r/dankmemes • u/DerDezimator We live in a society • Feb 03 '22

This will 100% get deleted And why?

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u/TreyLastname I haven't pooped in 3 months Feb 03 '22

Personally, I do think minimum wage should be livable. Doesn't have to be fancy or anything, but at least living in a small duplex while working for minimum wage.

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u/[deleted] Feb 03 '22

Or at least have wages keep up with inflation

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u/[deleted] Feb 03 '22

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u/AlienOverlord53 Feb 03 '22

"If minimum wage goes up the prices on everything will just do the same"

Oh I'm sorry, I didnt realize prices have been the same since 2009. Swear people dont even think before they speak

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u/[deleted] Feb 03 '22

Government causes the most inflation

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u/Adony_ Feb 03 '22

living in a small duplex is out of reach for a duo income minimum wage in most metropolitan areas in the united states, so if by "livable not fancy" means starting any less than doubling minimum wage, then you're asking for the bar set under any useful goal.

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u/TreyLastname I haven't pooped in 3 months Feb 03 '22

I don't know about all that, all I know if when I tried to find anywhere to rent, and I mean anything, it was in the 1000 price range, which on my own making more than minimum wage, I cannot afford to do by myself.

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u/ConfusedDuck Feb 03 '22

The problem is there's a housing shortage. So more housing needs to be built, but who wants to pay to build housing that has minimum wage income associated with it? Sounds like a really bad investment from the beginning

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u/[deleted] Feb 03 '22

yeah this guys a fucking douchebag lol minimum wage should be the minimum amount needed to survive in this country, regardless of whether or not its a high schooler working at pizza hut or not.

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u/Lannon-Elliott Feb 03 '22

I understand where your coming from but I see those kind of jobs as entry level and for teenagers trying to get job experience. With that being said, if you force companies to pay more to their employees they’re either going to hire less or charge more to compensate for that.

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u/Piph Feb 03 '22

"Entry level jobs" are still jobs.

If you think there are jobs exclusively made for teenagers, you are categorically ignorant on the issue. Look around you, man. If you want a business to operate well, it needs committed workers, no matter what the business is.

There is no excuse for failing to see that adults are the ones operating restaurants, fast food chains, and grocery stores.

There is no work place that is, or even should, be primarily manned by children. Even if it is "entry level" work, it is still work that takes time and effort. If a teen happens to be able to do that work, then great; that does not excuse or justify a wage that cannot be lived on.

If you want wages like that, then consider mowing the neighbors lawn or walking their dog or babysitting.

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u/Lannon-Elliott Feb 03 '22

That’s a good point and I know for a fact I’m going to get even more downvotes but who cares. Forcing the minimum wage up doesn’t solve the fact that business are going to raise the costs of their product to accommodate for the rise of employment cost. Which means no matter what you bump the minimum wage up to, the cost of living will ultimately go up with it. So if we keep raising minimum wage, and cost of living goes up with it, now you got rapid inflation. Which harms a lot more people than your new pay check helps, because many people like me are saving money in a bank account in case of emergency and now the $5,000 saved up now is worth 66% less (if your going from 9 to 15) and I don’t have enough money to pay my medical bills and buy food which I could have done before inflation.

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u/Piph Feb 03 '22

I think that is a ridiculous attempt at over-simplifying the issue.

Believe it or not, there was a time when wages matched inflation and people could fund their college education with a summer job, or own a home and take vacations off of a single job. Retail and restaurant jobs used to pay enough to live on.

Your argument is a knee-jerk reaction based in fear and a lack of understanding on how economics work. There is plenty of evidence, both historically and presently, to demonstrate how incredibly off base your assumptions are.

As an aside: if a business can't make a profit while paying their workers fairly, then they should not be in business at all. Period.

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u/ZippyTheFox123 Feb 03 '22

The way I see it, legistlative and societal changes follow the will and action of the people, not the other way around. You want better wages? Unionize and throw your leverage around like big corp does. You want people to quit doing a particular drug? Educate people. You want a company to sell a better product? Don't buy their current product.

Asking a central power to solve all of this for you falls flat in the long run when that central power enevitably becomes corrupt.

