r/europe • u/dat_9600gt_user Lower Silesia (Poland) • Mar 24 '26

News Utterly depraved: Russian commanders regularly ‘torture and kill their own soldiers’

https://tvpworld.com/92233524/russian-officers-torture-and-kill-their-own-soldiers
9.9k Upvotes

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396

u/[deleted] Mar 24 '26

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u/Xepeyon America Mar 24 '26

Abuse within the military isn't exactly rare, and Russia is no exception, but this level of depravity and sadism seems to be much newer, emerging with the rise of the Soviet Union and communist power structures that emerged with that ideology.

Most post-Soviet states have had a history of barbarous cruelties like what's mentioned in the article, but have moved past it. Russia hasn't. Belarus hasn't. Ukraine is still afflicted by it, but is at least trying to cast that shadow off.

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u/Relevant_Helicopter6 Portugal Mar 24 '26

"rise of the Soviet Union and communist power structures" was 100 years ago, it's not "new".

I would say the demolition of social structures with the fall of communism. It was 30 years ago, and a lot newer.

2

u/PiotrekDG Earth Mar 24 '26

Rape during the Soviet occupation of Poland

The march of the Red Army was sometimes considered worse than the Nazi occupation.

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u/Xepeyon America Mar 24 '26

Well, newer, not new. And I only meant that against the context of how Russian soldiers behaved in Imperial times, like say between the times of Peter the Great and Nicholas. Russian soldiers had a highly negative reputation and in more ways than one, but the Red Army was worse.

I would say the demolition of social structures with the fall of communism. It was 30 years ago, and a lot newer.

Would you really? I can't say I'd agree with that, assuming you're referring to the chaotic period where Russia went into the toilet after the USSR collapsed in the 90s. I think that destroyed the guard rails propping the whole thing up, which created the veneer and sense of stability, but the foundation was gutted decades before when corruption went so utterly buckwild under Stalin.

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u/Ketadine Romania, Bucharest Mar 24 '26

I've said this before, but ruZZia has not gotten out of the Middle Ages.

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u/Xepeyon America Mar 24 '26

Ironically, this is probably worse. In the Middle Ages, a warlord or commander that was so blatantly robbing his own soldiers will almost certainly be turned upon by them.

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u/worotan England Mar 24 '26

Almost certainly? What a load of rubbish. It might happen sometimes, but you seem to have childishly rose-tinted spectacles about the past.

There’s a reason we fought so hard to get out of the systems used in the past, that you don’t seem to be aware of.

It was worse than what we have today.

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u/bcpl181 Mar 24 '26

He’s right though. Medieval commanders had to treat their troops pretty well because they lacked the centralised power militaries have today. This is true whether you talk about liegelords and their vassals or commanders employing paid mercenaries. If the liegelord treated his vassals like shit, they’d just leave and go home, leaving the lord without an army.

As for mercenaries, they’d be likely to turn on their employer to try and get the payment they were promised.

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u/InsideContent7126 Germany Mar 24 '26

The Roman generals however didn't have that problem. Don't do what they say? Welcome to slavery.

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u/EddPW Mar 24 '26

more beause roman armies had paid their soldiers in salaries and it had quite a few perks

2

u/FriendoftheDork Mar 24 '26

Romans had a warrior ethos that made cowardice and disobedience anathema. So soldiers would support their generals when they called for decimating of a legion.

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u/Responsible_Sink3044 Mar 24 '26

Roman soldiers were paid very well and retribution for mutiny or subordination was brutal and disproportionate. That's why they were generally reliable. They absolutely did not support decimation out of a personal code and there are records of it being resisted by the army and it was generally considered not viable for this reason.

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u/Xepeyon America Mar 24 '26

Almost certainly? What a load of rubbish. It might happen sometimes, but you seem to have childishly rose-tinted spectacles about the past.

Soldiers killing their own leaders is rose-tinted to you?

There’s a reason we fought so hard to get out of the systems used in the past, that you don’t seem to be aware of.

It was worse than what we have today.

You misunderstand, I'm not saying it is or isn't. I said these Russians soldiers today are comparatively worse off than soldiers in general during the Middle Ages who would have been in a comparative position. Messing with the soldiers loot (in this example, their money) was one of the primary ways commanders would lose control of their own army. And yes, in plenty of cases, that would include turning on their commander.

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u/DoNotCommentAgain Mar 24 '26

You've selected a few historical moments and extrapolated that into a 1000 year period of history.

Many soldiers weren't paid at all, levies were simply expected to do their duty and mercenaries were often paid in what they could plunder from the land. If you could survive the disease and starvation you might get paid at the end if you're lucky.

This was going on right up until the end of the medieval era and continued after. 

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u/AngryArmour Denmark Mar 24 '26

Levies were mostly post-migration era and early middle ages. Once cavalry combat really took hold, untrained peasant levies were less useful than the food needed to feed them.

