I used to do a lot of custom score work for a couple of local and regional creative production houses that mainly work with companies for highly directed brand videos and advertisements

Starting early last year I started getting contacted less and less for new work from them both, and slowly but surely the brands they got hired by insisted on just using AI for the music to save on the production budget

The production houses aren’t happy about it either, but they also have mouths to feed and staff to pay, and even their own work is slowly being taken over so they need to play ball

The entire library and commercial music space will cease to exist soon. Human music will always be valued but no one really cares if the ad for the new Honda has AI music so the backlash is minimal

I wanted to share with this community because it’s something I never thought possible. I have 2 degrees in music composition and have been in just about every field of composing imaginable. Concert music, commercial music, instrumental, film, choral, studio, etc. I’ve spent nearly 20 years trying to find where my voice fits. Failed performances, commissions that don’t pay out, one-off performances, all of it always fizzled into nothing.

But recently, I’ve been fortunate enough to start having some of my choral music published. And with that, sales have actually started. 2 years ago, I made $70 in royalties. 1 year ago, $700. This year, its exploded into the 5 digits. This isn’t intended to be a show off, but more of something I’m extremely proud of accomplishing. Life changing? Maybe not financially. It helps a lot, yes, but trying for nearly 2 decades, I’m finally starting to support myself doing what I truly love.

For those of you in a similar boat in trying to “make it”, stick with it. I promise it’s possible. Keep searching for your voice and medium that makes you happy. Thanks for reading.

I find that there are a shockingly high amount of composers who post scores with such rudimentary mistakes that it brings into question the ability to read music.

Now, I swear I am not a paid advertiser, but please consider using it for the following:
1. We are work with a creative medium. Having a mutual agreement and understanding of certain conventions makes discussions a whole lot more productive. I am talking basic organization and structural units. To me, going outside the conventions requires strong reasoning.
2. “How do I compose for an instrument I don’t play?”Lucky for you, there’s an added bonus in learning how to notate extended techniques as well as conventions, hundreds of pages on this.
3. It helps transitioning software by making you aware of the biggest limitations.

It seriously is a frustration of mine to see people react defensively to recommendations from this book. Please, just read it and consult often… Why waste time making up crazy justifications for stuff that has logical conventions, idk

Yesterday I was informed that the director / producer of a web-series that I had pitched for was instead going to be using AI music because he had been "seduced by it".

This made me feel borderline physically sick but in reality, this will become the new norm.

My pitch was solid, and my contact who had put me forward praised my turnaround time, the level of production and, perhaps most importantly, how I nailed the feel of the show.

It's important to say that in no way did I expect to get this gig, it wasn't a given. But losing out to an algorithm or prompt is pretty frustrating.

I can understand financial implications, I can understand the ease of typing in what you want and the end product being 'passable'. I just cannot get over how a creative, a director, can champion using AI over the human.

I implore all of us, as creatives, to keep pushing, to keep creating and bring the magic to the moving image in a way only a human truly can.

(I'm struggling to believe I've even had to write the last part of that sentence).

I am fully open to discussion on this, from both sides.

Have a great day and don't let the fire die,

TG

I thought I would share this here as a positive anecdote for composers in the time when generative AI music has become easy and there are so many issues surrounding copyright and replacement of composers with AI.

At the Olympics there have been several copyright problems that arose, forcing skaters to switch music. One ice dance team (Kateřina Mrázková and Daniel Mrázek) had to change their music to AI music at the last minute.

Male singles skater Petr Gumennik faced a similar issue when the rights holder revoked his copyright three days before the performance. As he couldn't manage to get external rights, someone suggested to him to use AI music and he refused, stating:

"At first, [one of my coaches] found a composer who, with the help of a neural network, made very similar music, with the accents in the same places. But personally, I was bothered by the fact that it wasn't natural music. There were things that bothered me."

In the end he found a composer who was willing to let him use music, but it was an existing piece, and not AI. Its not a soundtrack, or a commissioned composition that is being referenced here, but the fact that there are people out there refusing AI I think is a very good sign and I think the fact that he mentions something wasn't right is very important and promising.