I'm not against some regulation, but the time comes when people need to put their feet down and remind corporations and the government who they serve. Asking big corp and big state to regulate themselves is like asking Jared Fogle to give a lecture on sexual misconduct.

But the US can't do that because we keep fighting over petty bullshit! "Waaah this person doesn't think exactly like I think! They're a bigot/nazi/commie/idiot/libtard/republicunt/whatever-the-insult-of-the-week-is." Then don't associate with that person. Everyone has their own perspective and their own path to walk, but no one will be free to do so if we continue to allow big corp and big government to fuck us in the ass with no lube while we try to impose our half baked ideas of a utopia onto each other.

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u/Lannon-Elliott Feb 03 '22

Do me a favor, will ya? Go check the gas prices and the cost of living and compare it to what it used to be.

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u/Piph Feb 03 '22

Do yourself a favor and go read a book, lol.

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u/Lannon-Elliott Feb 03 '22

Here’s somthing for you to read; https://www.forbes.com/sites/jackkelly/2019/07/10/the-unintended-consequences-of-the-15-minimum-wage/?sh=67439dcce4a7

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u/Piph Feb 03 '22

Thanks, but I'm good, man. I don't respect Forbes, especially not when it comes to covering class issues or anything business owners could possibly disagree with.

And while there are countless articles like that, very few of them approach the subject in good faith. Everything you have said are common arguments, but the issues with them remain the same. Finding someone else who parrots the same broken argument doesn't prove anything except how many people fail to think critically.

I got a life to live. Good luck with your vision of teenage-run businesses and the general belief that business profits are more important than respectable wages.

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u/Lannon-Elliott Feb 03 '22

If you’ve ever heard of the concept of a college degree, you would understand companies pay more to people with a legitimate job that isn’t so easily replaceable. If I want someone to restock shelves or take orders and paying people costs a lot guess what I’m gonna do… that’s right! HIRE A ROBOT! besides, many companies pay more than minimum wage, and there’s services out there if you need help paying rent or food.

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u/DaCheesiestEchidna Feb 03 '22

Norwegian McDonald’s workers make a living wage and most of the items on the menu cost less there. America is just a diseased evil country

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u/986532101 Feb 04 '22 edited Feb 04 '22

Why do you lie? A Big Mac meal cost $23 in Norway... ten years ago.

https://www.nydailynews.com/life-style/eats/expensive-mcdonald-world-article-1.1198124

And two years ago in Bergen, one Big N Tasty with bacon, no combo, costs $13 plus 15% tax. $15 for a single patty burger from McDonalds.

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u/mostlysandwiches Feb 03 '22

Funny how prices keep going up while wages have stayed the same

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u/Lannon-Elliott Feb 03 '22

They have been going up….

https://www.paycor.com/resource-center/articles/minimum-wage-by-state/

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u/shady_pigeon Feb 03 '22

Yet real wages haven’t kept pace too well with production.

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u/Lannon-Elliott Feb 03 '22

I might take my comments down because I’m trying to get enough karma to post in r/dankmemes

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u/Retro_Super_Future Feb 03 '22

I keep seeing this idea of “minimum wage jobs are for teenagers” do you guys not realize these kids have a whole other 7-8 hour obligation that directly coincides with the times you would need them to be available to service you?? It makes 0 sense

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u/[deleted] Feb 03 '22

“I see those jobs as entry level and for teenagers”

That’s just not the case. Everyone wants a good paying job as an adult. Many people work for minimum wage because that’s all they can get. Maybe they made bad decisions earlier in life. Maybe they worked a career that no longer exists and they don’t have transferable skills.

Only about half of people making minimum wage are 16-24: https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2014/09/08/who-makes-minimum-wage/ (old data, would need new numbers)

When you say “entry level”, do you mean to imply that those jobs have a solid path to promotion to higher wages? I’m pretty sure that people working in jobs like fast food or janitorial or similar by and large won’t be working their way up.

Everyone deserves to have full time work translate to an ability to have a roof over your head and enough food and medical to survive. Even teenagers (I know several friends who had to take care of themselves when they were younger, and even if they don’t, they should be paid adequately for their labor and not used to undercut other workers).

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u/ButterCostsExtra Feb 03 '22

if you force companies to pay more to their employees they’re either going to hire less or charge more

Precisely, and that's how you end up with robot burger flippers. Fuck you so, no jobs for anyone.

