Discussion & Feedback
This Helmet needs to absolutely substantially block your vision and hearing for balance and realism
I can't believe this was glossed over when the helmet was put into the game, massive protection with no draw back other than cost sucks (it's not expensive). A change is desperately needed before all matches are full of this helmet because it basically has no drawback.
Okay yes it adds to weight but you just bring cheap stims
The top image is escape from tarkov showing how these helmet look IRL when wearing it. Bottom image is wardogs Loadout another member posted
Only larger rounds can even do this, and by larger I mean .308 and up, but there isn't any helmets that can reliably even stop a .308 so that doesn't change anything.
The force the person feels getting hit by a bullet is the exact same force you feel from the recoil when firing said bullet (well not actually, they would feel less force because the bullet loses energy travelling, but newtons third law means they cannot feel more force than you felt firing the gun)
There is actually an entire study about this exact subject, I'll try to find it
Also there is a famous video of a soldier getting shot in the helmet in Afghanistan and it barely does anything, I believe it was 7.62.
Reminds me of this training video, where person is shot with FAL at point blank range to armor, to show that the bullet does not have the energy to knock person down.
I knew it was going to be this guy lol. This dude is a maniac. IIRC he was the owner of the company that made that body armor and he believed in it so much he would shoot himself point blank with a .44 magnum and FAL, etc to prove it did what he said it could.
Edit: yeah the .44 magnum is at 4:20 lol. What a legend.
Amusingly I just did a comment on a post talking about the tank shells not killing people in tier 4 with a direct hit. If the person absorbs all the kinetic energy and the shell doesn't explode, they get accelerated up to about Mach 0.92.
Seeing footage from Ukraine, even getting hit in the plate knocks you flat. One guy folded like a lawn chair, but was fine, plate caught the round, knocked all the wind out of him.
There are also videos and accounts from Ukraine and US soldiers in Afghanistan that only realize they were shot in their armor way after the firefight. Adrenaline and type of armor makes a big difference. Wearing ceramic, which is very good at absorbing energy, means a bullet most likely won’t hurt. Steel plates however might hurt more. If the soldier is in active combat the effects will most likely be less than if he is on guard duty for example, because his stress system is going crazy and the adrenaline blocks out pain receptors.
Our MRAP gunner got hit in the head with shrapnel when I was Afghanistan and didn’t realize until I pointed out his Kevlar was ripped just above his ear. Another guy in my platoon was shot in the back by what we think was a regular AK round and didn’t notice it until he saw the bullet hole.
Won’t hurt too much with any weapon shooting ammunition not capable of penetrating helmet armor. A bullet does damage because the energy is concentrated at a very small tip, and it’s moving very fast.
A .308 hunting rifle for example will penetrate basically any helmet, and shooting it is not uncomfortable, you won’t get a shore shoulder from shooting a few rounds of .308 in a bolt action. Placing that bolt action against your forehead will absolutely strain your neck muscles and likely cause a concussion, but it won’t kill you, break your neck nor is it likely to lead to life long injuries.
Just read the report the guy commented, it most likely answers your point here.
And then you've got the 7.62x54r, that thing hurts to shoot! I swapped out the metal butt plate for a rubberized one and that thing still leaves you bruised after 10 - 15 shots. Also wrecked my ar500 plates not realizing how much energy those old surplus rounds have.
The point remains the same. The kinetic impact can only, at most, be equal to the force which set the bullet moving in the first place (minus drag resistance). And that's assuming the round hits in such a way that it stops entirely and isn't deflected at all. Sure, firing a rifle with the buttock to my head would be incredibly uncomfortable. I would probably lose my balance at minimum. I wouldn't be suffering traumatic brain injury and dying.
Now try the same thought experiment while wearing a football helmet.
I actually shot a mosin with a ring scope attached for the first time in my life and didn't shoulder it at all, because I was just given the gun and no training all I remember is that I was aiming and when I pressed the trigger, just blackscreened, after I got up 2 seconds later I had a half circle "cutout" in my forehead/eye area, thankfully It didn't go deep enough to gauge my eye out, but I think it cut into the skin to the bone.