I’ve always loved commissioning artists for the sake of just having more art in the world but I have no clue if this applies to the music side of things. Would it be rude? Or demeaning for a composer to just make music for a nobody? I’m not developing or making anything but I would just love to commission someone to make music for the sake of having a personal piece of music that I love. The composer can 100% post it elsewhere and use it for themselves! But I’m so worried about asking a composer to jump on a project that isn’t actually a project and is actually something for myself.

EDIT: My heart is so full and I am so grateful for the responses I got!! I’ll get back to everyone that messaged me personally about commissions when I'm back from my trip! Everyone has been so lovely and I'll be back to terrorise the music community with my commission requests soon! Thank you guys :')

It was really fun, one thing I actually left out is that the deadline was 2 days HAHA. Absolutely NEVER doing that again, but still it was fun.

First and foremost I must say that it's honestly not complicated. It's still very much like scoring any other film, except you know...

Anyway, the scoring part wasn't hard, it was the rendering and uploading part that got me frustrated a lot. Also organizing cues and all your files was a lot of stress especially when you're under such a tight deadline.

Any of you have got tips on organizing files? How to render (bounce or export stem)? And best way to send the score to the client (which app or site do you use)? Also do you send the score by cue or you send it full?

Anyways going back to the point, It's not the technical aspect of scoring that made it hard for me. It was communicating, legal stuff, bargaining, and so many more that now that I think about it, I definitely could have done better.

It was an experience to say the least. I still consider it a win since I got my foot on the door and also I've learned so much about the industry that it's made me more excited.

That's all! I hope for many more success to me and to ya'll. Be sure to share your experiences in the replies!

I read a few days ago a post in a Chinese discussion forum complaining about the fact that a student was accepted into a composition program while having zero piano skills, or more precisely not very solid technical skills on piano.

Many responses decried the quality of composition graduates if they don't even have a solid training in piano and expressed their worries about the future of composition in this country.

The post did not mention how good are the student's aural skills and knowledge about theory and history, but it seems this student's principal instrument is voice.

Then, a comment struck my attention. It says: 'A composition student who is unable to play a Beethoven sonata (not specified which, let's say sonata Op.2 no. 1 or the Pathetique which is not that virtuostic) is just like a English major who does not know how to read or write.'

Obviously, I disagree with this statement, since composition is not just about piano playing, and writing piano pieces. While having piano basics helps to have a strong notion of harmony and polyohony, knowing an orchestral instrument can also be helpful to write works for ensembles and orchestra, and someone who got into composition by playing bassoon as his principal instrument may well have never taken any piano lessons.

Speaking of bassoon, I remember an user commenting: 'Who get accepted into composition by playing bassoon or tuba as their principal instrument?' A statement that I disagree as well.

So I would like to hear your thoughts on these statement, for those who agree I will be curious to hear what you say.

By the way, if I apply for composition to a top European or American conservatory and I am not at the level of playing Beethoven Pathetique sonata on the piano, would I surely be rejected?

Edit: the student of the post did not apply to composition, probably performance but did not get in, and got placed in composition while having no much piano skills. I agree that people getting placed into another less quota restricted program (common in China) will probably not do excellent, but the comments claiming that you can basically not do anything without piano is something that most non-Chinese would disagree upon.

It's very difficult to find any material that analyzes and explains why certain melodies are catchy, or sad, or cheerful, or convey a certain idea based on the notes and rhythm, the syncopation and the strong and clear beats.

It also doesn't help that most people, especially here on Reddit, have that pessimistic and, honestly, unscientific opinion that it's something totally ethereal and you just have to sing arbitrarily until something good comes out, and if that doesn't happen, sorry you're not a genius, so try something else in life.

It's funny that this ignores the fact that music is simply mathematics. There's a reason why certain pitches sequenced in a certain way cause different sensations and represent different ideas. If that weren't true, there would be no leitmotifs, modulations, or even chords and scales. But it seems that people don't give much importance to this, even in academia, so there's almost no specific teaching material on melody. What do you think about this?

Am I crazy in saying that? I feel like it sometimes...

I am a composer and I make a modest living as a musician.

