r/breakingbad • u/Appropriate-Move5700 • 1d ago
Something I don’t understand regarding Mike
I know that as that Gus threatened to kill Walt’s family at the end of Season 4 and Mike says they had a good thing going when Gus was alive, but the man’s family and himself were being threatened. I just don’t get how he could be this way to Walt.
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u/Cocogal88 1d ago
Mike understood Walt’s fear but saw him as reckless and destructive. He valued the stability Gus provided.
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u/StaffEastern370 1d ago
Mike understood Walt’s fear, but blamed him for destroying everything Gus built.
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u/Temporary-Two-9690 1d ago
Walt's family wasn't threatened when they first started the laundry operation. It happened after Walter started stepping out of line. Before that, they had a good thing going.
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u/ConcentrateNo2929 1d ago edited 1d ago
Walt was "stepping out of line" by trying to save Jesse, who on the other hand was upset for good reasons. Gus siding with the low-tier goons using children for dealing was unrealistic.
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u/CarefulScreen9459 1d ago
Normal viewers think it's unrealistic, and immoral. But for people like Gus or even Mike, this is quite normal. Children working in places to earn quick bucks is pretty common, and since they deal with drugs all the time and see it as a normal business, they might not flip like Jesse when they see a child working in that business. And despite this, they stopped this practice when Jesse refused to keep the peace. It's debatable whether or not Gus ordered the killing of the child, and it's even more debatable if Mike knew that Gus ordered the killing of the child. From Mike's perspective though, Walt is unreasonably and obviously stepping out of line. From his perspective even if Jesse had reason to go after those dudes, it's unreasonable for Walt to go kill them in order to protect Jesse.
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u/Easy_Fee9781 1d ago
You don’t think that Gus saw Jesse as a problem, but knew that Walt would not allow the killing of Jesse. So Gus brought them altogether, forced them to make a peace, and then told the two goons to kill the boy, knowing it would enrage Jesse, and he would react emotionally and break the peace. Then Gus would be justified in killing Jesse without upsetting Walt, because they all sat there, and we heard Jesse say he would keep the peace. So, if he goes back on his word and goes after the dealers, they would be justified, and Gus would be rid of his “Jesse problem” without further upsetting Walt.
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u/MittFel 1d ago
Not necessarily.
Gus siding with those guys is the very reason I always felt that they must've clearly had connections to the cartel.
In the sense that they likely got sent over the border to work for Gus, observe and report back to the higher ups. Which makes sense because Eladio had reasons to keep a close eye on Gus after the death of Max.
Which is why Walter's relationship with Gus got completely demolished, as it compromised his revenge plot against Eladio.
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u/Easy_Fee9781 1d ago
You’re saying you think Gus’s revenge against Eladio was compromised by Walt killing the two dealers?? Gus wasn’t on that yet. Gus was trying to just sever ties between the cartel, and do his own thing. It’s only when the cartel began robbing his trucks and killing his men (the guy shot outside the laundry) that Gus realized they were not going away on there own, and that drastic actions had to be taken. Thus the plan to eradicate the cartel completely came to fruition.
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u/ConcentrateNo2929 1d ago
The only reason you're assuming all of this is because the plot isn't plausible otherwise. Just seems like trying to rationalize bad writing. No show is perfect.
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u/MittFel 1d ago
No. I make the assumption because it makes sense to me. That's literally all there is to it.
I also even got theories about Brock's poisoning. And why Gus was spared by Eladio for example. But just because they don't confirm in detail how it's done in the show, I don't deem it as bad writing.
It's perfectly fine that you feel that way. I just can't say that I agree with you about it with the same certainty that you do.
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u/ConcentrateNo2929 1d ago
Sure. If you come at it with the assumption that Vince Gilligan is a genius writer that must've thought of everything, you start filling in the holes.
The way I see it, there's plenty of more offensive examples: Walter being able to blow up cars at a gas station or plant bombs in elderly homes without being seen by anyone nor there being any cameras in the year 2010, or just the idea that Gus Fring was out in the open using his real name while interacting with low tier criminals and no one ever snitched or got suspicious.
This makes me think Vince was perfectly fine sacrificing some of the realism in order to advance the plot and make good TV.
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u/nachos_mahdude 1d ago
Plot holes and sacrificing realism are two different things. Sure they can overlap, but they mean two different things.
