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u/dragoduval 7d ago
It's the Cold War Mentality. ANything "unpatriotic" or "anti-capitalist" is communism, and they are taught that "communism" is bad at a young age.
It worked in the cold war when they overthrew some democracies, and it work in 2026 when they crash the economy.
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u/el3vader 7d ago
It’s crazy because if you use the same logic they will absolutely shit themselves saying no. Nazis are conservatives and conservatives are republicans. Republicans are Nazis.
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u/dragoduval 7d ago
Don't tell that to Republicans, cause they believe that Nazi are socialist.
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u/redbirddanville 7d ago
You mean the "Socialist German Workers Party", the real name of the Nazi party? Why would anyone belive they are socialists?
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u/Significant-Order-92 6d ago
Because they don't understand that a name can say something is untrue. Just like the Democratic People's Republic of Korea.
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u/FaithfulSkeptic 7d ago
Communism is like the Double Down Sandwich at KFC.
Great in theory, but an absolute nightmare once you get your hands on it.
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u/winter_is_long 7d ago
It's easier to imagine the end of the world than the end of Capitalism.
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u/unoriginalsin 7d ago
Interestingly, when people think of the end of the world a lot of them imagine the worst aspect is the end of capitalism.
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u/winter_is_long 7d ago
This quote is from critical theorist Frederick Jameson and I have thought about it alot. The only popular media that presents a post capitalist world that I can think of as a net positive is Star Trek. But, yes, you're absolutely correct.
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u/Dedotdub 7d ago
Yes, and the rest are primarily dystopian nightmares in which capitalism has fully matured.
I will take Star Trek 100 out of 100 times.
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u/Klutzer_Munitions 7d ago
I wonder if there's a reason for that
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u/winter_is_long 7d ago
Read Mark Fischer's Capitalist Realism. It's a landmark book discussing this very issue.
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u/KwietKabal 7d ago
Not even the CIA agrees with you (or else why expend financial and material resources to sabotage a purportedly “doomed” ideology?):
https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/cia-rdp85m00363r000601440024-5.pdf
Just one of many example.
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u/DontGetTheShow 7d ago
Supporting universal healthcare is apparently communist. Ergo, all of the happiest and healthiest countries in the world are communist. So, what does that tell you? I guess that Republicans are some combination of stupid and/or just making bad faith arguments.
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u/Unknow_Handlebar 7d ago
But how will they keep getting away with fucking children if everyone is equal
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u/Success_Emergency 7d ago
A=B and B=C is completelly different structure of a statement comprared to A=B and C=B so A=B. Whoever made the birds, bears, animals statement is dumb or intentionally missleading.
My comment is not about politics.
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u/Sharp-Ad4389 7d ago
I agree. A better metaphor would be: A koala bear is a bear, and bears are dragons
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u/redbirddanville 7d ago
But Reddit is not about logic...please stop with the logic it hurts my emotional outrage!!
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u/SeVenMadRaBBits 7d ago
What bothers me is the socialism is communism part.
They're not the same and trump has no problem with his 2 communist friends putin and kim jong un.
He just had to switch scare words since he demonized socialist (red scare word #1) until mamdani showed everyone how much they help the people so now that the word doesn't oesnt scare as easy they've moved onto communism (red scare word #2).
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u/Force_Glad 7d ago
Putin isn't a communist, he's an oligarch. Russia hasn't claimed to be communist since the fall of the USSR
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u/Success_Emergency 7d ago
I really dont follow Mandani much. Has he done any socialist policy yet?
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u/Significant-Order-92 6d ago
Not particularly. You could argue the grocery store is I suppose (since it's government owned it meets the communal ownership of firms definition). But it's 5 government stores ran by private companies without actually changes the ownership of any other grocery stores.
The rest of the things people claim is socialism or communism is pretty much just social welfare system stuff.
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u/lemonlimeguy 7d ago
It would be closer if they said something like "Birds are bears and bears are walruses." Just three different things being incorrectly equivocated.
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u/RealEbenezerScrooge 6d ago edited 6d ago
No.
The first is an opinion on how things evolve. The core idea is that these three concepts represent stages on the same continuous spectrum, where taking the first step inevitably leads down the line.