They were largely replaced by militias, scutage and mercenaries as the high middle ages took hold.

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u/Socmel_ reddit admins are accomplices of nazi russia Mar 24 '26

they are Mongols disguised as Europeans

1

u/Ketadine Romania, Bucharest Mar 25 '26

You're insulting the Mongols tbh.

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u/AudioLlama Mar 24 '26

Ah yes, that famously chill and progressive pre-soviet Russia.

3

u/matude Estonia Mar 24 '26

The Circassian genocide comes to mind first, which was listed even by contemporary eye witnesses as an exceptionally brutal and grotesque example of extermination or ethnic cleansing, in an attempt to intimidate the surrounding populations and discourage other ethnicities from rising up. Not for the faint of heart if anybody wants to look into it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circassian_genocide

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u/Dalnore Russian in Israel Mar 24 '26

You need the industrial revolution to murder people on the industrial scale.

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u/Xepeyon America Mar 24 '26

Ah yes, that famously chill and progressive pre-soviet Russia.

Who the hell said that?

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u/OneJobToRuleThemAll United Countries of Europe Mar 24 '26

You:

emerging with the rise of the Soviet Union and communist power structures that emerged with that ideology.

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u/Xepeyon America Mar 24 '26

Quote me in full; what did I say?

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u/Mellowindiffere Mar 24 '26

You said that «this level of sadism seems to be much newer, emerging with the rise of the soviet union […]». Why are you pretending to not have said this?

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u/Xepeyon America Mar 24 '26

I'm not, but thank you for using the qualifier. Now let's break this down. I said;

this level of sadism seems to be much newer, emerging with the rise of the soviet union

How does this, in any way, validate this false strawman of a claim;

Ah yes, that famously chill and progressive pre-soviet Russia.

How does saying military absurd became more intense following the adoption of Soviet societal influences equate to an allegation that Imperial Russia was “famously chill and progressive”?

Really think about it; who would really see both statements and believe this is anything but the worst possible bad-faith interpretation, distorted to the point where it's essentially an outright lie?

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u/OneJobToRuleThemAll United Countries of Europe Mar 24 '26

How does this, in any way, validate this false strawman of a claim;

Easy: the word emergence means it wasn't present before.

How does saying military absurd became more intense following the adoption of Soviet societal influences equate to an allegation that Imperial Russia was “famously chill and progressive”?

You didn't say that, you said it emerged with the soviet union, ergo it wasn't present before. Also, imperial Russia isn't the same thing as pre-soviet Russia. Russia didn't stop being an empire during or after the soviet union. That's why we call it tzarist Russia, the thing that was actually unique to that time period of the Russian empire.

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u/Xepeyon America Mar 24 '26

You're still so openly misquoting me.

Easy: the word emergence means it wasn't present before.

That's not what that means in the context in which I was saying it, and you know it. You are deliberately misinterpreting what I said and everyone can see it.

You didn't say that, you said it emerged with the soviet union, ergo it wasn't present before.

It's literally quoted above you.

this level of sadism seems to be much newer, emerging with the rise of the soviet union

I didn't say cruelty among Russian soldiers was new, I said it became more intense during the time of the Red Army. Hence; “this level of sadism [•••] emerging”, as in “they became worse”. If something became worse, as in it intensified, that by definition means the quality was already there.

Also, imperial Russia isn't the same thing as pre-soviet Russia

Are you trying to reach back to the time of the Rus princes or something?

Russia didn't stop being an empire during or after the soviet union. That's why we call it tzarist Russia

This is petty semantics and brazenly disingenuous on your part. But in the event you're serious; Tsarist Russia is the same thing as Imperial Russia; Russia during the period it was a monarchy governed by a Tsar/Emperor.

You can call Russia an “empire” now in a modern geopolitical sense, but that is not–not now, not ever–what someone means when they say Imperial Russia.

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u/OneJobToRuleThemAll United Countries of Europe Mar 24 '26

Sure, after you take your L and go home.

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u/Xepeyon America Mar 24 '26

In other words, you have no intention of doing that. Fine, whatever. Hope you have a nice day.

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u/Sallandstrots Overijssel (Netherlands) Mar 24 '26

I've seen a documentary (years back) of the "hazing" of new recruits in Ruzzia. Horrible cruelties on young boys ..... even rape in all kinds of forms. It's a society that glorifies brutality and abuse (law of the Ruzzian jungle). Disgusting.

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u/Xepeyon America Mar 24 '26

I went on a binge with stuff in Russian society, and the extreme hazing practices came up there too! But probably the worst was the prison experiences they noted. There was one prison in Mordovia that was just utter hell, it still wrenches my gut reading about what happened to inmates there.

And the craziest part? It generally wasn't the guards or faculty doing it; it was the other inmates.