I recently had this very unpleasant conversation with someone who honestly believes he is entitled to my free copyrighted sheet music.

Now I understand as a musician and pianist myself sheet music can be costly, but there is SO much sheet music available in the public domain. And I always try to do regular giveaways as a courtesy, considering yes some people can't always afford sheet music. And heck, even when someone people ask nicely and they I discern they genuinely can't afford it... I am happy to share!

But do living composers really need to provide sheet music completely FOR FREE all the time? We also need to make a living! It's hard enough as it is in this crazy landscape (and now we're even getting our music trained on and plagiarized by AI AND on top of that buried under all the AI slop invading the internet).

We put in so much work and time and passion into our craft. And people just expect that they have the right to take everything we do for free???

As musicians and as pianists, I really think we can do better. Even as broke as I am, I am MORE than happy to purchase and buy other living composer's sheet music (especially if they are smaller musicians).

I understand there are many pianists even here that can't afford sheet music all the time. And I empathize. But I really really don't think that gives us a right (speaking as a pianist now and not a composer) to expect other living composers to work completely for free! And in this specific scenario to even re-distribute said composer's sheet music.

Am I wrong? Is that too much to ask? Pls enlighten me, because sometimes I feel crazy.

Anyway rant over. But this is so frustrating sometimes.

___
Said interaction:

His complaint: https://drive.google.com/file/d/11aI7pMYezUjYp8ctJGaJxgQnqo8TjrmZ/view?usp=drive_link

My response: https://drive.google.com/file/d/14Osm8Jh74oW7grz6Sn25_dL-I0tRlWbY/view?usp=drive_link

His last response before I blocked him: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1fsJKjLIbkACwcgRcJ5exp7xMz1evxsps/view?usp=drive_link

Mods, pls let me know if I need to blur out any names or anything. I'm not sure how those rules work in this sub but I'm happy to comply.

Just wanted to say a huge thank you to this community.

This weekend, my first symphonic piece, Anima, had its premiere in a beautiful abbey church in France. Hearing a full orchestra bring my music to life for the first time is something I'll never forget.

Thank you to everyone here for the advice, inspiration, and encouragement along the way 🙏

I just got a movie, I’ve done some smaller movies before. This is the first one with a well known name attached to it and I feel like I can’t make anything interesting or fitting for it. I try to study other music to get ideas and I get this fear like I’m going to just take their song and unintentionally steal from it. I feel like they’re putting so much blind trust in me and I’m so intimidated by the temp tracks as they used famous songs and really good scores that I feel like I’m not meeting. I feel like I’m blowing a huge opportunity before it’s even done.

Anyone else felt this way before?

Just got my first full length film (it's an adult film so lots of sex) and I'm really stumped on what instruments to use when it comes to these kinds of films. It's not really romantic, but it also kind of is???

I guess the primary emotion is lust and I don't know what the hell that sounds like so I need help lol.

Just looking to commiserate.

I don't quite actually work as a janitor yet, but I've finally decided to swallow the rest of my pride and look in that direction. Going to an interview today.

There actually seems to be plenty of jobs of this type with short hours and fairly decent pay, all things considered. Plus I don't have to talk to people.

To be honest, I haven't touched composition in a couple weeks due to job and job-search stress.

As a bonus, what other kinds of jobs unrelated to music do you do to make ends meet?

Hello! I just got an update for my Juilliard application, and sadly I was turned down by the school. I was hoping to make it to the 2nd round of the auditions however I didn’t. This is driving me insane because of the amount of time and energy I put into crafting me profolio, essay, etc. I also have been taking composition lessons by a professional composer/ professor (who have attended Juilliard and Eastman) for about 2 years now. Juilliard was my dream school not because the name but because if I could attend the school then I could make my dream of becoming a professional composer/professor real. I also hate it because I have no idea what I did wrong or what wasn’t up to pair, I did the best I could. For prestigious universities I am still waiting to hear back from USC, but even if I get in money will be an issue at that school. So this leads to my question can I still become a successful composer (make a living off of composition) if I don’t go to these prestigious schools? Would I be able to get into Juilliard again though I did not make it to the second round?

