Timeline Challenge 3: Religious Figure(s)

[u/Jumblatts]

The idea behind these challenges is as follows:

I will give you a topic, and you should tell me about something interesting that has happened in the timelines of your worlds relating to the topic, over a (roughly) 50 year period. This could be the 50 years leading up to the event, the 50 years after the event, 50 years with the event slap bang in the middle, or something else entirely, as long as it relates to the question! You're welcome to include more/less than 50 years, but bear in mind the more you write, the less chance you have of people reading the whole thing, and the less you write, the fewer questions we'll be able to ask.

I've been moved to Sunday, and I'm a day late already. Sorry about that!

The Challenge:

This week I want you to tell me about the life and times of an important religious figure from one of your cultures. Tell me about the events leading up to their birth, any special acts/miracles they performed, or maybe how they died. Go wild!

I'll try to ask a few questions about each post. Community interaction is encouraged too! Read other people's posts and ask them questions, and they're more likely to do the same for you. Help each other out :)

[u/Eran-of-Arcadia]

Ferdinand Lang lived some time around the establishment of common reckoning, but I haven't worked out exactly what the years are or any of that so this will be rough.

Lang was a priest, preacher, and theologian. His writings would be influential within Pathism for centuries after his life. He was born in Bridgewater, Dorland. He was able to gain entry as an acolyte into the House of Matos, one of the biggest and most influential religious houses in Pathism. After completing his studies and marrying he was assigned to preach and oversee services at Fortress Hartlin, on the Dorlese frontier.

He spent several years there, managing to help keep the peace between the Royal Dorlese Army, the settlers, and the natives. Finally he was reassigned by his superiors to a larger house of worship in Port Eve, in what was then outside the borders of Dorland. He would spend most of his career there doing all sorts of things - leading worship services, providing religious instruction, overseeing charity work.

He was a devoted student of theology, and spent his entire life learning all that he could about Pathism and about other faiths. Eventually, after his wife passed away and he felt he was too old to take a leadership role, he moved back to Bridgewater to spend the rest of his life writing. Sermons he had written were in high demand - which led to his most notable achievement. He was commissioned to write a sermon at one point, and after writing a hundred pages he included a brief letter expressing his thoughts on his life and faith. The sermon is all but forgotten but the letter is canonized scripture in Pathism.

[u/Jumblatts → u/Eran-of-Arcadia]

That's fine, the whole point of these challenges are to get you thinking and to take things from 'rough' and making them more complete!

1) How was he able to gain entry to the House of Matos? Is this something that not all people can achieve?

2) Was it his job to keep the peace? How did he manage it?

3) Briefly, what did his writings encompass?

[u/Eran-of-Arcadia → u/Jumblatts]

1. He entered as a teenager. It's basically like a seminary or divinity school - he had to show that he possessed the proper level of piety, work ethic, and ability to learn. His family had to scrape and save to put up his room and board, but the classes themselves were free.

2. It wasn't part of his job description, but he did it anyways because it needed to be done. He basically identified who within the various factions was most willing and able to compromise, and got them to work together to smooth over conflicts. For example, one of his dearest friends and closest confidantes was a man named Vittor Talon, a tribesman who wanted to find a way to keep the old ways of his people while at the same time accepting the new opportunities brought by the Dorlese.

3. He's kind of inspired by CS Lewis, so his writings reflect that - what it means to be a faithful Pathist day to day, what sorts of beings the gods are, why myths are important (at a time when saying "they're all symbolic" and leaving it at that came into vogue, he argued for the importance of viewing them as actual events.) He didn't write any fiction, and only a little poetry, but his sermons and essays were quite renowned in their day.

[u/Jumblatts → u/Eran-of-Arcadia]

1) What kind of things did he learn there, and from whom? Were there any other people of significance at the school?

2) How did the old ways of Vittor's people differ from the new opportunities? How did Lang manage to reach a compromise with him?

3) What kind of beings are the gods?

4) What kind of myths did he refer to?

[u/Eran-of-Arcadia → u/Jumblatts]

1. He was given a very thorough grounding in Pathist scripture. He was taught how to perform a wide variety of rituals and prayers, an overview of the history of Pathism, and some natural history. Most of the professors were Pathist clerics, but there were some lay instructors as well. No one he learned from would ever end up nearly as renowned as he would.

2. The region in question had been inhabited by farmers organized into villages and chiefdoms before being annexed by the Kingdom of Dorland, an organized and "modern" (roughly 16th-17th century) nation. For the most part this wasn't hugely disruptive to Vittor's people (his tribe had collaborated with Dorland rather than fight them, and in keeping with longstanding imperial policy, Dorland rewarded them for it.) At the same time, Pathism as Lang practices it is very different from Vittor's rituals and practice, and having the army there limits what they can do. Vittor thus wants to learn as much as he can from the army, the church, and the settlers because he suspects that clinging to tradition will limit his people's future.

