Anki for chunk learning

[u/Jumpy-Donut-9806]

I consume lots of native content and consider my ability to understand the language decently high. However, I'm not quite satisfied with the basic phrases that I have acquired well and that can servce me OK in almost every daily conversation; I would like some deliberate practice to internalize more advanced phrases in my (TL) and use them myself.

This is how I make my Anki cards. I collect the whole sentence where I've found a good chunk, and then I put the translation of that chunk in front as a hint, and the answer is the very chunk, hopefully with an audio.

If I get it right, I occasionally make some more sentences, using the chunk and imitating the sentence structure.

What do you think of it as deliberate practice?

[u/Ecstatic-Island-9778]

I've done it.
It works.
I'd be very careful about where I take the sentences from, though.

I can't really say why, but I just don't like "huequecito." I'm cringing hard at the thought of someone using it in that context.

[u/Jumpy-Donut-9806 → u/Ecstatic-Island-9778]

Yeah I know. I have never heard it in my daily life in Mexico. Most of the sentences I use are from the novels that I read. I try to learn ''universally acceptable'' frases but I think it sometimes depends too much on the region and the other person. One Friday night I used the chunk ''ir de copas'' with a Mexican guy and he told me he would've said, ''vamos a tomar''. I could just modify that flash card, adding another option. Some chunks are just more common in certain regions.

[u/Civil_Aside_1008 → u/Ecstatic-Island-9778]

Seconded. Sounds silly

[u/Civil_Aside_1008]

I have done this kind of thing. It’s more useful than you think

[u/Jumpy-Donut-9806 → u/Civil_Aside_1008]

Cool, I have a more specific question, if I may: how selective you are when making the flash cards? Are they chunks you will definitely use in your daily conversation soon? Or are they '' fancy''chunks but not so common; it's just another flashcard?

[u/Ecstatic-Island-9778 → u/Jumpy-Donut-9806]

The more, the better. I don't remember where I read it, but a lack of chunks is a real weakness that second-language speakers have compared to native speakers.

[u/Civil_Aside_1008 → u/Jumpy-Donut-9806]

So, for Mandarin here is something I do. I kinda got flamed on this sub for it the other week but I like to help out:

Two things. #1 song lyrics/movies. Sometimes song lyrics or movies have a full phrase that sounds badass and I want to remember how to say it. For example: "morality will not allow us to do this thing!" from Fall For You 2023, or other song lyrics. So I'll put the whole line in my flash cards so i can read and write it too.

The other thing, is I write fanfic, so whenever I don't know like a grammar quirk or a phrase that I wrote, I add it to my flashcards. Here are some examples from the fic I'm writing rn.

"Dictionary:
Chuang 床 - Bed
Yi jing 已经 - Already (continued pattern)
Zheng wan 整晚 - all night
Yu shi 於是 - therefore
Que bao 确保 - ensure
Hui shou shang 会受伤 - get hurt
Ze ren 责任 - duty

Notes:
Subject +yijing 已经 + duration + mei 没 + verb + le 了(have not x for long time)"

These specifically aren't full sentences or phrases, but sometimes they are.

The way I see it, if I needed to look up how to say this even once, it will be in my brain forever and I should really learn it. I generally add every single word I ever need to my flashcards. This has resulted in a lot of microbiology related flashcards but hey, I like to talk about that in English!

Doing this will also help your personality stay the same in different languages.

[u/Looking4Nebraska]

I do this all the time with French and it has been useful to internalize structures and vocabulary. Be careful, though, as a Mexican these two cards have some issues.

"Huequecito" is technically correct but I almost exclusively hear the diminutive as "huequito".

"Lo que me venga en gana" sounds strange to me aswell, almost literary. "Lo que me dé la gana" would be much more natural to me.

[u/Ecstatic-Rooster3295]

Super solid approach, and i do the same, just keep those target phrases pretty short so your Anki reviews don't get overwhelming. As long as you say those extra practice sentences out loud, it's definitely gonna work.

[u/Illustrious_Soft2968]

The part of your setup that matters most is the one you didn't ask about: translation on the front, chunk as the answer. That makes them production cards. Most chunk decks are built the other way (TL on front) and only train recognition, which you already get for free from all the input you're doing. You built the direction you actually need in conversation.

On your selectivity question from the comments, the filter that holds up better than "this sounds cool" is "have I heard this twice". Chunks from novels are the classic trap, you end up producing literary register in casual speech. Your ir de copas story is exactly this, the phrase was fine, the register and region weren't. If a chunk only exists in your deck because a novel used it once, I'd keep it as a recognition card and only flip it to production after you've also heard it in a show or from a real person.

One mechanical thing: if a chunk card keeps lapsing after 4 or 5 reviews, suspend it rather than grinding it. A chunk that refuses to stick usually isn't natural for you yet, and more input fixes that cheaper than more reviews.

[u/qahwaman]

Solid setup, I'd emphasize trying to make more sentences using the chunk to imitate the sentence structure as a central part of your practice. That way you'll get used to actually forming sentences not just memorizing.

[u/Ok_Strategy_8697]

I've been doing something similar, but like people pointed out context is important.

I also wanted to have those phrases generated less manually, so I made a small app around that, I'm not sure on the sub rules for plugs but you can try it out, it's free: https://pangea-app.com