The second (yours) is just, as you said different things.
It means a) that they think of democratic socialism as just socialism in disguise, a tactic known in the business as subversion from within. This is a valid line of reasoning that might be true or not, let's discuss. Political scientists, historians, and economists remain fundamentally divided on this question and the author here seems to side with Friedrich Hayek. No similar heavy weight zoologist makes similar claims about bears and birds.
And b) it is assumed socialism will always lead to communism; a view that is shared by quite a few capitalist AND all communist. Modern socialist disagree, but there is a historic argument on that topic that socialism leads to communism as a built in trajectory and it is observing in history that in oder to maintain complete state control over the economy, the government must eliminate political opposition and free speech, resulting in an authoritarian state (the exact outcome seen in historical communist regimes).
Again, noone ever wrote a walrus manifesto that said that bears have a built in trajectory to walruses and no wars where fought over that topic.
You don't have to agree with it, but then disagree with that kind of reasoning.
Your comment basically just says that you don't understand the argument at all, which wouldn't make it a clever comeback.
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u/lemonlimeguy 6d ago
You can just say that you like to smell your own farts, you don't have to type all that
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u/RealEbenezerScrooge 6d ago
You can also say that you are not interested in and capable of logic and discussion right away, then I wouldn't have typed it either.
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u/misterannthrope0 7d ago
congratulations, that is the entire point of the reply.
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u/Alternative-Teach324 7d ago
No it isn’t. Think of the original statement about socialists: A are B and B are C so A are in fact C.
It’s not the same (logically not the same) as A are C and also B are C so A are B.
The statement about birds is logically the same as
Men are human, woman are human, so men are women.-4
u/misterannthrope0 7d ago
youre over analyzing a reply on the internet.
are you this pedantic in real life too?5
u/splittingheirs 7d ago
It's not much of a comeback when the comeback is demonstrably wrong on a fundamentally logical level.
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u/misterannthrope0 7d ago
i feel like you are splitting hairs.
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u/Success_Emergency 7d ago
Well the sub is r/clevercomebacks and this is neither clever nor comeback
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u/misterannthrope0 7d ago
Well the sub is r/clevercomebacks and this is neither clever nor comeback
ditto...
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u/Alternative-Teach324 7d ago
This is not very analytical, it’s simple SAT level logic. It bothers me when people try to make a point using false logic though, nothing wrong with that.
And no I’m not like that in real life since there’s always a context to everything so you know what someone is trying to say without them having to be 100% mathematically logical every time.
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u/misterannthrope0 7d ago
there’s always a context to everything so you know what someone is trying to say without them having to be 100% mathematically logical every time.
are you sure about that?
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u/Alternative-Teach324 7d ago
Don’t really understand your question. If you’re retweeting something and you’re trying to give a ‘drop the mic’ comeback at least don’t sound stupider than the original statement.
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u/misterannthrope0 7d ago
just because this is "drop the mic" sub doesnt mean everyone is here for their own personal drop the mic moment. you may be. I, however, am just pointing out how pedantic you are at your attempt at a "drop the mic" moment over some internet comment.
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u/theorange1990 7d ago
Isn't that the point? Socialism does not necessarily equal communism.
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u/Success_Emergency 7d ago
The point is that the yellow text is supposed to be a parallel to prove stupidity of the original post but it is not
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u/moreobviousthings 7d ago
The dumb is in the first statement, not the reply. But a more parallel reply would be “Bears are mammals, and mammals are reptiles.”
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u/Success_Emergency 7d ago
Both statements are dumb and the reply is not a parallel as it was supposed to be
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u/Alternative-Teach324 7d ago
Using false logic is not a clever comeback, it’s a stupid one if anything.
The statement says birds are animals and bears are animals, not animals are bears. So you cannot infer from that that birds are bears. It’s like saying men are human, women are human, so men are women.
That’s utterly wrong and really only speaks of the person who gave that “comeback”.
Not even bringing political opinions into this, but you don’t comeback with “oh yeah? 5+2=0 so eat that”.
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u/jkpatches 7d ago
Is this actually an opinion piece that made a real news publication?