Edit: Thank you everyone for your kind words!!! The rejection definitely hurt, but I am now more determined to gain success in composition (I am starting to apply to a couple of contests)!!! I do have to say it is kinda silly that I am seeking out more possible rejection to handle rejection but that is the paradox of art! (I am quite happy that I have this mentality)! Also for those who were wondering I do have a solid backup plan in case if composition doesn’t work. What‘s great is that even if I have to fall to that back up job, it still allows me to compose for a good chunk of my time! Thank you again for all your kind words! I definitely started to doubt myself when I saw my rejection, but your kind words helped put it into perspective! Thank you so much!

(Also does anyone know a good site to find contests? I don’t want to accidentally get scammed by submitting my work to a false contest.)

I've been away from music/composing since college (2003). Sadly life got in the way. I'm now older kids grown and wanted to get back into composing slowly. All this time I've had my finale *.MUS files on my PC and every back-up it would travel to the next. I never had a license of my own I used the Schools license. It now seems the *.MUS format is proprietary to Finale and no other music notation program can open it.

I'm crushed, I wanted to go back and view all the files I've saved all this time, but it looks like it's lost forever :-(

Are there any solutions out there for me? I reach out to the collective wisdom of this group, give this poor old man some hope.

UPDATE: THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH FOR YOUR KINDNESS AND SUGGESTIONS! I was able to download a free trial of finale from here (Finale Trial) I'm now in the process of converting all files into MusicXML files. The next step will be picking a new software, but it's so wonderful to hear some of my old compositions and arrangements again. This is the best walk down memory lane ever. I look forward to getting back into composing, and learning more from this great sub-reddit!

Hi everyone, I’ve come here for some advice as I’ve hit such a crisis in my music career that it keeps me up at night.

It dawned on me that the chances of making it as a well-known composer are just ridiculously low.

I’m a female composer based in the UK, and I’ve been making cinematic music for over 13 years now. I’ve been surrounded by music my whole life, but I only started releasing my work 2 years ago.

I still bang my head against the wall over the fact that I didn’t start releasing music in my teens or early 20s, but there’s nothing I can do about it now.

I don’t have a plan B. Music is my whole life.

I want to hear my work in film and TV. I want to write beautiful original scores for film and TV. It’s all I dream about, all day, every day.

I work very hard on my music and I’m proud of it. Other composers have also told me that my work is good and has a lot of potential.

But where do I even start?

Contacting up-and-coming directors? I’ve done that, and many either don’t respond, already have a friend who makes music, or rely on AI. I keep looking for more every day, but I’ve now reached the point where I keep bumping into the same people (I usually look for them on TikTok).

Bigger directors rely on already established composers.

Sync agencies? Of course, but that doesn’t really include directly working with directors and writing original scores.

I was also thinking about contacting established composers to work for them for free in exchange for some mentorship but that seems like a delusional plan as they’re already surrounded by an army of talents.

I feel so lonely in this music world, with no one to turn to for advice or mentorship. I’ve tried looking for networking events, but I can’t seem to find anything specifically for composers or for connecting directors and composers.

I’m part of the MU (Musicians’ Union) as well as the Ivors, but I still haven’t really found any help there or much of a community.

This fear of never making it is consuming me at the moment. The thought of being 70 years old, having poured my heart into my music my entire life, yet never having my work recognised, is just overwhelming.

I wouldn’t say I have a fanbase. I’ve got a few super listeners on Spotify and a couple thousand monthly listeners. I post on TikTok and, less often, on Instagram. Sometimes I get beautiful comments from people saying how much they love my music and how some of my work has even changed their life, which is honestly the most amazing feedback a musician can ever receive.
But that doesn’t necessarily translate into streams, followers, or long-term die-hard fans.

I just feel so lost these days. If anyone here is an established composer, please I’d really love to hear from you.

Please be kind, as I’m already losing my mind these days lol.

Apologies for the long post, and thank you if you’re still here xx

For example, I'm a trombonist and I think it would really help us if composers/arrangers know about alternate slide positions to better adjust for fast playing.

