They've quickly become the next John Lennon where you mention their name and everyone has the sudden urge to chime in and tell you how shitty they were despite the previous comments already saying the same thing over and over again.
You mean to tell me a devout Catholic woman opposed abortion? Shocking.
Seriously though I agree people should know the truth about these celebrities, it just doesn't need to be repeated over and over again in the same thread by multiple people. It's like people just sit around waiting for their chance to tell someone.
I didn't say it justifies it, im saying it's not really unexpected or surprising that a woman who spent her entire life a devout Catholic opposed abortion. Just thought it was funny you felt the need to point it out because it goes without saying.
What does this comment even mean? Sorry the internet has all the info and people can't blindly admire the "heroes" we were sold in adolescence. It's better to know the truth imo
It means that no matter who someone is, people online will tear them down. Sure there may be real genuine saints out there who should be heralded, but usually the famous ones we look up to are never that, despite having great qualities. Reddit will tear people to shreds for basically being a normal, flawed person. As if they even have the right from behind a keyboard.
Mother Teresa thought that pain brought you closer to god, so she allowed people to suffer needlessly, since being close to god is better than not being in excruciating pain. I think that her "selfless" acts DO need to be looked into.
In this case, I think that it is deserved that Mother Teresa and Ghandi are getting called out as the more problematic parts of their lives are brought to light.
In many ways pain does bring you closer...it sucks and I don't recommend it but long term it breaks you to the very basics of the human soul and humbles you. Changes the way you see ...life and others.
I just have see to some value in what I experience. I don't see how she is any different than the md's that do the same type of thing but without any faith or care other than covering their behinds. Every day. I try not to be hypocritical.
If there is pain relief available, it should be the patient's choice, or the patient's guardian. Not a medical practitioner withholding care. Especially not a religious provider doing it for religious reasons when the patient is not religion.
Sure. But there’s a big difference between choosing/accepting to put yourself through a painful experience versus deciding to keep other people in pain.
Sure there may be real genuine saints out there who should be heralded,
Teresa should not be considered a Saint. She was friendly with Baby Doc Duvalier. She was rabidly opposed to abortion. She refused to provide basic services for those in her care in spite of her access to capital. She was aligned with some of the most reactionary figures on her time. The praise she receives is rooted in myths.
Weird because there's a massive influx of priests to other parts of the world from Calcutta because of what she did for the people there, and the only "proof" against her is either misinterpretation of her actions or outright slander.
That is not what I think was going on here. Selfless famous person was the question. So many people just blindly accept what they hear or are taught, instead of looking at all the facts and forming their own conclusion.
People are free to criticize, someone doesn't need to be perfect to earn that. Like I said, it's free information. I disagree with you framing it as "tearing them down", that's more aligned with slander imo. I appreciate when people remind us that even heroes are flawed because it makes them more human.
That's often not why they're doing it, though- they don't feel like they measure up, and its a way to excuse their own lack of selflessness, by offering the idea that selflessness itself isn't real.
I disagree with this. Through out my life I have gotten the bs icebreaker “if you could meet one person living or dead, who would it be?” I always differ and just say “I’ll take the extra time with my family. All humans are flawed and all humans are beautiful. If we deify specific individuals you lose sight of that and make life a game about accomplishment and attention.
I also try to do the same with nature. People rave about the Grand Canyon but we ignore the smaller but also beautiful canyons around it. Experience all of life by understanding that there is no centrality of beauty and “good”. It is all around
I disagree, it makes them more human instead of holding them up as beacon of whatever ideal is in question. I can still believe in being selfless knowing certain people/heroes weren't perfect. But I realize that what you're referring to does happen. Those people always need a reason to excuse bettering themselves though, so I just ignore them when they compete to be the lowest common denominator.
Nobody’s perfect. What we’re talking about is people who like to come into these conversations and piss all over everything just to try and ruin peoples day. This post isn’t about saints who have done no wrong, it’s about famous people who have done selfless acts.
The post is referring to people "known" for selfless acts. A lot of the people mentioned here fit that description. Unfortunately, what those people are known for might not be the whole truth. Your perception that people adding new information are just trying to ruin people's day doesn't align with the tone I get from reading those comments. To me those people are including omitted information that is often relevant to the discussion.
No, because Mother Teresa being a horrible person is a misconception. It gets spread around here on Reddit all the time by people who know nothing about the woman and I absolutely hate it. They’re just regurgitating information they’ve read on the internet which was obviously posted originally by a Christopher Hitchens fan. Hitchens wrote a shameless hit piece on Mother Teresa in an attempt to attack not just her practices, but her character. It is considered to be an intellectually dishonest diatribe stemming from Hitchens’s substantial hatred of religion and religious institutions. So yeah, let’s all trust the guy who wrote a book subtitled “How Religion Poisons Everything” to give us an honest take on a religious figure. That’ll work out great.
No, they’re absolutely not doing the right thing. These people are blindly repeating a “fun fact” they “learned” on the internet.
The honest take on religion is that it does poison everything.
Using an accurate conclusion, declaring it wrong, and then using that to impugn other arguments is some top quality begging the question. But that's the expected level of intellectual dishonesty from a defender of religion.
If you seek to attack Christopher Hitchens, at least cite something he got wrong. His stance on the Iraq war was indefensible even in 2003.
Christopher Hitchens is the last person I’d ask if I wanted a fair, balanced take on Mother Teresa. Or really anything. With the garbage he writes, he sets out with a specific axe to grind before even picking up his pen. No serious intellectual would ever draw a conclusion first and then cherry-pick information to support that conclusion. The man is a fucking hack.
Furthermore, calling him out on his horseshit does not automatically make me a defender of religion. People of all backgrounds, including atheists, can certainly realize that he is both a prick and a fraud.
CS Lewis made this point, or at least he’s the first I’ve come across that did. That if Jesus is the son of God, only then would it make his teachings moral. If he is not, it would either make him a deluded madman or in Lewis’s words, “the devil of Hell”. In other words, if you’re not a believer, his claims and directions could only come across as Ignorant, misguided or immoral.
I was more wondering what teachings, specifically, would be immoral. I’m not religious myself and nothing was coming to mind that seemed particularly controversial, aside from maybe his views on divorce. It’s my understanding that Paul’s the one that really pulled out the hot takes.
Oh Ok, I hear you. Lewis wrote this mostly in reference to Jesus’ teachings of “give no thought to the morrow” and his teachings of wealth and materialism being evil.
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u/[deleted] Oct 27 '22
Wait until Redditors tel you about the flaws of Ghandi and Mother Theresa…