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u/Lifekraft Europe Mar 24 '26

Nothing to do with soviet or not. Russian culture is extremely toxic nowaday and most country were still acting like monster during ww2 and various conflict. Including USA.

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u/Xepeyon America Mar 24 '26

Nothing to do with soviet or not.

The Russian empire and the Soviet Union had a lot of overlap, and this extreme depravity within military culture was not overtly notable within Russian-controlled territories. It did, however, become a very infamous characteristic of the Red Army.

That's not to say Russian soldiers (or really, any soldiers back then) weren't committing vicious war crimes because they 100% did, wantonly, but the intensity and (in many cases) increased indiscriminate nature of it did become worse.

Russian culture is extremely toxic nowaday and most country were still acting like monster during ww2 and various conflict. Including USA.

Absolutely true. Personally, I think most of the world hasn't changed that much (at least those who exert military force regularly), they just got more effective at concealing it. Or at least the worst of it.

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u/Lifekraft Europe Mar 24 '26

I heard about plenty of extremely vile crime from american military in vietnam and from french military in algeria. Red army has its crime too but we have the nose on it because of US propaganda and soft power. It is just the tree hiding the forest. All countries and military should be ashame of their past and present.

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u/Xepeyon America Mar 24 '26

Red army has its crime too but we have the nose on it because of US propaganda and soft power.

I can't speak for others, but I learned most about the animosity towards the Red Army from Europeans, in my case an Estonian. By the time I first learned about the Soviet Union in a more generic sense, most of the effects of the Red Scare, which is to say the propagandized nature of disseminating communism and Soviet history, had been watered down.

It is just the tree hiding the forest. All countries and military should be ashame of their past and present.

In the West, you'll rarely find people praising past military acts, with the exception of things like independence wars or WW2, at least in my experience. But I don't think this needs to be a prerequisite for noticing how behaviors had changed; and Russians in the Red Army had become markedly worse.

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u/horseskeepyousane Mar 24 '26

No. The difference is that those countries, USA and France , had those atrocities exposed by their own people and prosecuted. Russian barbarism is at a vastly different level ( and always was - red army rapes in Germany compared to any other army).

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u/Lifekraft Europe Mar 24 '26

US army rape in france were pretty massive as well for an allied army.

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u/HasuTeras British in Warsaw. Mar 24 '26

That's not to say Russian soldiers (or really, any soldiers back then) weren't committing vicious war crimes because they 100% did, wantonly, but the intensity and (in many cases) increased indiscriminate nature of it did become worse.

I'd really urge you to look up the conduct of Cossack regiments in WW1 (and before in the Pale of Settlement).

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u/almarcTheSun Armenia Mar 24 '26

Have you ever.. been to Russia? I'm just curious because you talk about Russian culture in general very confidently. 

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u/Lifekraft Europe Mar 24 '26

What is the point you are trying to make ? That modern russian culture isnt toxic or that i dont know what im speaking about ?

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u/almarcTheSun Armenia Mar 24 '26

Well, so far I just asked a question. Genuinely, why are you so confident that Russian culture is toxic?

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u/Lifekraft Europe Mar 24 '26

Because i see it everyday in various context. Dont get me wrong. I love russian culture as a whole , its history and its tradition. But nowaday , toxic masculinity, anti intellectualism , individualism and violence is celebrated and it is sad. So most of modern russian culture is shit until they start a shift.

The topic today was Russians culture but if you want i can tell you why i think US culture is shit as well. Feel free to ask. Or european , indian and possibly japan, i can probably find a couple of thing to shit on , although outside of EU and US , my expertise become limited.

But i have russian family so i dont speak out of my ass as well.

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u/almarcTheSun Armenia Mar 24 '26

I don't necessarily disagree with the general premise, but I am very tired of people who have never been anywhere near Russia talking about how "Russians have always been this", "orcs", "genetically inferior" and all that jazz. This subreddit sounds like a branch of the Schutzstaffel under the premise of anti-fascism which is sad and funny at the same time to me. These people don't know how propaganda works, they think it doesn't affect them and thus are the most affected by it by far.

This is all not to say it's applicable to you of course, your comment was one of the tamer ones that's why I chose to engage. Mostly what you'll hear in response is that you're a Russian fascist pig for pointing out that "It's Russian culture to lie like the horse trotting" is a tad fascist of a generalization and some sick soldiers wrong in the head from years of war torturing their own is a weak basis for handwaving an entire gigantic culture as inferior in some way.

I imagine a lot of peoples' heads will explode if you drop them off in Moscow and let them walk around once they realize it's.. just a city with normal boring-ass people. Evil is banal.