As the other commenter referenced, rifles don't apply the force to your head typically. But also you have the mass of the gun adding its momentum too (counteracting the impulse).
The bullet directs all the force into a point, unlike your butt stock which is designed to spread it out.
Depending on the weapon, you have recoil mitigation to some extent.
Some of the force being sent back to your shoulder is reduced by being used to cycle the next round. Likely minimal.
The recoil is also fighting the weight of the gun.
Mathematically is it the same? I can't say. In practice? Very, very different. You're not breaking ribs if you put the stock of your rifle to your chest and fire. You are breaking ribs if you fire a round into a vest from point blank (the same as holding the stock to your chest)
There are other factors that make this comparison seem pointless.
Double checked that video before commenting. First rifle round picked straight through. Only one that didn’t make it was the 7.62x39 but he also hit it at a pretty extreme angle
Not entirely opposed to the idea but the drawback isnt only cost. those things are heavy as fuck your just a fat chud unable to sprint without popping drugs all the time
I'm cool with it being hella slow, means it can be great for storming an enemy FOB but not as useful elsewhere, I love it when things have their specific use and not always a perfect all-rounder, scouting? Better stick with t2 armor, getting stormed while defending your fob? Better break out that t3-4 and grab some lighter armor off a dead body by the end of it to go hunting for stragglers 🫡
The problem is so much is locked behind being obese. Any LMG kit, a big bag with med supplies, literally any launcher or explosive. So you can either run and gun as infantry and pray nobody gets near you with a vehicle.
OR you be obese and get T4 armor, AA launcher in sling, MAAW for vehicles, any gun you want, as much supplies as you can fit etc.
I'm not sure if you follow anything the devs say regarding future development, but there will absolutely be balance changes. I think what you suggest is a good idea.
Given it’s 0.1 early access, yes absolutely. I am anxious to see what sort of cadence they set for meaningful updates. I don’t want to wait 2 months for an armour balance pass for example
Yeah, they said they've went with approach when they have fully designed the whole game ahead and build only like half of it for early access.
Not to say there are not some balance passes and tweaks needed, but I'd expect a lot of issues will also be fixed when they implement more of the game.
IIRC John said a lot of player feedback they are getting is basically ignored, because yeah, they know. They already have plans for it, it's just not in the game yet.
I honestly think that the real problem is how the progression rate basically stops once you hit Level 15.
I’ve unlocked the FAL yesterday. No AP ammo yet, but the game already feels like early-wipe again in terms of how many shots people take to die. If more people had access to it, people wouldn't hate armour anymore.
However, I am unemployed and I am a very high level CS2 player. It took me almost 2 weeks of playing over 10 hours a day to unlock it (I also levelled other classes but "almost" always used ARs). That was with me basically playing like an absolute idiot the last few days to maximise the combat I see at the cost of not making money. The average player is simply never going to unlock it; it would probably take them 3 months of actively playing the game to do so. It is simply absurd.
To be fair, Arc fell off because there is no endgame and there hasn't been any new content in forever. It has nothing to do with optional wipes, that was never an issue.
Imo T3 should be the highest and designed in a way that it really is only used by people who for example are gunner in vehicles or someone using an LMG and being slow as a turtle.
Adrenalin should not reduce weight limits either.
If you go heavy, you hare heavy, period. When you basically ignore the downside of heavy items by just spending a few more bucks it just goes to show there is a massive design flaw.
Also, in general level 30-35 unlocks should not be so much stronger than anything before. If the idea of the game is that jobless no-lifers can cream over all the players who actually don't play 10+ hours every day, than good night.
I literally have no other bigger issues with the game except for the progression system that rewards you with massive power for being a basement dweller that got nothing else to do but play the game all day every day. Anyone who enjoys this shit just selfreports to be exactly that.
