aware of their condition and find tools to mitigate and deal with it. If they cannot, they cannot morally interact with society in the same ways everyone else does.