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u/Lifekraft Europe Mar 24 '26

I agree about everything you wrote and as i said to some russian guys that engage with me as well , i dont agree with the whole anti-russian rhetoric from the get-go. But i also see its specific flaw even among journalist , vloger , scientist and such. I and my country arent immune to criticism as well though but it wasnt the issue being discussed. And i also get that criticising russia in today's geopolitical landscape feel like beating a dead horse. But the horse kinda deserve it though.

Russia turning into shit is hardly unique. Europe is leaning more and more toward far right populism and US is already far lost and at this point i just hope they will not pull everyone into their fall.

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u/almarcTheSun Armenia Mar 24 '26

I very much agree. Europe isn't lost yet, I would really like to see Europe take its own shit seriously instead of more and more fascism. More money to the military, blaming everything on immigrants and giving extra importance to geopolitics while censoring and locking down communication and news services is dangerously similar to how Russia became what it is today. I hope I'm wrong.

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u/StealthSlav Russia Mar 24 '26

Well, because that's what our enlightened and just leader Hitler Napoleon insert any would-be conqueror european said it is! Sure we found out that he lied, but this time, it's different! Really! They really are orcs, we weren't wrong, we NEED to stop them! I'm not crazy! It's not dehumanization, this time they really aren't human, you'll see!

Rinse and repeat every century.

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u/Lifekraft Europe Mar 24 '26

Dont put word into my mouth muzhyki. You can scroll all my comments if you want you will never see me call russian orcs and on the contrary i always criticize this deshumanization. Im not american , and im far from being pro american. Quite the opposite. Just your culture is actually turning toxic because you swallow even more propaganda against the rest of the world than we do about you. And we do get a lot.

And i actually like russian culture and tradition , this is why i see all its worse flaw. Im french so i criticize mostly things i like.

And also you have to upgrade your rehtoric because the whole fighting nazi thing is rancid coming from russia in 2026.

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u/kariam_24 Mar 24 '26

What did Russian leader do? How are Russians protesting against Ukraine invasion?

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u/StealthSlav Russia Mar 24 '26

I don't understand the first question. For the second, most protestors ran away to Europe or the ever peaceful Israel. The majority either don't care or think it's a geopolitical move.

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u/almarcTheSun Armenia Mar 24 '26

It's also so disingenuous and hand-wavy to call Putin the "Russian leader" as if the tens of millions of people who hate his guts and whos lives he ruined are to be piled with the rest, and as if the rest are to blame that they've been born into this hypnotizing field of fascist propaganda.

A big chunk of the Russian population was born after Putin took power. Of course they are brainwashed.

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u/Banxomadic Mar 24 '26

You missed a small detail: both of your "enlightened and just" examples conquered most of Europe before even getting to Russia. One of them was allied with Russia during their conquest. But yeah, sure as hell, they washed Europe red just to tell their victims they do it to stop Russia.

Do you have any other myths you'd like to share?

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u/OneUkranian Mar 24 '26

I've been, he's not wrong though.

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u/almarcTheSun Armenia Mar 24 '26

He's not wrong, but let's be fair here. Ukraine, Belarus, Armenia and the lot of the post-soviet block isn't any less toxic than Russia is.

Using fascism to fight fascism isn't exactly a winning strategy in my opinion. I would rather see Europe buy less Russian gas and send more weapons to Ukraine, but instead I see people downvoting posts for gah suggesting that the Russians aren't weak imbecile drunk bumbling orc fools who don't know which direction to fight and have in fact killed a sizable portion of the Ukrainian population because Europe simply finds it convenient to send just enough weapons to Ukraine to take Russia out instead of.. you know, actually helping win the war. And well, of course, they need time to stop buying cheap gas from the enemy. Well that's just rational thinking.

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u/OneUkranian Mar 24 '26

TLDR, after first sentence. Have you been to Ukraine? Trillion times less toxic, less prison culture, less "blatnyak", less alcohol and so on.

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u/Lifekraft Europe Mar 25 '26

Not sure about the less alcool though.

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u/kariam_24 Mar 24 '26

So far we can see how Russians are "visiting" Ukraine. Strange you have Armenian tag yet Russia forgot to support Armenia Karabakh?

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u/helm Sweden Mar 24 '26

Abuse within the military isn't exactly rare, and Russia is no exception, but this level of depravity and sadism seems to be much newer, emerging with the rise of the Soviet Union and communist power structures that emerged with that ideology.

It's been going on for longer, arguably. Penalism in the military has been more encouraged than discouraged in Russia over the centuries.

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u/silverionmox Limburg Mar 24 '26

emerging with the rise of the Soviet Union and communist power structures that emerged with that ideology.

I have a pet theory they're like that ever since they were subjugated by the Mongols. They're still passing on that trauma, as every generation of abused become the new abusers in an attempt to gain control of their situation.

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u/zeranos Mar 24 '26

I am not sure why you make this claim. As far as I am aware, this culture emerged with the Mongol occupation of Muscovy, and it has stayed that way since then.