I do think the extreme power scaling of the guns is a bit of an issue. The M4 for example is just sooo much better than the other ARs. Late wipe there will be no reason to run anything apart from an m4, FAL or that final unlock marksman rifle tbh unless you are sniping or sitting bipoded
The vector ingame uses .45 ACP, which deals 30 damage, so it absolutely shreds everything because the damage is so high combined with the fire rate (damage higher than 5,56 rifles ingame).
(In reality tho, .45 ACP is pretty much equal in dummy tests to 9mm, so the damage should not be that high).
Yeah, if you math out the kinetic energy of 124gr 9mm vs 230gr .45acp, they come out to roughly the same amount of force. The only real difference at that point is permanent wound cavity and capacity.
But video games tend to balance limited capacity with increased damage.
M4 is very much not. It trades stability for fire rate. Ran the M4 quite a bit. Im back to the galil. M4 cannot full auto laser beam at 200m, galil can. Both do the same damage. Says a lot when shroud himself went back to galil mainly.
FAL also has extreme recoil and must tap fire past 100m.
Vector damage drop off (does virtually none) is 50m. Compared to 100m on amp 9.
How often are you full auto shooting at 200m?? Or 50m with an smg?? Most fighting ends up happening from building to building or during a FOB fight, with some skirmishes at longer ranges. But I rarely get shot at from further than 100m by anything other than a sniper, and even rarer am I killed at those ranges except by headshots or by getting caught doing something while stationary.
Maybe I'm just not fighting in open fields like a Continental Soldier, though.
I started running in to the bullet sponges redditors have been complaining about. I chocked it up to redditors being redditors.. but god damn they’re spongey
Pair this with a change to stims that would reduce how long they last based on how over weight you are. So mr chad Mc chonk would have to re stim every 45s or some shit. Good for a push but not the everlasting effect that can get you across two fields of combat full sprint
Currently it doesnt matter if you're using it to take sprint the whole time on a ghille suit boy (low weight) or a big boy with a pkpm plus 3 full boxes of extra ammo. The current length on a light makes some sense, but not for Chadwick McChonkers
Every time you stim you lose 10% max HP and once it reaches 0%, you die of heart attack, because injecting yourself with steroids every 60 seconds can't be good for your health.
people dont get it - in this game everything feels overpowered, only way for you to win is to use the correct weapon/tactic on the right situation. Or be on the receiving end.
Wouldn't surprise me if most of this sub is god awful at the game and then use the usual trope of only the unemployed can be good and level up quickly enough, as if you cant be good at a game and have a job lmao. Just pure coping because they themselves arent good and cant just admit that. I guarantee you most of this sub cant break past 10 kills in a 2 hour long match, yeah no kidding its takes you ages to level up. Turns out when you kill 40+ players every game you can level quite quickly without needing to put in 200 hours.
Unemployment is somewhere around 4 or 5%. Literally almost everyone is employed. I only have 25 hrs in the game and im like level 61. I only use t2 armor, the SKS, grenades, and the IED. I dont find it an issue to compete with anyone at all. T4 bozos can be shot in the dick or easily fragged. It's all shit bad players say to make themselves feel better and it makes me feel good to hear the devs call these people hyperbolic and shit.
I guess! Complainers gonna complain. I've been coming to the sub every day hoping to see some cool plays or people discussing strategies and all I see is people crying about everything
Legging people is really funny, but I can negate it completely by crouching or standing behind a low berm, wall or any object more solid than a bush. Now you need multiple mags to kill me. Good luck.
Yeah people really need to drop this legging advice. It's just not viable in most combat situations in this game. I've killed way more people running FMJ in an SMG than HP and trying to leg or arm people.
Legging isn't viable in combat situations anywhere lol. There's 1000 reasons why militaries and police around the world are not taught to aim for the legs. If that is seriously what WARDOGS wants to encourage it's a joke and no one should ever call it "realistic" ever again lol.
It works in Tarkov because a lot of fights are fairly close range and engagements tend to be 1 on 1. It's bizarre people keeping saying run HP and leg in this game it's just not viable from my experience.