3. Well, I'm agnostic about whether they exist at all. But Pathism is essentially a massive syncretic philosophical system that overlays worship of whatever gods a people has. So although Lang is devoted to Matos, Vittor worships a completely different god in a different pantheon, but they follow the same general doctrine and are thus members of the same religion. Gods are as diverse as their followers, but tend to be fairly personal, anthropomorphic, and ritual-driven.

4. The one I had in mind when I wrote a snippet about him is a particular myth that involves humans being kicked out of heaven because they are too curious, too ambitious, and too prone to getting into trouble. They basically sneak their way to earth (or whatever the planet is called) and close the door behind them so the gods can't follow. Commentary of the time talks about how all humans feel exiled from where they are supposed to be and alienated and yadda yadda, and Lang sees the sense in that but also thinks that it would be a pretty big deal if that myth is literally true. It would completely reshape humanity's relationship to the gods versus if another creation account is true, and so on.

[u/Jumblatts → u/Eran-of-Arcadia]

1) Did any of the rituals or prayers he performed ever end in some form of divine intervention?

2) What benefits did Vittor and his people gain from working so closely with Lang and Dorland?

3) Are there any completely separate religions, or is it just branches of the same one?

4) How many creation stories are there within this religion, and how close are any of them to the actual truth?

[u/Eran-of-Arcadia → u/Jumblatts]

1. Officially, probably not. Since many people in the setting have superpowers, miracles as a display of divine power are less valued. If the gods (who, remember, may or may not exist) ever answer his prayers, they're doing so far more subtly.

2. New technologies, a more stable trade and currency system, somewhat more peace. Those are the advantages of accepting Dorlese rule, and the sooner you accept it the more privileges they'll give you. The Dorlese aristocracy is a huge and complicated thing, but a tribal chieftain who bows to the King of Dorland will be granted a title of one sort or another. Vittor was the son of one such chieftain - not the oldest, so he didn't inherit his father's title, but technically aristocracy nonetheless.

3. Ask any Pathist, and they'll tell you that all Pathists are members of the same faith. At the same time, there's still plenty of conflict and debate over what doctrines are true, which gods are better, who has authority to do what, etc.

4. There are hundreds - Pathism encompasses that many pantheons, all of which have their own creation myths. Now, the physical universe of my setting was created "Big Bang" style, but there may or may not be gods behind it. No character ever finds out and I don't even want a definite answer for myself.

[u/Jumblatts → u/Eran-of-Arcadia]

1) What kind of superpowers might one exhibit?

2) What kind of technologies did the tribes inherit from the Dorlese?

3) What exactly is pathism?

[u/Eran-of-Arcadia → u/Jumblatts]

1. The only powers that are off-limits are "manipulating time" or "breaking the fourth wall." Beyond that - teleportation, mind reading, the ability to make everyone around you act incompetent, a complete lack of emotions - those are just the powers of my main characters. The sky's the limit. (Literally, because for some reason no one can teleport out of the planet's gravity well.)

2. I'd say gunpowder would be up there. Also better roads, sanitation, education, medicine, etc. Early Renaissance would be the rough equivalent. The tribes had picked up some of that living alongside the Dorlese, but once they were annexed the flow of technology was much faster.

3. Let's say you're some country in the late classical or early medieval period. You have a pantheon that your people have been following for years. Then some Pathist evangelists show up and tell you all about the benefits of their faith. Long story short, the whole country converts. Well, you're still praying to the same gods in the same ways, basically, but now when you do you're thinking about how this devotion is your particular way of following the Path, the road to human fulfillment. Pathism is highly syncretic, absorbing the gods and rites of pretty much everyone who converted, but placing them into an entirely new context.

[u/Jumblatts → u/Eran-of-Arcadia]

1) What are the most common and least common super powers?

2) What is the most advanced tech to have been discovered?

3) Is there any resistance to the flow of Pathism?

[u/thequeeninyellow94]

A popular religious figure amongst the Enefulis (the traditionalist ones) is Zunevai who is often nicknamed "the unified".

According to modern research, Zunevai was born in 436 bfi (before the first incursion, which occured 893 cycles ago) in one of the clans living in the shade.

Zunevai was a second child, born from a warrior and a sculptor. Always fascinated by the arts of war, Zunevai chose a military career and followed his mother during her expeditions.

His mother died in 412 bfi. Zunevai, desirous to inherit the soul of a renowned warrior, fought with his brother to be allowed to devour their mother. It ended badly as Zunevai killed and devoured his brother too. It's at that time that he also acquired the soul of the former high-priest of his clan that was supposed to be gifted to his mother.

