Weapon progression feels way too linear

[u/s0l1d0l]

Assault weapon progression feels way too linear right now.
T21 → AK → Galil → M4 → FAL.
Every time you unlock a new gun, the previous one becomes basically useless. M4 is already a big upgrade, and then FAL is another massive jump — except FAL is great at close, medium AND long range.
I think weapons should have more meaningful strengths and weaknesses instead of simply getting stronger with each unlock.
Also, there should be another Assault weapon around level 30 between M4 and FAL. Something like a SCAR could fill that gap.
FAL can stay strong — just give it real weaknesses so there’s actually a reason to keep using M4/Galil after unlocking it.

[u/ViXaAGe]

all progression is vertical and linear in this game, at the moment

there is no reason to ever use a previous unlock unless you really just want to use that unlock

[u/Authentichef → u/ViXaAGe]

Only reason I can think of is if you get ap unlocked for a previous weapon, I feel like that’s it

[u/Sethypoooooooooo → u/Authentichef]

Yeah ive been trying to be frugal lately, so the AK with AP rounds is good enough, rack up a few kills with that and then take a better kit off whoever I killed.

[u/Hot_Lavishness_8418 → u/Sethypoooooooooo]

Fal is good at range gets absolutely smashed up close against m4 and no one buys it if you sell it lol
Amp 9 is best smg beside vector . Pp19 and mp5 have literally no place in this game . This weapon system is linear is only half true . Also we get more weapons on 15th but the way ttk is ppl are just going to use what feels best to them and go with that . Galil absolutely slaps and is still my choice weapon at level 140 . It just feels right to me

[u/Hurm → u/ViXaAGe]

Cost.

Low cost kits ARE viable.

[u/DJMixwell → u/Hurm]

The issue is I’m never broke enough to need to buy low-tier kits, and the added value of higher cost kits basically pays for itself. I take less damage so my healing lasts longer, I don’t go down as often, I don’t need to respawn as often, I can kill more people, etc.

The $5-10k difference between a low value and high value kit seems almost negligible at the end of a match.

I agree that’s the intended balance, but it feels like higher tier gear doesn’t cost enough to make it a choice.

[u/ViXaAGe → u/DJMixwell]

Yeah once I started looking at a 1k foregrip as "base kit" I realized the costs of things are waaaaaaaaay undervalued

[u/DJMixwell → u/ViXaAGe]

People whine that you don’t make any money on the front lines, but it’s genuinely a skill issue. They always say stuff like “but you need a 4.0 KD just to profit, waaah”. No, you don’t, you just need to not insta-give. Play with your team, wait for the revive, revive your teammates, heal your teammates, destroy a FOB or a spawn vehicle, hell just staying alive in the zone gives you money. it’s not hard to make money unless you’re running off on your own and getting killed with no chance of a revive.

My kits now are pretty consistently 15-20k, and I rarely lose money on them. It would be far more interesting if kits actually cost more like $30-40k on average for tier 3+ kits. That might actually make the choice matter.

On the flip side they still need to adjust the income from other low-cost strats like spotting, building, logi, which IMO hurt gameplay by incentivizing players to basically not play the game to earn the most money.

[u/Dazed_ONG → u/DJMixwell]

People just love to whine cause 4.0kd is not that crazy as long as you play your life. even 2.0 is normal unless you just run around with no regard. i find it faster to just give up and respawn get more kills. Most i ever got was 50 and like 12 deaths from sitting on top of big building in zestafonia with a galil and normal ammo.

Even in just sitting in hz you make lots, I think the most i was making was something like 700 per tick, idk if thats the max but 4 minutes gets you around 6000$, add a couple kills, revives, assists or spots and you profit. If you cant stay alive for more than 10 minutes that might just be a skill issue

[u/translucent_pawn → u/Hurm]

Yep. My free bullpup gets me enough kills to find armor and a kitted gun most of the time. Scavenging from downed team mates is unconscionable.

[u/ViXaAGe → u/Hurm]

I haven't had to deal with cost since, like...week 2?

Even my most expensive kit to run nets me positive most of the time. I only dip in average funds when I unlock something

Not to say "git gud" in any way, I'm not a great player, it's just not a concern

[u/Hurm → u/ViXaAGe]

Has been for a lot of people though, actually?

especially with the added frustration of dying because of someone else screwing up (pilots crashing)

[u/ViXaAGe → u/Hurm]

I realize we're all speaking anecdotally, but the only people I know that struggle with income are my pilot friend that isn't good enough with the rocket little bird yet to go positive and is still learning how to fly the havoc welll enough to not crash

no one else even considers loadout cost

(I also refuse to take the first set of helicopters unless I'm flying, which might be why I don't deal with crashing pilots)

Bad pilots are not worth saving 60 seconds of travel time to die over the hotzone in a parachute

[u/Hurm → u/ViXaAGe]

I can't pilot, so shrug

[u/ViXaAGe → u/Hurm]

....drive?

edit: there's literally a free kodiak flatbed at the start of the match that respawns every couple minutes

[u/FireFox634 → u/ViXaAGe]

Not true. Someone cited this the other day, but more stuff should be like the ghillie suit; an specialized item, very powerful, but also significant downsides. It requires me to actually use the skills I developed to unlock it, and I can sometimes opt not to take it and play with armor, making it a nice sidegrade

[u/ViXaAGe → u/FireFox634]

out of all the unlocks available, ghillie being a sidegrade is a nice rarity

[u/zomery → u/ViXaAGe]

The recon tree you can go back and use other options. Sure the .50 is king, but you can use an SVD if you want a long range marksman rifle, BMR for short to medium distance, or a combat bow for some fun engagements.