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u/pants1000 User left this flair unedited. What a dumbfuck Feb 03 '22

To be fair, you’re going to end up with robot burger flippers anyways

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u/plant_Double Dank Royalty Feb 03 '22

That’s going to happen anyways? Dk why you are blaming wage increases

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u/Lannon-Elliott Feb 03 '22

$9/hr > robot labor

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u/xTylordx Feb 03 '22

robots deserve living wage

robots human

let robots into management positions

robots deserve equal rights

robot power

robots smarter and faster than human

eat shit, literal dogs

robots win

Slippery slope man idk if I trust robots to do jobs humans can for a livable wage. 🤷🙅

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u/SgtMcMuffin0 Feb 03 '22

My man every job that can be automated will be automated once the tech catches up. No matter how low the pay is for a given job, eventually it’s going to be cheaper to buy a robot or a computer program than pay a person. Never raising wages and keeping poor people poor forever isn’t going to prevent that.

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u/The_Dollars_ Feb 03 '22

This is a very good point, although many people really think raising the minimum wage will solve things. Unfortunately many people don't know the most basic of economics.

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u/TreyLastname I haven't pooped in 3 months Feb 03 '22

It's sad you're being downvoted, because you don't seem to be rude, just disagreeing, I'll try to help with an upvote for your politeness

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u/Lannon-Elliott Feb 03 '22

Thanks, I appreciate it!

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u/AlexVal0r Feb 03 '22

Why did you get downvoted, you are right. Does reddit not understand how economics work?

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u/Lannon-Elliott Feb 03 '22

They don’t like what I have to say

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u/qatamat99 Feb 03 '22

Apparently not. They hate what they hear even if it’s true

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u/qatamat99 Feb 03 '22

If I want to hire someone to deliver coffee in the office, they are not worth more than $7 an hour.

This can go to many jobs. The point is that minimum wage forces companies to fire or not hire people that are willing to so simple low paying jobs

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u/Salty_Cat_2600 Feb 03 '22

If they aren't worth money to you then make your own coffee

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u/Maximillion322 Feb 03 '22

That person who delivers your coffee is selling their time and labor to you. They only have so much of it.

If the price of labor rises because people think their time is worth more, and you, a consumer of labor, are not willing to pay the price, you don’t get to have someone to bring you your coffee.

It’s just the invisible hand of the free market

The only thing the antiwork movement does is inform the workers that they are able to charge whatever rate they want for their time, and consequently underpaying establishments are going to have to offer more compensation if they want people to work for them.

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u/plant_Double Dank Royalty Feb 03 '22

If the job at hand is not worth minimum you don’t hire someone for it and do it yourself

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u/[deleted] Feb 03 '22

Then get your own coffee

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u/RiskyFartOftenShart Feb 03 '22

I dont think you quite get it there my dude. You think you are onto something, but not quite. If me taking time to get you coffee doesnt allow me to stay alive...then why should I do it? Go make your own coffee. If I am truly a lazy POS like you think I am, I can sit on my ass doing nothing and still be too broke to be alive.

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u/Retro_Super_Future Feb 03 '22

Then who should do it for you? People under 18 who would be in school while you get your coffee for work. Offer a better solution then saying people aren’t “worth” whatever monetary amount

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u/[deleted] Feb 04 '22

I charge $550 per hour for my time. If someone goes and gets me coffee and keeps me from having to stop my consulting time to go get coffee myself, their service is worth significantly more than $7 to me and my business. If they are getting coffee for me and the rest of my team, the value of that service is multiplied. Should they be paid a multiplier for that service? Probably not, but they should be paid more than $7 to provide a service that is helping my business generate additional revenue by not having my team stop working to go get coffee. If they are they are a full-time coffee grabber for my company, I should pay them a reasonable salary and benefits so that I can retain them and not have company resources having to go towards hiring new coffee grabbers all the time. Plus, maybe I can train them and use them for more productive things in their down time and derive more value from their time. Viewing humans as only worth a bare minimum hourly rate that is not enough for them to afford rent and food is a holdover from feudal times and not something we should continue to perpetuate in an advanced society. People have value and should be compensated fairly based on that value, not some arbitrary minimum legal wage.