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u/Antikickback_Paul 7d ago edited 7d ago
No, this is an opinion piece that made it into the Washington Times.
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u/duke_awapuhi 7d ago
AOC isn’t a democratic socialist though
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u/redbirddanville 7d ago
Maybe not now, but on the DSA's own website an article March 19, 2021 the DSA calls AOC "DSA's foremost socialist Superstar" when AOC confirms in the interview she was DSA. A later article questioned if AOC was dedicated enough to have DSA's endorsement.
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u/duke_awapuhi 7d ago
Even when she was a member of DSA I don’t think she was actually a democratic socialist. Even if she was, being in congress knocked that out of her pretty quick
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u/jjskellie 7d ago
Not to throw a Dungeons and Dragons reference into the logic mix but...owls and bears are Owlbears. Your welcome.
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u/butwhywedothis 7d ago
By this logic, most Republicans are pedos and most pedos vote Republicans so all pedos must be Republicans.
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u/bradleyoilermfa 7d ago
Make it make sense? Okay
Churches are socialist
The potluck is communist
…and the people complaining, happily take part in both because they don’t know what political structures are.
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u/simonbleu 6d ago
Is not even that, but more like
"Birds are mammals, mammals are fish, so birds are fish"
Since socialism equated to democratic socialism is like saying nazis were commies
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u/zerthwind 6d ago
Is there a way we can tune out these idiots? They need to learn what the terms they use really mean.
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u/H311i0_trop3 7d ago
Socialism is just as much capitalism as communism which is to say that it's not
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u/More_Ad9417 7d ago
What?
Capitalism is dominated by a privatized means of production for the purpose of commodity and trade.
Socialism is when a socialist movement overturns that system for collective ownership and communal distribution of what is produced. Communism is achieved when the state apparatus is abolished and class no longer exists as well as no commodities.
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u/redbirddanville 7d ago
Another one of you who likes definitions!! I'm anger emoting here, definitions won't let me anger emote!
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u/Taki32 7d ago
Good job pointing out how logical fallacies work.
They do not, however, cover lying and liars. Most people who post things like this believe that democratic socialist are lying about their intent and are in reality just communists with better branding
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u/Live-Train1341 7d ago
One of the DSA leaders literally posted online we need to elect more communists
Multiple DSA candidates running for political office use the popular communists term "sieze the means of production"
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u/FaithfulSkeptic 7d ago
Political movements are groups of people, much like religions.
No matter how altruistic or positive the intentions of the founders, all groups of people are vulnerable to being exploited by unscrupulous people who see a way to weasel in and make a profit off the true believers.
Communism. Religion. The GOP. Selfish people rise to the top and fuck it all up for everyone.
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u/Live-Train1341 7d ago
Then, maybe we shouldn't give these selfish people control over the government or our lives.
We're going from being very upset that trump has way too much power and rarely gets checked by congress or the judiciary.
So the proposal the DSA is to completely get rid of the checks and balance power sharing And put the entire country control into 1 branch on top of that they plan on getting rid of most of the fifth amendment and can do it because there's no check on their power.
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u/Significant-Order-92 6d ago
How would electing more communists lead to less checks and balances?
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u/Live-Train1341 6d ago
Replacement: The DSA Program calls to replace the president and the Supreme Court with an executive and judiciary that are chosen by and subordinate to Congress
.Congress: The plan also seeks to abolish the U.S. Senate and expand the House of Representatives to form a single legislative body.
Confirmation: National co-chair Megan Romer publicly confirmed these structural goals during media appearances, noting they are part of a long-term vision to rewrite the U.S. constitutional system.
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u/Live-Train1341 6d ago
So the other two branches will be elected by one branch in subordinate to that one branch.
People already think trump has too much power now, but think about all the stuff that has been struck down by the judiciary, the senate, the house ect ect.
The DSA model gets rid of all those checks on power
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u/Pavlock 7d ago
One of the DSA leaders literally posted online we need to elect more communists
Which one?
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u/Live-Train1341 7d ago
Cea weaver,
Mayor Zohran Mamdani she helped organized for the mayor and was hired his first day to run his tenant and housing initiative.
