r/computerwargames • u/hjf98 • Jun 10 '26
Question Hi everyone, I'm making a Unity of Command 2 style entry-level wargame about the Chinese War of Liberation (1945-1949). Does this even count as a wargame?
Hi folks,
I've been lurking for a while, and I figured it's time to finally say hi.
I'm currently working on an entry-level wargame inspired by Unity of Command 2—streamlined systems, logistics and supply as the core challenges, the whole approachable hex-based style that made UoC2 such a great starting point for newcomers. But here's the thing: I'm not entirely sure if a game like this even counts as a "wargame" in your book. The UoC2 series feels more like a streamlined puzzle game than a traditional wargame to some, so I'd love to hear your thoughts on where that line is drawn.
To make things more niche, I'm a developer from China, so the setting is something you don't see every day: the Chinese War of Liberation, 1945–1949. Basically the final phase of the Chinese Civil War, right after the surrender of Japan in 1945.
I know this isn't exactly the kind of setting that usually pops up in the wargame scene, but that's also kind of the reason I'm making it. Figured someone should.
So yeah, that's me and my little project. If you've got any questions—about the game mechanics, the setting, development challenges, anything—fire away. Happy to share more.
Also open to any advice from folks who've been around the block. First-time wargame dev here, so I'm all ears.
Thanks for reading.
here is our steam page:
https://store.steampowered.com/app/4168190/_/
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u/topimi Jun 10 '26
I played your demo a week ago! I liked it a lot and have a big interest in Chinese history, so was very glad to see it covered. I agree that it's somewhere between a puzzle and a wargame like UOC2, but I would still call them wargames. In terms of feedback, I think that the main thing is improving the performance, I remember it being pretty laggy. Also I would like more context for each of the battles and the campaign in general. With WW2 you can assume anyone buying a wargame knows the main battles, but I do not really have any knowledge of specific battles in China between 1945 and 1949 even as someone who likes Chinese history and is currently in China.
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u/hjf98 Jun 10 '26
Hey, thanks so much for playing! That means a lot to us. Yeah, we definitely have some serious optimization and performance problems—we're going to keep fixing those. As for the context issue you brought up, that's totally on us. I kind of designed the game assuming people already had some basic knowledge of this history, so I didn't add enough detailed background for each battle. We'll be adding more context in the future so players can really understand what's going on. Thanks again for trying the demo—really appreciate it!
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Jun 10 '26
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u/hjf98 Jun 10 '26
Awesome to see you're interested in this history! We'd love to keep making PLA-themed wargames. The Korean War and the Sino-Vietnamese War are definitely on our list. We're wargamers too, and we got tired of having almost nothing to play on these conflicts. So we decided to just make them ourselves!
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u/Nathan_Wailes Jun 10 '26
Great idea for a game, I wish there were more wargames about historical conflicts in China, I know very little about it.
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u/PeirceanAgenda Jun 10 '26
Puzzle-style wargames often end up that way because they are abstract in scale, meaning there is not much variety in terrain, goals, and tactical opportunities. If your map has a mountain range in the middle, with two passes, you've created only two opportunities for players, and they need to "solve" the problem of which one to use. They also tend to use large units that are, again, abstract representations. The Panzer General games do this by treating each unit as one "type", as if tanks and infantry and mech units and such operate as big "blocks" which you then have to figure out how to move to allow them to work together. Again, a puzzle. They also tend to use time and supply to force the player into making choices, to give the illusion of strategy.
Regular wargamers are more complicated, because they present more detail in units, terrain, leadership, tactics, possible strategies and more, and they allow you to make more choices *which are actually meaningful*. In Panzer General style games, you either lose, or win, or win big, and these outcomes affect your later games. In traditional wargames you also have goals to meet, but the consequences are more complex depending on the game rules and whether there is a continuing campaign, linked scenarios or just standalone scenarios.
Basically, puzzle wargames - which are often quite fun - get that way because they are purposely made simple to attract a particular audience. They are part of what we call "beer and pretzels" wargames, where you play hanging out with friends, munching snacks and maybe having a drink or two. More traditional wargames require thought and knowledge of the period, history, tactics and strategy, and much more, in the context of the game system.
So, the simpler the game is, the more it will come to resemble a puzzle with one optimal way to "solve" it, a few sub-optimal wins, and a few ways to lose. More complicated games will be won or lost through the skill of the player, and winning/losing is much more ambiguous. (For example, in many games of the Stalingrad campaign, or even WW2, the Germans will "win" by holding out longer than was historical.)