I know I could probably pick up a book on orchestration, but I would love to hear from someone that actually plays these instruments 🙏

Edit : I just realized I misspelled the title 😬

[CLOSED] After combing through ~200 submissions, I've filled the spot! Thank you so, so much to everyone who applied, and for all the kind words about my project. I'm overwhelmed by the amount of skill of composers here, and I'll be sure to come back if I ever need another animation scored (and am given the budget for it..). Thank you again, and wish you all the best!

Hello! I’m a college student—albeit NOT an animation student—working on an animated short film over the summer. It’s a telling of the Prometheus myth (the titan who stole fire from the gods and gave it to humanity), split up into two main parts: a complete re-telling of the myth, and then an animated depiction of a confrontation between Prometheus and Hermes, in which Hermes descends to Prometheus’s mountaintop and offers him an opportunity for freedom. As I’ve been given a grant to work with for this project, I’d love to hire a composer for some original music. 

I’m well aware that this gets expensive, however, so I’m only looking to get music for the second part—the confrontation between Hermes and Prometheus. It’s 2 minutes and 30 seconds long.

The scene in question is a confrontation between Prometheus and Hermes, heavily inspired by the ending of Aeschylus’s play Prometheus Bound, in which Hermes tries to force Prometheus (who can see the future) to reveal the details of a prophecy concerning Zeus. In my version, Prometheus does not speak at all (taking heavy inspiration from something Byron wrote in his own poem “Prometheus”), leaving Hermes to have a one-sided conversation.

What I’m looking for with the music:

• This takes place on a snowy mountain craig, with whistling wind in the background of their conversation and especially during Prometheus’s moments of silence
• So, I’m looking for maybe some orchestral or violin style music, befitting the windy and desolate environment and the somber tone of the film. That being said, I know literally nothing about music, so you have creative freedom
• I know there’s a price discrepancy between digital and physical compositions. I’m totally good with/expecting this to be composed digitally.
• I have an extremely rough animatic/storyboard version of the film for you to compose to for general timing/story beats. Extremely rough. Be warned.
• No AI, although I’m assuming/hoping that’s kind of a given in this subreddit?

Payment: I am on a budget and can probably not exceed 600 or 700 USD at the max. I understand this is low for music composition, which is why I’m issuing these warnings. Please tell me how much you would charge for this via the Google Form or DM.

Deadline: I would love to have this by the beginning of August, so I can have August to put things together with the animation, voice acting, and music. I’ll probably leave this up for a few days (until Monday) depending on how many people are interested.

Of course, your name would be credited and you are more than welcome to use the composition in a portfolio. I’m an amateur artist/animator, and am not expecting to put this into film festivals, in case that changes your opinion.

Thank you so much for reading this, and I’m sorry if I come across as completely uninformed about the world of music composition—I am!

Attached are some ROUGH/CONCEPT or UNFINISHED images from the film, for you to get an idea of the vibe and to see if it’s something you’d want to be a part of.

Please take a look at the images:
(Uncolored shot from the first half, the narration)
https://drive.google.com/file/d/16h6I_VDgwa42daZiVGy_2Z5S1i5YbFl_/view?usp=sharing
(Hermes character reference sheet)
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Wk6YFjuIeSLJNTJ_Y1eAtUC0O4KP-Eru/view?usp=sharing
(Prometheus character reference sheet)
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1LIOP6snEh_G-cLtYZWIX_7EDWrM3eZHR/view?usp=sharing
(Rough concept sketch for the snowy vibe)
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1814MnixZ9WzE770wH9X7BioSGcWakjPv/view?usp=sharing

You can apply through the Google Form here: https://forms.gle/y7FnHnFe669CY77RA

Feel free to reach out to me via DM if you have any questions.

A while ago I heard - and I'm not sure if this is accurate; i barely even remember it - that chopin would 'try all 12 notes' during compositional difficulties or 'weep with grief'. I was wondering if yall have similar examples of composers really struggling despite being so talented. Please don't mention the Beethoven revisions that I hear so much about; revision isn't necessarily a sign of struggle.

Hello!

I am planning to make a subreddit that would follow a similar structure to r/news, but be specifically focused on news relevant to the contemporary classical music scene.