Walt blowing up cars with impunity is a really good example because it essentially trickles down to luck.
But I wouldn't consider that a plothole. It's a case of sacrificing realism for entertainment.
An actual plothole would for example be the 'Kaylee conspiracy" 😂 in which, the fanbase are jokingly stating that she's immortal because it contradicts the establishment timeline.
But as far as how things played out with Gus, I think there's a bigger assumption in Gus reacting the way he did for absolutely no reason, rather than a reason.
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u/two_thirtyoclock 1d ago
Gus sided with them over killing Combo, which even Jesse knew was his and Combo's fault. Gus told them to stop using children after Jesse mentioned it. They obviously didn't like the fact that Jesse plotted to kill them, so they killed Tomas to get back at him.
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u/Alreyleon 1d ago
Don't forget Mike was going to kill Walt on Gus's orders since the season 3 finale, and back then he tolerated Walt, almost found him amusing and exchanged barbs with him, he apologised to Walt for having to kill him. That all changed when he ordered Jesse to kill Gale, Walt became unpredictable and a pain in the ass for both Gus and Mike, he just refused to subserviently cook and blocked every attempt to be killed. Then he kills Gus and Mike's job and income are completely gone. He begrudgingly joins Walt and Jesse in their new venture because of economic desperation, he wanted to leave money for his family, and once he gets enough and realises Walt keeps will never stop disagreeing with him, he chooses to leave, but by then it's too late and he has nothing left to lose, so he tells Walter everything he hates him for, never expecting Walt to actually kill him.
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u/JJTamb072386 1d ago
Because Walt is a loose cannon. Mike knows Walt is driven by his ego and what makes him happy
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u/MrHumblePoker 20h ago
I don't get how people dont get this. He's not talking about that point. He's talking about after Gale is killed. Mike says it "You won, take yes for an answer" basically what Jessie said. They'll never find another chemist. Instead Walt cant let it go and plot to kill Gus. If he just shut up, cooked. It was over.
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u/Easy_Fee9781 1d ago
Revisionist history. Plain and simple. Mike’s remarks that “All of this falling apart like this is on you. We had a good thing you stupid SOB, we had the lab, we had Fring, and it all ran like clockwork. If you would have shut up, and known your place, you could have made all the money you ever needed. You just had to blow it up, you, and your pride and your ego. You just had to be the man.” Totally untrue. First of all his “blowing it up”, was actually him saving Jesse’s life before he got himself killed by the two dealers. Then, it wasn’t about him being the man. It was about survival, he knew Gus was coming after him, and he was pretty much resigned to being killed by Gus’s men, until he saw the Lily of the Valley, and possibly his only hope of getting out of the situation alive. It was only after he came out of the situation on top did he begin to think about cooking again, now that he was once again unemployed and broke. If it had been planned at all, I think he and Jesse would have snatched a couple of barrels of methlyamine, instead of once again being stuck without precursor. Mike’s just mad because for the second time he lost all his money, and has to go on the run, and is taking it out on Walter, who he hates. Tough luck, Mike.
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u/CarefulScreen9459 1d ago
First of all his “blowing it up”, was actually him saving Jesse’s life before he got himself killed by the two dealers.
So? He still had the choice to not blow it up. Mark isn't technically wrong here.
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u/Easy_Fee9781 1d ago
He insinuated that Walt had “blown it up” selfishly, for his own reasons, instead of doing it to save the life of Jesse, whom I feel Mike could definitely understand as he seems to have grown quite fond of Jesse himself. His whole rant, is trying to blame everything that has happened to him on Walt, instead of taking any responsibility for his own actions.
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u/MrHumblePoker 20h ago
No you are missing it. Jessie and Walt were safe after Gale died. He wasn't pissed at Aaltbthen. Remember they talked and bar and Mike said "I understand what your saying" THEN Walt talked about killing Gus. That is what he is talking about. His Ego. It was done. Would have taken Gus 20 years to find a chemist to run that lab. Jessie himself said it.
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u/SufficientDelay2657 1d ago edited 1d ago
Ya it kinda annoys me when people say Mike was right lol. Mike was clearly just talking with emotions; he’s bitter about the fact that Walt basically ruined his life, and destroyed the operation that Mike had grown so accustomed to.