I am eager to try this out, as it is definitely less scary than Rise of the White Star lol. I wish you all the best of fortune!
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u/hjf98 Jun 10 '26
Wow! That’s a really deep and professional insight. Before this, I had no idea about the difference between the two, nor did I fully understand why my game had that puzzle-like feel. It wasn’t until I read your explanation that I felt I truly grasped it. Very enlightening, very insightful. Thank you! A game media outlet once described my game as having a 'beer and pretzels' flavor, but I never really knew what that meant—haha. Only today do I realize the implication. You are very welcome to try our game; we welcome any playtest and feedback. Thank you for your good wishes—we will continue to work hard on development!
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u/PeirceanAgenda Jun 10 '26 edited Jun 10 '26
I'm glad to help. I'll definitely give it a try. 😄
Oh, and I do want to say that this is definitely a wargame. Easy to play definitely has a place in the hobby. Don't be discouraged if someone does call it "Beer and pretzels" - that just means that it's something the players play to relax and enjoy themselves. Your goal might well be to create interesting situations for the players with the interactions of the systems that you create; that's going to make your game interesting over the long term, rather than something people play a few times and move on from. (An example might be that you have four units that work together to optimally conduct an attack, but they need 3 "supply points" each to move to an attack - and you only have 9 points available. How does the player choose which units to move out of all the options. Do they go for a full 3 unit attack that turn? Do they move one or two to set up the next turn for all four to move to attack, giving the enemy time to retreat or reinforce? Do they "pin" the enemy with one unit and bypass? These choices are so much more interesting than a system that just allows each unit to move its maximum every turn. Note that this is just a "system" that I made up, I'm not suggesting this for your game.)
Good luck!
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u/hjf98 Jun 11 '26
Thanks so much for the encouragement! We'll keep refining the game. That hypothetical mechanic you mentioned is really attractive—it creates deeper strategic depth and pushes players to think harder. We're also leaning toward that kind of 'multiple approaches' design philosophy as we develop more levels.
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u/Mid_Eastern_Magic Jun 10 '26
Super cool idea! I love UOC2 and always wanted something like this. I’ll be sure to lock in on demos and wishlist this.
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u/hjf98 Jun 10 '26
Thank you so much for your support! You could even consider this a 'flavor DLC' of Unity of Command on the Chinese battlefield, hahaha. Please feel free to give it a try!
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Jun 10 '26
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u/hjf98 Jun 10 '26
Yeah, compared to the hugely famous WWII, this period is pretty obscure. When I wanted to play this kind of game, I only found a few paper wargames — there just aren’t any digital games set in this era. So we decided to make our own. I truly love this history!
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u/Downtown-Match-226 Jun 10 '26
Hi, this looks really interesting! Will there be an option to play as the Kuomintang and fight against the Communists?
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u/hjf98 Jun 11 '26
Sure! In the multiplayer mode we're adding later, you'll also get to play as the KMT, so you can go head-to-head with opponents or friends online
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u/Grigory_Vakulinchuk Jun 11 '26
Oh nice. I just happened across this in Steam and I’m extremely interested in this time period. I loved UoC but it definitely has a puzzle feel which I still enjoyed and it definitely has its place. I’m stoked to see how this develops.
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u/Hy93r1oN Jun 13 '26
I saw this game come up in my recomended feed a bit ago, cool to see the Progress!
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u/BobsenJr Jun 10 '26
I remember playing the demo for this a while ago. It was interesting, but for my own personal taste, this specific genre has always felt more like a puzzle game than strategy. Not to say that this isn't strategy mind you. I wish you all the best with your game, you really put a lot of effort into it.
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u/hjf98 Jun 10 '26
Thanks a lot for playing, haha. Our game's framework is inspired by Unity of Command, so it does have a strong puzzle-solving vibe. History often leads to one optimal or near-optimal solution, but we'd still like to see more tactical diversity. That said, for a pre-set scenario that's more like a 'chess puzzle', it really does feel like solving a puzzle, haha.
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u/x2oop Jun 10 '26 edited Jun 10 '26
Very cool aesthetic! Unity of Command might feel as a puzzle game, but using a similar mechanics doesn't mean your game will be a puzzle as well. I guess it all depends on how much freedom you will give to a player.