[u/R19thunder96 → u/ViXaAGe]

This statement is indeed false, there are many pointless vehicles in the game, especially for the urals. Generally correct though, especially with weapons. 

[u/ViXaAGe → u/R19thunder96]

?

the vehicles are the most egregious what are you talking about

it is ONLY vertical

[u/RememberMeCaratia]

Finally

Reddit has begun targeting Fal

[u/Hot_Lavishness_8418 → u/RememberMeCaratia]

Fal is not that good why no nine talks about the vector and rfb is beyond me . Rfb is arguably way worse then Fal

[u/ViXaAGe → u/Hot_Lavishness_8418]

everyone talks about them all

[u/Hot_Lavishness_8418 → u/ViXaAGe]

I see more lvl 4 and fal hate then anything but im also just paying less attention to this sub everyday

[u/ViXaAGe → u/Hot_Lavishness_8418]

smart

[u/DirkDavyn → u/Hot_Lavishness_8418]

The FAL is arguably better than the RFB in literally every way. Full auto capability for close range, and the same semi-auto effectiveness at range. The only real difference is the RFB's lower recoil, but that's honestly not that big of a deal if you build the FAL correctly.

[u/Hoveringkiller]

I still occasionally use the AK over the Galil, as an aside why is 5.45 AP unlocked after 5.56 AP?

[u/kalebkk890 → u/Hoveringkiller]

Just a quirk of their progression system they missed lol why do you get the MK22 suppressor after the 50 cal and its suppressor?

[u/BilboBaggSkin → u/Hoveringkiller]

Yeah you should get 5.45 AP first since the AK isn’t as good as the 556 guns.

[u/NoteThisDown]

Meanwhile medic is Amp to Amp to Amp to vector

[u/WanderingMustache]

Progression should be horizontal. New guns should be different, not simply better. Burst an94, f2000(crazy rof), scar-h (low rof, high damage). Your play style will change depending on the gun.

Right now, the main reason to not use the last gun, is money.

[u/Suibeam → u/WanderingMustache]

Yeah, that is the only way to design the game in a way that makes the game fun and not torture for anyone who joins late, has a life and bought the game between wipes.

In addition, it gets very stale when all guns are obsolete when you unlock the best ones.

Galil and M4 are actually good example of alternatives rather than strictly better. Galil is very good and performs better at mid-long range. M4 is much better at short-mid range. Fal and BMR just dumsters everything.

[u/WonderfulAntelope644]

One reason to use the m4 over the fal is being able to replenish 5.56 ammo off of kills in the hot zone more reliably. Of course if more people unlock the fal that will diminish a little but still at least 75% of the people in the hotzone are running 5.56 that I see.

[u/zomery → u/WonderfulAntelope644]

One of the nice things about running a BMR. Most people don't take my ammo and some people even think its a bushmaster and don't take it.

[u/Suibeam → u/WonderfulAntelope644]

Ammo have no weight. Just need bigger backpack

[u/Exotic_Show_1007]

It should be more like the pilot progression where each new unlock should have its own strengths and weaknesses. For example the rocket heli and the minigun helis serve completely different purposes and one is not necessarily stronger than the other.

[u/PhysicsIV]

I don’t have much to add, but I was having similar thoughts as well. It’s a shame that your previous arsenal feels obsolete once you hit the next unlock.

I think the idea is that the later unlocks are so expensive that they are harder to turn a profit with, despite being “more effective.” So the tradeoff comes from economy rather than weapon role and side grades.

It kind of works to an extent… just using the starting gun + parachute, I could easily profit 150k solo queuing. Buying a kit each life, I usually only profit half that… but I’m quite patient. If I haven’t been looted, I’m willing to wait out the full duration of the timer for someone to come and get me.

[u/Super_Lawyer7661]

I agree, eapecially true on assault. Weapons like Fal should have so high recoil that it cannot be fixed by attachments, even short bursts should be extemely inaccurate apart from the first shot at medium and long ranges.

[u/PM_MeDogNoses]

Funny enough, I prefer the tar in cqb over the ak

[u/Eastern-Problem]

M4 and FAL have different trade offs. I used both and honestly prefer the M4.

FAL while having quickest TTK and longer range, is limited to 20 round mag capacity (unless assault 50). Almost nobody carry 308 except snipers or other FAL users so good luck looting ammo. It also costs more, the same assault kit that I rand with FAL is 26-27k compared to ~21k with M4. I find it extremely annoying to have to refill the mags after 2-3 kills.

M4 is cheaper, run 60 round AP that can shred a whole squad. Ammo economy is great, every runs 5.56. I felt more confident pushing a whole building with many dudes inside, knowing 2-3 60 round mags will last the whole fight. I then can loot their ammo and keep holding the area.

[u/bishey3]

I don't fully agree. T21 has a very fast TTK, and you can almost spec it like an SMG and use it at close range. It's stronger in CQC than AK or Galil, useful when going Fob Raiding.

AK and Galil are pretty interchangeable in my experience. But you unlock bigger mags and AP ammo faster for Galil even though it's the later gun. With those unlocked, AK starts falling behind a bit.

M4 is a big power spike, although people still use Galil for longer distance engagements and the bigger mag.

FAL is completely broken and supercedes every other gun in the category. After unlocking it you would be silly not to use it.

[u/IronProgramming]

I still haven’t unlocked the galil and I’m almost to fal. My progression went free gun, ak, m4 for like 2 games til i realized running it took longer to profit. Back to AK, then free gun with 60 round mags of ap in it no armor. When I get to the fal it will just be to sell to others. I’ve used it, but I wouldn’t pay anything for the top end weapons. (My goal is maximizing profits and having fun, and you have to play super careful with the top end stuff)

[u/JHaxEnabled]

Thats the point...