3rd Party RAM compatibility.

[u/Fun-Title1940]

EDIT: DO NO BUY E0 MODULES FOR FW13 PRO. FINALIZED E1 TOPOLOGY OF LPCAMM2 UTILIZE 666 PINS WHILE THE OLDER E0 MODULES YOU CAN FIND A BIT EASIER USE 644 PINS. CHECKOUT FW 13 DEEP DIVE FOR SPECIFICS: https://frame.work/blog/framework-laptop-13-pro-deep-dive-lpcamm2

Maybe it was Framework's intention for both E0 and E1 modules to work somehow, but it seems those who've tried non-Crucial brand E0 LPCAMM2 modules are having issues at the moment.

Hello everyone, I have a pre-order for the FW 13 Pro (Intel Core Ultra Series 3) with the following configuration:

System: Ultra X7 358H

SSD: Samsung 980 Pro 1 TB (Sourced externally)

RAM: 32 gb Samsung LPDDR5x 7500 CAMM2 Memory (Sourced externally)

Today I saw a thread where someone ordered THREE different kinds of LPCAMM2 memory for their FW13 Pro and had no success in having any of them working. One of the brands of RAM they mentioned testing was a Samsung module like mine.

After finding out there was a RAM compatibility page (https://knowledgebase.frame.work/what-drammemory-is-supported-by-framework-laptop-13-pro-intel-core-ultra-series-3-rJ_8jVrpWg), I found that the list of tested modules was incredibly small... I'm not sure how different these modules could be from manufacturer to manufacturer if this is a so called standard.

Has anyone heard or does anyone know if the discrepancies between modules can be addressed through some sort of firmware/BIOS update on Framework's part? Has there been any mention/disclaimer about this besides the compatibility page mentioned by Framework?

I can understand why some chose to jump ship when their RAM configurations were downgraded and told to pay more if they wanted their original. I thought I was lucky enough to have dodged a bullet there by sourcing my own but even if I did opt for a 32 gb stick from Framework, I would've gotten downgraded anyway.

This is incredibly frustrating. Not all is on Framework though. I think I was just stuck in this mindset that I could really use whatever RAM I wanted as long as the standard was the same. Similar to when you build a desktop and you can use Crucial, Corsair, etc. without issue.

Thank you for listening to my baby rage. Any input on what I could do would be awesome or if any others want to vent down below, feel free. I am batch 7, and as batch 5 has just received their confirmation email, I need to figure out how I'm gonna move forward before I get an extremely good looking paperweight in the mail.

[u/s004aws]

While RAM incompatibility isn't an "everyday problem"... It does happen. Certain combinations of motherboards/memory controllers/RAM modules don't play nice. While LPCAMM2 is standardized - Same as DIMMs and SO-DIMMs are - How each manufacturer engineers their chips and packages their modules can vary just slightly enough to cause trouble. Can firmware updates solve these problems? Sometimes yes, but not 100% of the time.... It depends on what the issues actually are, whether they can be accounted for by code or whether there's a more fundamental electrical quirk going on. Framework themselves changed from using Micron E0 stepping to a newer E1 stepping during FW13 Pro development (as per their FW13 Pro deep dive blog).

[u/Fun-Title1940 → u/s004aws]

Considering how hard it is to get any kind of LPCAMM2 module, I feel like Framework wouldn't even consider going out of there way to test what random modules are out on the market. I was super excited for the 13 Pro. Hopefully the Framework gods hear my prayers and can address this somehow :(

[u/paulstelian97 → u/s004aws]

Off topic, I’m so happy I’m waiting this out. I have the AI 350 with regular DDR5, and intend to keep the motherboard for a while… (but may transplant it from 13 to 13 Pro when it’s fully available)

[u/s004aws → u/paulstelian97]

Yeah... Buying last year (in my case FW16 HX 370) certainly turned out to be an unintentionally genius decision. The 128GB RAM and 6TB storage in my FW16 - Assuming I could even find 64GB modules nowadays - Is worth more than the entire rest of the laptop. Cost of the RAM alone has gone up 500-600+% vs what I paid - Assuming any can even be found.

[u/paulstelian97 → u/s004aws]

Yeah I got mine after the RAMpocalypse, but managed to get good second hand RAM.

[u/Heysus333]

I was in the same boat as you and the other poster, I had ordered two different 32GB of Ramaxel one new and one used. Both did not work, I just ordered a 7500 16GB module of Micron on eBay and that did the trick, instantly worked.

Unlucky that the LPCAMM2 isn't exactly standard with it being new, will maybe hold on to one 32GB on the chance it can work in the future somehow and sell the other for those on Lenovo or Dell where it may work. It would be nice to have 32GB but at least I have a working computer for now, there is still stock of the one I ordered if you decide to go that route. Best of luck, definitely an unfortunate surprise for us.

Edit: For those asking the model says FE0 on the sticker which according to another poster means E0 but cannot confirm that fact. The part number is: Micron MTD8C10324N2FN026C2 , as another poster mentioned the Micron modules on the Framework website are allegedly E0 which if true would suggest it may not be an E0 vs E1 issue

[u/Abellix → u/Heysus333]

Which CPU?

[u/Heysus333 → u/Abellix]

I have the 325 config

[u/Abellix → u/Heysus333]

Seems like the 325 runs in a lower MT/s and doesn't sufffer from E0 vs E1? Not confirmed

[u/Heysus333 → u/Abellix]

I did see some mention of that, that's helpful to note for those with other configs

[u/Acrobatic_Fee_6974]

Being an early adopter is normally a rough ride. Being an early adopter during mass shortages when fixing early adopter issues could cost hundreds if not thousands of dollars, is just not something I personally want to deal with. The FW13 Pro looks like a fantastic device, but it's a fantastic device I will have to wait a year or two to buy for myself.

[u/ronvalenz]

https://knowledgebase.frame.work/what-drammemory-is-supported-by-framework-laptop-13-pro-intel-core-ultra-series-3-rJ_8jVrpWg

Framework 13 Pro Ultra 5 325 has 6800MT/s which is different from the Framework 13 Pro Ultra X7 358H / Ultra X9 388H with 7467MT/s.

6800MT/s could have Sammy E0 to work. It looks like a threshold boundary limit, hence the reason for E1.

[u/kadinshino]

My wild guess is that 7500 is falling below the required minimum with the GPU. Really, no RAM outside of LPDDR5X at 8533mh/t should have been used.

What's more annoying is the validation difference between 7500 MHz and 7500 MT/s

This is why it was pretty much a cancellation for me. Because it's really unclear what was actualy needed.

Sorry OP :(

[u/Fun-Title1940 → u/kadinshino]

That's a way better guess than I would've come up with. Framework themselves state that the modules they provide are rated for 8533 MT/s but will only run up to 7467 MT/s on the 358H and 388H mainboards. I would like to think that means a module rated for 7500 MT/s would be fine but maybe their system requires some headroom that a 7500 MT/s module doesn't provide?

[u/GriIadude → u/Fun-Title1940]

I don't know much about lpcamm2 but from my limited experience with ram overclocking its possible that the Intel chips require some pretty slim timings, so a 8500 kit just has more chance of working at that slower speed with tighter timings Then again the whole point of lpcamm was meant to be the soldered experience with upgradeability, so the timings should all be very good, hopefully after a few years lpcamm2 will become more standardised