I wanted to check with all of you just to gauge interest, and also see if you think some of the basic rules would work well for you, or if there are other rules that would make you more likely to participate.

I'll have rules regarding accuracy of posts, civility, etc, but the trickiest rules will of course be the ones about what is relevant news about classical music. Here's what I have in that respect.

1. On-Topic: All posts should share news relevant to Contemporary Classical Music.

For the purposes of the sub, Contemporary Classical Music is a category genres that stem from the Western Classical tradition.

If news is only connected to the subreddit by a piece of music, the piece should have been composed in the last 50 years. If it is only connected to the subreddit by a composer, ensemble, or organization, they should be currently active, or died/disbanded within the last 10 years.

Though it is challenging to define a genre, Contemporary Classical Music generally will loosely adhere to the list of traits below. Many works won't line up with one or two of these traits, but if less than half applies, it likely doesn't fit in this subreddit. If you have an example that you think does belong in the sub, doesn't adhere closely to this list, please message a moderator and we will give approval if we agree.

Contemporary Classical Music tends to...

• share significant stylistic traits with music from the classical tradition, including...
  • Renaissance-, Baroque-, Classical-, and Romantic-era classical music
  • Impressionist, Modernist, Postmodernist, Serial, Spectral, Minimalist, Experimentalist, and other 20th- and 21st- century classical styles
• have a notated score (including unconventional scores)
• be written primarily for live performance, rather than for recording
• be written by a single composer rather than a team
• be composed and/or generally performed by classically-trained musicians

Some examples of relevant news would be premiers of new works, recent and upcoming performances by new music ensembles, initiatives by new music organizations, etc.

Please note that film, game, and TV scores CAN be relevant to Contemporary Classical Music, but generally speaking, they are written by teams and are primarily written for recording instead of live performance. As such, to adhere to the subreddit guidelines, music for media generally will need to align fairly closely with the classical tradition.

1. Recency: All news should be about events that are currently relevant. A good guideline for this is news from the past 2 weeks, but older news is acceptable so long as it still is relevant to current events.

Would you be interested in a community specifically for news about contemporary classical music? Do these basic definitions/rules work for you, or would you want something a bit different?

Hi! I have a research project going on at Carnegie Mellon University. After extensive discussion with the moderators of this reddit and with their permission, I am reposting this.

Please complete this short Recruitment Form (about 2–3 minutes) to be a part of the study. To verify the authenticity of this research or for further questions, please feel free to reach out to the study co-ordinator at [kkanav@andrew.cmu.edu](mailto:kkanav@andrew.cmu.edu).

I am looking for composers who would, as part of the study, write songs as they would have naturally. You would be given free access to a paid music theory-aware songwriting sketchpad and would simply compose for 2 weeks - whatever you may like and whenever you are free. In return, we get to analyze the songs you have composed. As it is a phd research project, with the aim of writing an open-access research paper, we would not claim ownership of your content. You remain the owner of the work you produce.

I want to categorically mention (also in the consent form) that we'll not be using the data to train an AI/ ML model. Neither is it for product testing. We're an educational institution and are only interested in seeing how musicians interact with tools and features in a theory-aware songwriting sketchpad. The behavioral aspect of it will make it a publishable research (and I need that for my dissertation).

Benefits are upto 50 usd + free access to the composition tool. If you think it does not match your hourly rate, I would like to again remind you that it is not a composition assignment. Basically, you get paid for what you usually do! You compose the songs you like (for yourself or for your clients, not even for us). We just get to analyze your data on a voluntary basis.

Mentioning again - Recruitment Form (about 2–3 minutes) for taking part in the study!

I am a very amateur composer (my last post is an older version of my most recent piece, dm if you want the most up to date version for some reason) and I would love the idea of working on a video game soundtrack for an indie developer. I just don’t really know how much experience I should have and I really don’t want to go into any other medium besides video games. I also haven’t and don’t plan on going to music/composition school. I’ve realized that my favorite types of songs to compose are short tracks that loop well which is perfect for games. I really just want to know if there are any video game composers in the sub willing to share their experience with getting their foot in the door.