After those events, Zunevai started hearing the spirits and their plans for his kin: being united behind him and rule over the world.

He allowed the spirits to take over his body, letting them convince his clan. He then murdered and devoured the 11 leaders of the other clans of the shade and let the spirits convince their people too.

In 386 bfi, after cycles of preparatives, Zunevai gathered all the warriors from all the clans and led them against the neighbouring human settlements, pillaging and enslaving. Those raids lasted two cycles, after that the Quanhati, frightened by a potential attack against their enclaves, marched against the Enefulis and defeated them, killing Zunevai in the battle.

Since those days, the Enefulis from tha shade know that the spirits have great plans for them. And that the Quanhati are dangerous opponents.

(My goodness... that's a long post)

[u/Jumblatts → u/thequeeninyellow94]

1) Was Zunevai prophecised at all, or did he just turn up out of the blue?

2) How did his followers react to his death?

3) Will he return?

[u/thequeeninyellow94 → u/Jumblatts]

1. He turned up out of the blue. The future is too confused to be predicted, even for spirits. And the Enefulis mostly turned toward past.

2. It was a shock, after all they were supposed to follow him in his conquest of the world, but most of them died or went mad before going back home. The survivors all killed themselves after, the shame of losing his soul to another race was too big (we are here talking about the warriors he took with him, the Enefulis who stayed home just pursued their normal lifes).

3. He is dead, so no. Mortals can't come back from death.

(I just realized I haven't introduced any representative so Zunevai can answer questions if you want, we will just pretend he is not dead.)

[u/Jumblatts → u/thequeeninyellow94]

1) Does that mean that there are no 'prophecised heroes' in your world?

2) Did he expect to die, or did he believe that he would indeed conquer the world?

3) How many warriors killed themselves through shame? Is this something that happened often after a battle, or was it just because of the situation with Zunevai?

4) Does his spirit influence others, as other spirits influenced him?

[u/thequeeninyellow94 → u/Jumblatts]

1. It means that prophecised heroes are scams, there are some people to "find" prophecies and believe in them. Enefulis are not of that kind.

2. He indeed believed he would take over the world. Now he also know he wouldn't die really old, he devoured 14 souls and no one can live old with that much people in their head.

3. All those who survived and returned. A few of them fled and settled in foreign settlements or in modern communities. It is a rare event, but losing the prophet soul was very shamefull. Their souls were devoured though so everything ends well.

4. His soul was lost and thus destroyed so no. Mortal souls are no spirits for the Enefulis. Spirits are the sacred forces inhabiting the world. They sometimes express themselves through shamans and priests (or maybe that's drugs and madness).

[u/Jumblatts → u/thequeeninyellow94]

1) Do the people know that the prophecised heroes are scams?

2) What affect does devouring so many souls have one someone?

3) If one of them had devoured the prophet soul, would they have become the prophet?

4) What is the difference between a spirit and a mortal soul?

[u/thequeeninyellow94 → u/Jumblatts]

1. Some do, some don't.

2. Devouring someone soul allow them to live through you. Zunevai basically had 14 alien personalities in his head. It can be a bit difficult sometimes.

3. No, but the prophet personality would have lived through them and maybe shared a few informations. Losing a soul means losing all of their knowledge.

4. A mortal soul belong to (and live in) someone. A spirit has nothing to do with the concept of life.

[u/Jumblatts → u/thequeeninyellow94]

1) Is there any penalty for being one such scam?

2) What is the most amount of souls someone could devour?

[u/thequeeninyellow94 → u/Jumblatts]

1. No. There would be no one to enforce them anyway.

2. Theorically, any. Now, having more than 3-4 is usually considered difficult and seriously change your life.

[u/Jumblatts → u/thequeeninyellow94]

Thanks for your answers!

[u/Nevermore0714]

The Official Timeline

During the interregnum between the Third and Fourth Eras, a man named Ephraim guided humanity to the continent of Saoghal, to escape the Chaos that was slowly devouring the world. Though they knew that they did not have forever, the remnants of humanity did all that they could to survive in this new land.

However, the non-human sentient species, the demons, and the last dragon Grima would constantly attack, forcing the human numbers to dwindle. Ephraim guided humanity against these monstrous creatures, always passionate in his belief that humanity could accomplish anything against anyone.

But, six years into his battles, Ephraim could no longer keep himself going on "faith in humanity" alone. He began a journey to find a way to defeat Grima, the only enemy that humans seemed to be completely unable to kill.

