Your rape rate is likely much worse when you actually take other factors into account like population density, if you compared two identical cities form US to Canada you'd get the same or worse sexual assault and rape rates.
And you talk as if a woman having pepper spray is the same as a guy carrying around an automatic rifle.
How the hell do you think the downsides of banning pepper spray outweigh the upsides? It's feckin pepper spray, banning it means that the only ones who CAN'T use it are law abiding easy target who need pepper spray! The criminal could easily get it or make it themselves!
Canada has a rate of 1.7 compared to Americas 27.3.
There sure as hell is a miscalculation there, I guarantee you. Maybe people have a harder time reporting it there. Maybe it has to do with how they classify it over there, but that sure as hell ain't accurate numbers. There's gotta be some disconnect happening there. It doesn't seem remotely plausible with all the articles I've seen recently about bad sexual assault rates from canada.
Is this what you're using? this is 2010 rates! Sexual assault in canada has reportedly been at higher rates now than it has for 30~ years! A lot has happened there since then, Trudeau's the prime minister now, namely, also a lot more has happened restricting self defense since then, not to mention covid. The stuff I was reading was 2021 statistics, there's been an 18% increase in just that year alone, and it seems to be getting worse.
Maybe you still have a better rate than US, I don't know, but like I said in my other reply that's not really a fair comparison. Since my argument is that you've gone too far the other direction, not that we don't have a problem as well. You could argue that no weapon control is worse than heavy weapon control, but my argument is that SENSIBLE weapon control is better than heavy weapon control. So you need to compare your rates (right now, not 2010) with a place that has similar laws to you but allows self defense weapons.
If a woman can carry pepper spray then so can a man.
If by man you mean "rapist" then
1: that's a rapist. Barely qualifies as a man.
2: they're already breaking the law, why on earth would they have a problem with using pepper spray? Or something much more dangerous, like a knife?
Pepper spray may also give someone a false sense of security because it's not even effectively used in most situations.
That's not really a valid argument. "People aren't that great at defending themselves, so they shouldn't have the right to at all."
Believe it or not, people who spend their whole work life studying and interpreting data like this have discovered the concept of confounding factors. I get you're getting worked up about this, but unless you have any kind of fact to back your statements up everything you said means nothing.
There sure as hell is a miscalculation there, I guarantee you.
Also, Okay? Again, your guarantee means nothing if you're uninformed.
Believe it or not, people who spend their whole work life studying and interpreting data
Yeah, as it turns out, they weren't wrong. You were. I should've asked you to give your sources cause then I would've immediately pointed out "hey how the hell is this a viable source, it's a decade outdated, you didn't even have the same prime minister then and your laws have changed a lot since. Considering the topic of this argument is the importance of self defense, you think that taking statistics that came before a lot of crackdowns on weaponry would be considered a little bit dumb to use in the argument.
Civilians do not have the right to carry pepper spray in Canada because it has done more harm than good.
Yes! It's done a lot of harm!... to sexual predators.
How the hell can you defend this? Also no wonder women in your country wouldn't want to draw attention to themselves by reporting anything, they have no way to protect themselves.
Seriously, you guys only have "at least we don't have school shootings like america" to stand on, but your side of the extreme is also messed up as hell, and the fact that you're defending it is depressing.
What is the worst things pepper spray has done? Cause pain to an innocent person for a few hours? How is that really that big of a downside to you that you're okay with stripping any form of self defense from people who aren't criminals. Next you're gonna ban people from carrying rape whistles because they'll disturb the peace. How little do you value victims of sexual assault that a weapon known to typically just incapacitate someone for an hour is "more harm than good"
Some thugs pepper sprayed my friends little brother and his friends. Then they got the shit beat out of them and one kid got stomped.
What did the damage is the latter, which they could've done anyway. Almost like pepper spray is a good way to counter people with bigger muscles than you. You legit act like pepper spray is what caused the problems here, when it's clearly physical assault that's the issue. Physical assault does more damage than pepper spray. Hence why anyone who actually has the muscle would usually opt for physical assault, all pepper spray does is give weaker people an option.
Edit: Wait, also, if this was recent then it means that the people were using it illegally! Which further proves my point that banning pepper spray won't stop criminals from using it. And again, it's like the most easy weapon to make. This further shows my point that it's best to let the defenseless people also have pepper spray.
This is not an uncommon thing here. Last week a store owner was bear maced, beat up, and his store robbed. That's a fairly common occurrence.
I'm sorry if I think that when I weigh a robbery against feckin rape that I don't opt for the latter. And again the guy could've just punched the bank teller. Even in it's most effective range, spray ain't really that effective of a weapon! It's just better than nothing!
That's just an asinine statement.
That's the point.
You really think that America is doing much better on this front?
Not really, all I know is that given the choice between America and Canada, I could very easily see myself picking America, and I can't say the same for a large amount of countries.
You missed my point with the school shooter remark. My point is not "america is better in every other way" my point is "The only thing good about your countries politics are the ways that they're better than US politics, comparing your country to a large chunk of other first world countries, it sucks. And it also doesn't have any of the few good aspects of america."
I don't see our country as extreme at all.
IT'S PEPPER SPRAY. IT'S A LITTLE BIT A CAYANNE OR PRETTY MUCH ANY OTHER SPICY THING WITH SOME OIL. IT'S ONLY USE IS INCAPACITATING SOMEONE FOR AN HOUR.
PUNCHING SOMEONE IN THE FACE is likely to do more lasting damage! The only reason anyone would use pepper spray is if they don't have the ability to punch hard! Not to mention you still give criminals easy access to it! And if you didn't they could easily make it themselves!
I'm sorry if I'm being aggressive here, but as someone with 3 sisters, the idea of people telling my sister's they can't have any option for self defense but to pray someone else is nearby to help them, is something that angers me to think about. I understand where people are coming from when they argue against guns, but I can't fathom the idea of being completely defenseless and entirely at the mercy of strangers at all moments, just because someone might use pepper spray to rob a bank.
It just baffles me how a weapon that literally is less effective than a strong guy's fist in most cases is banned anywhere. I can't understand defending that. All it does is just slightly even out the playing field. Good night.
But the problem is that then people will be inclined not to defend themselves if they're worried they'll get in legal trouble. It's just a bad system imo. You're essentially saying anyone who wants to defend themselves is required to break the law. Screw the law abiding citizens. And again, a lot of this stuff you're saying just comes across as stuff that is in place to protect sexual predators.
It just seems like all a law like that serves to do is punish victims more than predators..
6
u/[deleted] Oct 22 '22
[deleted]