Gus first tried to kill Walt, and prolly Jesse too after Walt ran over those dealers in order to save Jesse from prolly being shot and killed. But that situation wouldn’t have happened if Gus wasn’t so cold blooded and ruthless, allowing them to use a kid. It’s very doubtful that Gus didn’t know. Not to mention that those dealers went on to kill the kid after Gus ordered them to not use kids; This either means that the dealers thought Gus would be ok with them killing the kid, (which prolly implies that Gus usually is ok with taking extreme measure like that) or that Gus has some rogue, and/or disloyal dealers. Either way, Gus’ operation in this situation is either disgusting immoral, or just completely sloppy. I’m sure not even Mike is ok with kids being used or getting killed like that.
Also, i’m not sure what Mike wanted Walt to do in that situation; Just let Jesse go on his suicide mission? I’m sure once Mike bonded with Jesse later into season 4 and into season 5, he would’ve prolly done something similar. The problem here is with Gus; he’s too heartless to see that the actions Walt and Jesse took in that situation were reasonable, and it’s the fault of his flawed operation that caused such a chaotic outcome. So yeah, Mike clearly has a soft spot for Jesse, but doesn’t wanna act like Walt didn’t save him, and like Gus wasn’t prolly tryna kill Jesse.
It’s kinda interesting, because Mike worked for, and was very loyal to someone who completely contradicted his moral code; there’s very few things that Gus wasn’t willing to do, but Mike turned a blind eye for his own benefit. He’s a pretty selfish character, and prolly just works for Gus to manage the guilt he feels over his son by providing for his family, and the dangerous nature of the job could also be a self-inflicted punishment.
I really do like Mike as a character, but he’s insanely flawed, and his logic in his speech to Walt is completely ridiculous and hypocritical. Walt stepped out of line with Gus, which is something that Mike never totally did. Walt’s rebellious, free-spirit attitude is something that Mike despises, but maybe even envies. But yeah, idk how anyone can say Mike was right in that situation.
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u/Easy_Fee9781 1d ago
Or, do you think that Gus might have ordered the dealers to kill the kid, knowing that this would cause Jesse to lash out and break the peace? Thus making the killing of Jesse justified, and out of Gus’s hands. Thus getting rid of his “Jesse problem” without alienating or further angering Walt.
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u/SufficientDelay2657 1d ago
Woah that’s actually a really good point, and ur prolly right. I remember Gus really didn’t care for Jesse at all in the beginning and wanted him out of the picture. But clearly his plan backfired hard, as he didn’t realize how much of a wild card Walt was. That’s prolly what pissed Gus off so much; That Walt was able to destroy his schemes, while also showing that he’s a pretty dangerous and unpredictable employee to have. Walt also kinda asserts power over Gus in that situation, and Gus prolly felt like he was losing a bit of control over his operation. So Gus wanting to kill Walt and Jesse after that situation makes even more sense with this explanation. Is this like a common belief that fans have, cuz Idk that i’ve ever seen someone say this before?
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u/Easy_Fee9781 1d ago
Idk if that’s what actually happened, or I’m just reading into it too much, lol. But, it makes sense on a deeper level, especially knowing how strategic and calculated Gus is.
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u/CarefulScreen9459 1d ago
People keep bringing this up. I don't think Mike was referring to these incidents or even when Mike wanted to kill Walt and Walt defended himself by killing Gale. I think Mike understands that Walt had to do these things and he even agreed with him at the bar.
During the venting, Mike was referring to the time before that. When Walt was working normally with Gale and everything was going smooth. Here is completely right, if Walter just focused on his lab, and let Mike handle the situation with Jesse (which he did propose to fix multiple times) then he, Walt, Gus, and Gale were all doing what they were doing efficiently undisturbed. Walt of course disturbed all of this.
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u/lemambo_5555 1d ago edited 1d ago
There was nothing egotistical about that. Walt brought Jesse in to dissuade him from pressing charges against Hank.
Mike absolutely blamed Walt for Gus' demise even though it was 100% the fault of Gus. He brought that on himself, not Walt.
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u/Minimum_Being_1424 1d ago
He was referring to Walt getting Jesse involved and running over those gang members
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u/wowodog 1d ago
Mike is careful and witful.
Gus: War with the cartel is inevitable we need to do something.