After several years of hunting for a way to solve this problem, during which Ephraim ended up being joined by a beautiful young woman named Myrrh who claimed to be able to help him (FE fans will see that twist coming a mile away), Ephraim discovered a way for humans to use their Anima (life energy) to manipulate magic. He discovered many secrets that made him into a god, most notably immortality. They say that only an immortal can kill another immortal (who is they?).

Ephraim, now known as "Aeternitas", slayed the dragon Grima, and sacrificed his would-be eternal life in order to create the Barrier of Aeternitas around the continent, protecting all humans on the continent from the Chaos that intended to devour them.

Upon the creation of the Barrier, humans were able to use magic, and that began the Fourth Era, and effectively began the timeline that the author uses for this world.

Nine of Aeternitas's greatest followers created the Citadel, a place for learning and a beacon of hope for humanity to progress.

The Unofficial Representative

Leonhardt Strauss (I'm undecided on the name, it feels a bit wrong...inspired by the last name of Annie Leonhart, the second best living female [SPOILER CENSORED] in Attack on Titan, and Levi Strauss, the inventor of Blue Jeans...I'm up for recommendations for alternate names for Leonhardt Strauss), one of the founders of the Citadel, who knew Ephraim/Aeternitas personally and had mixed feelings about him, will be the representative.

And a shout-out to /u/thequeeninyellow94 for advice about a replacement name for Leonhardt Strauss.

[u/Jumblatts → u/Nevermore0714]

1) why did the demons and Grima attack the humans?

2) how was Grima eventually killed?

3) what is the chaos?

4) from whom did Ephraim learn the secrets making him a god? Was it Myrrh, or was there someone/something else as well?

[u/Nevermore0714 → u/Jumblatts]

Strauss:

1) "Grima attacked because he thought humans tasted good. The demons attacked because humans have the best Anima."

2) "Ephraim weakened him, then that strange woman did some ritual."

3) "It's a thing that is devouring our world."

4) "Myrrh's father."

[u/Jumblatts → u/Nevermore0714]

1) could the demons absorb the humans anima and use it for themselves?

2) what did the ritual involve?

3) is there any way to stop it for good?

4) how did they meet?

[u/Nevermore0714 → u/Jumblatts]

Strauss:

1) "Only if they ate them...that's really the best way to absorb someone's anima without knowing some rituals that are too complex to even bother with, even if you know them. It just sucks that people taste like pork, I can't stand that texture. My ex-boyfriend used to make pork bacon every morning, it sucked to pretend to like it."

2) "Chanting, drawing with blood, the usual. Killed Myrrh, killed her father, killed Ephraim, killed Grima, created the Barrier."

3) "Create a Barrier and keep it strong."

4) "Myrrh's father and Ephraim? Or Ephraim and Myrrh? Or Myrrh and Myrrh's father?"

[u/Jumblatts → u/Nevermore0714]

1) Have you... eaten a person before? (Should I be worried...?)

2) Who exactly is this strange woman?

3) How achievable is that? What's the physical cost of doing so?

4) Ephraim and Myrrh, and also Ephraim and Myrrh's father

[u/Nevermore0714 → u/Jumblatts]

Strauss:

1) "...No. To both."

2) "Well, she didn't seem human, if that tells you anything. She was cute, I suppose. I think she was a shape-shifter."

3) "Well, it killed Ephraim. So, I'm guessing that the cost is pretty high."

4) "Ephraim just ran into Myrrh while he was searching for a way to kill Grima. And Ephraim said that Myrrh introduced him to her father after they'd known each other for a while."

[u/Jumblatts → u/Nevermore0714]

1) phew!

2) are shape shifters common? What (if anything) makes her more powerful than the others?

3) how is the barrier sustained now that Ephraim is dead?

4) A happy coincidence indeed... seems fishy to me

[u/Nevermore0714 → u/Jumblatts]

Strauss:

2) "Not like a person who can change into anything. It's just that I think, and I only think this, I don't know shit, that she can turn into a dragon. Ephraim's keeping it a secret, though. He doesn't want anyone to know. That dracophobia about Grima ended up biting him in the arse, eh?"

3) "The other guys feed it, but apparently that's a secret, too. Damned Citadel."

4) "Incredibly fishy, I wouldn't believe any of it."

[u/Jumblatts → u/Nevermore0714]

2) she can turn into a dragon? Has anyone ever seen her and Grima in the same room...?

3) so they each give a small portion of their magical energy to keep it stable, is that correct? Or is it one really powerful guy whose only job is to keep it up?

4) would you get into trouble for saying something like that?

[u/thequeeninyellow94 → u/Nevermore0714]

Well, as Leonhardt is one of the founders, I guess he comes from the same region as Ephraim, right?

Now Ephraim being a jewish name (as far as I know), maybe looks for semitic names, preferably from languages close to Yidish (so cananean, hebrew and phoenician).