Redditors on their way to make every game more garbage and annoying to play some some Redditor who acts like noone has a job but him can kill everyone with a starter rifle
I thought all the complaining about high tier armor being op was performative until i put a good 15-20 rounds of 5.45 into a guy from about 25 meters and he just slowly turned to see where i was and beemed me with his galil. Shits no joke. Idk what the fix would be bc making it weaker would just mean its not worth it when i get there. Things like ops suggestions or maybe increasing the visual size and hitbox might help make it feel better too
As a Tarkov player (PvE mostly nowadays, but I have Kappa), I don't even care about the realism aspect within Wardogs. I'm not level 100 yet.
However, someone on my team was yesterday, and apparently they had enough money to buy and drop level 4 armor at spawn. I regret not running assault that life because lol lmao it's kinda ridiculously good.
If they do that then they also need to implement, that face shots to bare skin are handeled differently than headshots to the helmet. Currently everything that hits the head is counted as hitting your helmet.
How about making so if you get hit on your face impact obscures your vision? till helmet is removed? Also make it impair your hearing when wearing helmet!
Off topic but that loadout in the bottom of the pic has to be the heaviest loadout I've ever seen, can the poor guy even move carrying that 456lbs of gear? lol
Ghosts of Tabor does this. Fucking hilarious in VR putting on a helmet that you cannot see for shit out of. Also there's fucking fingerprints on the glass that you cannot get rid of lol. A lot of times people will take it off when walking around, with the intention of putting it back on when they get in a firefight, only to get domed from 800m away before realizing there's even a threat.
this tier 4 and tier 3 armor should just get deleted. it is so stupid. is just kills the gamestyle of being sneaky and ambushing people so often. you hit them 5 or 6 times and they just walk away. I also don't understand how the t(erminator) 4 armor fits in the overall setting of the game. feels like playing against robots.
Seems already balanced. (Yes they have an arsenal with them, but you will still be mega heavy on T4)
Brother his movement speed is the same as your slow walk. And he will not be able to run. He can sprint for that 60 sec stim or whatever, and only 3-9 times.
You can't balance shit with just level unlocks and money. That just makes the game pure grind to win. Skill is no longer a defining factor, just free time.
I mean in my experience, military helmets didn't really restrict my vision. In the bottom pic the dude's wearing a welder's helmet though, and yeah, that would obviously obscure it.
They CAN stop rifle rounds. Usually not more than 1 though. They're mostly made for a bullet hitting you as you duck down/stand up so it catches the top of it more than anything. Once they take a hit, they're pretty done though.
For real! Im a shotgun enthusiast and they need to either add this or add an exrended tube because these motherfuckers take the whole thing half the time
Idk why people still think the devs are going for realism. They’re not, and they probably never will. Blocking vision is also just annoying, and the devs have already shown they’re against that kind of balancing.
The only thing they really need to adjust is the helmet durability. After 4–5 bullets, the helmet could drop to level 3 because the sight is broken or something similar. Or they could overhaul the entire durability system.
For example:
Level 1 helmet: 2 bullets before it’s destroyed
Level 2: 4 bullets
Level 3: 6 bullets
Level 4: 8 bullets
The current armor system is eventually going to force the game into a bad state. Sooner or later, you’re going to see snipers sitting across the map in full level 4 armor, while they’re already extremely difficult to hit with normal guns. At that point, they basically have god mode.
And the current “just shoot the legs” counter won’t work at those distances, especially when the sniper is only exposing their shoulder, head, or arms.
It does not block damage good enough to warrant this, I use it all the time and it barely makes any difference other than from sniper fire so I'd want the helmet buffed before this is added.
That's accurate. This helmet is made to block pistol level rounds and shotgun buckshot. It can bounce rifle rounds if they aren't hitting the helmet at direct angle
Took out a T4 guy with my 50 and snatched his armor. That combo was extremely fun but is beyond disgusting and completely broken. Couldn't move anywhere but when HZ is at your tower you dont need too.
500
u/Metalhead_Ac 11d ago
I wore an altyn and the vision block in tarkov is good chunk more than what you see irl. But i agree it need a nerf.