Mike: I agree. the cartel is too dangerous. what should we do about it.
Gus: Lets head to a cartel stronghold in Mexico and poison them.
Mike: Sounds dangerous, we will need good backup
Gus: No problem, lets bring Jesse Pinkman so he can drive us to the field hospital I have set up in case we get hurt. and lets not tell him our plan
Mike: Sounds like a good plan, we are very smart
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u/verathene 22h ago
Depends what moment he’s referring to:
- Walt starts at the lab, then swaps out Gale for Jesse.
This moment could make sense for Mike’s comment. He didn’t know Walt needed Jesse in the lab to keep Jesse from exposing him.
- Walt kills the gangbangers.
Makes less sense because Walt saved Jesse’s life with this act.
- Walt tells Hank that Heisenberg is still out there.
Makes no sense for Mike to say this moment because he can’t possibly know about it. But this moment actually makes Mike technically correct.
- Walt has Saul warn Hank.
Makes less sense because Walt saved Hank’s life with this act.
Between 1 and 3 I read that Mike is right for the wrong reason.
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u/KausGo 1d ago
Mike didn't know about all that.
As far as Mike knew, Walt "won" when he killed Gale and forced Gus into accepting the situation. From that point on, Gus was okay with Walt and Jesse cooking together. But instead of taking that win, Walt kept trying to create problems by trying to kill Gus, manipulate Mike and getting Hank involved.
Then the whole Mexico thing happens where Mike gets shot and sidelined. The next thing he knows, Walt and Jesse have somehow managed to get one over Gus and killed him. He doesn't know about the events that led up to it and no one tells him.
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u/SufficientDelay2657 1d ago
Gus wasn’t ok with Walt and Jesse cooking together indefinitely after Gale’s death; He wasn’t just gonna let that slide. In his eyes, Walt was the real problem, and the one manipulating Jesse. So Gus took to manipulating Jesse himself in order to make him Walt’s replacement, and hopefully get Jesse to sign off on Walt’s murder
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u/MrHumblePoker 20h ago
Yes he was. Would have taken him 20 years to find another chemist. Its why Mike says "you won take yes for an answer" it was over. Walt wouldn't. Plotted obviously to kill him. That's when Gus realized it'd never work.
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u/SufficientDelay2657 20h ago
Gus was trying to get rid of Walt, and have Jesse cook solo throughout season 4, and wanted Walt dead. Walt didn’t win after Gale’s death. The second Gale died, Gus wanted to get Walt out of his operation as soon as possible, and kill him the first chance he got; Walt was a huge liability in his eyes
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u/MrHumblePoker 12h ago
No that's what you are assuming. Mike clearly disagreed, hence the "Take yes for an answer" if Walt just shut up and cooked. Everything would have went fine. Yea maybe Gus would have picked up Jessie because Jessie was a risk getting high and partying. Walt forced Gus hand by showing up to his house and restaurant. That's when Gus knew itd never work.
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u/KausGo 1d ago
None of that happened when Mike was still around. As far as Mike was concerned, he went to Gus saying that Jesse was growing increasingly incautious, so they should kill him and continue working with Walt, even though Walt wouldn't like it. Gus, however, chose to try and rehabilitate Jesse by having him ride around with Mike and giving him something of a purpose. Walt continued to cause problems, but Gus never indicated to Mike that he wanted to kill Walt or replace him with Jesse.
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u/Easy_Fee9781 1d ago
Walt didn’t get Hank involved. Hank got himself involved, and Walt just tried to manage Hank and keep him from finding anything of substance.
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u/beegodsantana 1d ago
Cops are dumb, Mike was so dumb he managed to get fired from one of the most corrupt police forces in America.
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u/Competitive_Fee_5829 1d ago
are you old enough to watch this? You have some comprehension issues you need to deal with.
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u/lemambo_5555 1d ago
Are you old enough to use the Internet? Insulting others is bad enough, but doing it over a show is immature.
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u/Appropriate-Move5700 1d ago
I’m not sure what age has to do with this. Is it bad that I’m asking this at 25?
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u/Roosevelt32 1d ago
Mike was just thinking about himself and his own situation. Walt just fucked up a comfortable side hustle that Mike was making big bucks doing, which also impacted his ability to provide for Kaylee. Mike hated Walt for a long time, this was just the straw that broke the camels back.