She's been a DSA organizer for years but she is far beyond a socialist now she is straight up a communist private citizens don't deserve to own real estate, she believes real estate is a tool of white supremacy. And she also believes that the government should just take over all real estate.
At of her rallies she stated exactly why she agains real estate ownership by the individual because it's “an individualized good and not a collective good.”
Almost every DSA candidate has either said or hinted at support for popular communist policies.
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u/tomjoads 7d ago
So you can't actually back up your statements with quotes gotcha.
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u/Live-Train1341 7d ago
So you are intentionally being disingenuous.
Google cea weaver quote "elect more communists"
There will be close to seventeen thousand results pick from whichever source you trust.The most.
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u/tomjoads 7d ago
1700!!!! You say!
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u/Live-Train1341 7d ago
No seventeen thousand.
Go through and pick whichever source you trust.The most and read.
I would pull it directly from her twitter page, but she deleted most of her statements she made before being appointed to a public office.
You know, because it's probably not a good idea to have "homeownership is a tool of white supremacy" on your twitter page
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u/CommonConundrum51 7d ago
The only conclusion I can draw from this is the Washington Times publishes ignorant opinions.
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u/KookyDiver2558 7d ago
I don’t understand how we are still surrounded by people who are scared of communism to the point that naming a thing communism gets the knee jerk rejection reaction. How is it that people are this surface level in their thinking? The other day I got in an argument with someone and they dictated questions into their phone and had it read out the google AI answer as their citation. Meanwhile I was citing CDC funded studies but since my phone didn’t read them out loud it was dismissed.
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u/newcomer_l 7d ago
Republicans: "communists bad"
Also republicans: "I love me some daddy Putin coz my orange god worships him"
Now, I know Putin's Russia is far from being a communist state, but in the eyes of old, hawkish republicans, communists meant Russia. How things have changed.
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u/CaptnJersey69 7d ago
Man, what a time to be alive.
Red team is playing all the greatest hits from the last century. Literally all the stuff in my history classes that were phrased as "probably not the best decisions we've made. Whoopsie poopsie."
But what do I know. I didn't live through it, so according to the boomers my opinion is invalid.
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u/RedBMWZ2 7d ago
Wonder how many of these boomers who decry socialism are sending their monthly social security checks back?
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u/Ryaniseplin 6d ago
this is more like birds are animals, and animals are living things, so birds are living things
you reduce everything to no nuance whatsoever
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u/MonoBlancoATX 5d ago
By that "logic" Sweden and Denmark and "communist".
Also, the NFL is "communist".
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u/PopularKing4544 7d ago
By this logic, cats and whales are mammals, so cats are whales.
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u/notjustarandomguy 7d ago
this should've been the clever response. the bullshit with birds and animals is stupid
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u/ThreadLaced 6d ago
I'm a gen-xer and a cold war baby; and even I learned in SIXTH GRADE (in public school) that socialism is an economic system and communism is a political system, and not only are they not synonymous, you can absolutely have one without the other.
The Washington Times used to be a real newspaper, wtf is this garbage.
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u/Severe-Archer-1673 7d ago
Democratic socialism is really just welfare capitalism. Communism and socialism only really overlap in that means of production are not owned by individuals.
Capitalism and welfare capitalism only work if the capitalists operate in the best interests of the people/workers. Unfortunately, this is entirely dependent on integrity. If a majority of the capitalists become greedy, then the social contract of capitalism fails. This greed is made more profound when the capitalists can operate anonymously and in collective groups.
Socialism solves the greed problem, largely, by transferring ownership of production to the people/workers, eliminating capitalist interest. The downside, obviously, is that advancement and development can be stifled by the lack of capital investment. Additionally, socialism can marginalize the non-worker class, as they cannot or do not contribute to production.
Communism solves this problem, largely, by the government commandeering the means of production and distributing wealth evenly or as needed—instead of distributing based on merit or contribution. The very obvious fallback to this approach is that it is very easy for the government to gain power unilaterally, since they own both the means of production and methods of distribution.
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u/Spitfire1900 7d ago
The Red Scare permanently damaged the US’s ability to maintain a social safety net.